Time  Nick                 Message
01:11 jcamins_away         cait1: why are you still awake?
01:11 * cait1              hides
01:19 rangi                http://librarianfacts.tumblr.com/
01:19 rangi                @quote get 221
01:19 huginn               rangi: Quote #221: "I used to be sane like you, until I took a MARC data to the knee" (added by chrisc at 09:28 PM, October 23, 2012)
01:20 cjh                  hahaha
01:20 jcamins              lol
01:22 jcamins              Another cait?!?
01:22 cait                 more fun!
04:28 WaylonR              hiya all. SearchMyLibraryFirst ... what is it supposed to do in opac, with no userenv.. i.e no user logged in?
04:53 mtj                  probably nothing
04:54 mtj                  … theres no way for koha to know what your $library is
04:54 mtj                  in that state, currently
05:51 francharb            morning
05:57 mtj                  heya francharb
05:57 wahanui              francharb falls asleep easily at sea.  Don't believe me?  Just ask Brooke.
05:59 francharb            0/ mtj
05:59 mtj                  .. after eating a few of those little hambuger things, and all that walking -  i was feeling pretty sleepy too
05:59 francharb            :)
06:16 tweetbot`            [off] twitter: @ranginui: "The two students working on #kohails finished up for the year today, hope to see them back next year"
06:17 mtj                  hmm, i've got some weird OPAC behaviour with searching for 'available' items, on a koha 3.8.5, using DOM
06:18 mtj                  i get an ERROR from zebrasrv too, doing that search
06:18 mtj                  "19:17:28-26/10 zebrasrv(4) [request] Search biblios ERROR 114 1 1+0 RPN @attrset Bib-1 @and @attr 1=1016 @attr 4=6 @attr 5=1 quest @and @not @attr 1=_ALLRECORDS @attr 2=103 '' @attr 1=8024 @attr 2=103 '' @attr 1=8002 @attr 4=109 @attr 2=3 0"
06:19 mtj                  the same 'availability' search seems to work OK using the old GRS1 stuff
06:19 mtj                  … anyone else spotted this/knows how it fix it, etc?
06:23 mtj                  ive just done a fresh make/make install, so the latest zebra/dom files are def. current
06:24 mtj                  .
06:25 mtj                  or phrased another way… does anyone have a DOM koha, with 'limit to available items' searches working?
06:36 alex_a_              bonjour
06:46 julian_m             hello
07:05 * magnuse            waves
07:12 clrh_                hello
07:12 wahanui              bonjour, clrh_
07:12 magnuse              @wunder boo
07:12 huginn               magnuse: The current temperature in Bodo, Norway is 4.0°C (8:50 AM CEST on October 26, 2012). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 87%. Dew Point: 2.0°C. Windchill: -1.0°C. Pressure: 29.09 in 985 hPa (Steady).
07:23 reiveune             hello
07:23 wahanui              hola, reiveune
07:24 sophie_m             hi #koha
07:24 matts                hi !
07:45 cait                 hi #koha
07:49 magnuse              kia ora cait
07:49 cait                 hi magnuse :)
08:18 drojf                good morning #koha
08:19 cait                 good morning drojf
08:23 drojf                hi cait
08:25 cait                 drojf++ mveron++ and all other translators I might have missed
08:54 mveron               Hi #koha
08:54 cait                 hi mveron!
08:54 cait                 just discovered how far the gemran translation already is
08:54 cait                 that is awesome
08:55 mveron               Thanks :-)  I hope I did not to much mistakes :-)
09:07 magnuse              mistakes can be improved later :-)
09:08 * magnuse            hopes fredericd can figure out the problem with the nb-NO prefs file
09:20 * Oak                waves
09:21 Oak                  magnuse
09:21 Oak                  Guten tag cait
09:22 Oak                  kittens will be fine. yes.
09:23 gerundio             hi everyone, good morning
09:24 magnuse              Oak - gah, not quick enough... :-)
09:24 cait                 hi Oak :)
09:24 gerundio             during a meeting with our faculty librabry coordinator I was told that a Koha community event is going to take place in Portugal, in the capital Lisbon I guess, sometime this year
09:24 gerundio             does anyone has any info on that?
09:24 * magnuse            has not heard about it
09:25 cait                 me neither - maybe there is somethong on the spanish speaking mailing list?
09:25 gerundio             I found this reference online: http://www.koha.pt/?p=60
09:26 cait                 ah, there you go :)
09:26 magnuse              cool
09:37 gerundio             I see is just a Portguese community event
09:38 gerundio             I was hoping it was a more general one :)
09:38 gerundio             well, you won't have the chance to visit sunny Portugal this time
09:38 drojf                which reminds me
09:39 drojf                someone at kohacon wanted to da a european koha thing, maybe in portugal
09:40 magnuse              a EuroKohaCon?
09:42 cait                 hm
09:42 cait                 we shoul dhave one in Germany... it's nice and central... ;)
09:43 magnuse              yay
09:43 magnuse              was that cait volunteering to organize i heard?
09:44 drojf                i am in germany all the time. and southern germany is not central at all :P i vote for northern norway or portugal. or croatia ;)
09:44 cait                 not sure...
09:45 cait                 see that dagger i nmy back...
09:45 drojf                :P
09:45 gerundio             Portugal is nice and an entry point in Europe
09:45 cait                 I hink we have too many countries in europe... we can argue about this forever :)
09:45 * gerundio           was born in Germany too actually :D
09:46 cait                 we should do it in nz again
09:47 drojf                yeah, eurokohacon in nz  \o/
09:47 cait                 heh
09:47 magnuse              lol
09:47 gerundio             cait, I think you want some far away vacation :p
09:47 cait                 it's lovely there, you would like it
09:47 gerundio             I'm sure I would
09:47 magnuse              well, no reason to argue - whoever volunteers to host it first is the winner!
09:47 magnuse              nz++
09:48 gerundio             I'm trying to plan my next long course vacation trip
09:48 gerundio             I was thinking to go to Germany as a matter of fact
09:48 gerundio             it's been almost 30 years since I've left and never got back
09:48 drojf                it's overrated ;)
09:48 cait                 ignore drojf
09:49 cait                 gerundio: du sprichst deutsch? :)
09:49 gerundio             I still have family in Köln
09:49 gerundio             no cait :(
09:49 gerundio             I left at a very young age
09:49 drojf                did you grow up here?
09:49 gerundio             and my parents always talked Portuguese around the house
09:50 gerundio             so I never picked up any German at all
09:50 cait                 ah
09:50 gerundio             drojf, I grew up in Portugal
09:50 cait                 we can teach you :P
09:51 cait                 but... sticking with english is probably a lot easier
09:52 WaylonR              hmm.. kohacon 2013... whats the chances of getting livestream/ustream.tv feeds set up for the talks?
09:53 cait                 I don't know - gues sit depends on the costs and the host
09:53 drojf                WaylonR: ask the hosts?
09:53 gerundio             my parents still speak a little German from time to time
09:53 drojf                would be nice of course
09:53 magnuse              WaylonR: depends on the bandwidth of the venue too, i think
09:54 WaylonR              would be fantastic.
09:54 WaylonR              Since im not able to go for money reasons.
09:55 cait                 :(
09:55 drojf                i wish we could have a stream. it would be so important for all koha users in the european world
09:55 * drojf              hides
09:55 cait                 lol
09:57 WaylonR              And as my org only uses a porton of Koha, may not see the relevance of me going to Con. Also, it would be classed as income, the travel and accom... and nz social security would count it as such, then adjust my benefit for the year accordingly, penalising me for it.
09:57 * WaylonR            idly wonders how much such a trip could cost...
09:58 cait                 this sounds really complicated
09:59 WaylonR              yea, which is the reason most beneficaries don't earn money. Too difficult to manage.
10:01 WaylonR              omg! Reno, Nevada, is a huge place for couch surfing.
10:01 drojf                anyway, we could try to revive that european thing. i remember paul_p and rafael from portugal came to me to talk about it. maybe have a european section on the website and try to have more "local" events, things like that. as long as it is not about fragmenting the community (like having a european google group…) i think that would not be a bad idea
10:01 WaylonR              Couchsurfing = Free accomodation in exchange for.. well.. being yourself.
10:07 gerundio             drojf, community fragmentation is always a risk in those cases, but if I remember it correctly, Drupal pulled it off
10:08 gerundio             from what I can tell their community as events worldwide as is working as one
10:08 gerundio             here are their guidelines http://drupal.org/community
10:10 * WaylonR            nods. "Would love a Koha hackcon in Wellington someday/week.
10:10 WaylonR              Group motivated koha hacking, yeah!
10:10 cait                 it's the best koha hacking :)
10:11 WaylonR              Right now, alone, its hard to get motivated. I got so many tasks to port to current, and so little motivation.
10:11 drojf                we have a regular hackfest in france (organized by biblibre) but apart from that there is not much inner-european stuff going on as far as i can tell. and the hackfest is nothing a "normal" librarian would visit i suppose. there are local workshops of course.
10:11 cait                 hm they had librarians testing last time
10:11 cait                 quite  a lot of them actually
10:11 drojf                ah ok
10:11 cait                 and translating
10:11 wahanui              it has been said that translating is ok of course :)
10:11 drojf                cool
10:11 drojf                i didnt know that
10:12 WaylonR              hackfest?
10:12 wahanui              hackfest is probably slowly seing hackers leaving...
10:12 WaylonR              huh?
10:12 WaylonR              wahanui, forget hackfest
10:12 wahanui              WaylonR: I forgot hackfest
10:12 drojf                still its very nerdy, not something like the "main" kohacon
10:12 cait                 but I guess more the system librarians, having knowledge how to test
10:13 cait                 and I think biblibre helped setting up the servers with patches for them to test
10:13 WaylonR              hackfest is awesome! Group motivated koha hacking is the best koha hacking :)
10:13 WaylonR              hackfest?
10:13 wahanui              rumour has it hackfest is awesome! Group motivated koha hacking is the best koha hacking :)
10:13 WaylonR              thanks cait
10:13 drojf                which reminds me i should write something up about our workshop
10:13 cait                 oh yep
10:18 gerundio             off-topic: is Koha's UI built around any usability guidelines?
10:19 drojf                i like when people feel they have to label their koha-questions "off-topic" in #koha :P
10:20 gerundio             :)
10:20 cait                 gerundio: there are some design patterns
10:20 cait                 and oleonard described them on the wiki
10:20 cait                 but I think that is not exactly what you were asking about?
10:22 gerundio             not really cait, I meant usability for the amblyopic (I hope Google Translator got this one right :p) and color blind for instance
10:23 cait                 ther is a bug to improve accessibility with some ongoig work
10:24 cait                 bug 8712
10:24 huginn               04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8712 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Needs Signoff , We should use WAI-ARIA guidelines to help with accessibility -OMNIBUS bug
10:25 gerundio             nice :)
10:26 gerundio             just yesterday, during that meeting with our library coordinator, I was introduced to this new color codes for colorblind people
10:27 gerundio             from what I can tell it looks like it's going to be big
10:27 gerundio             http://coloradd.net
10:28 gerundio             this new color identification system is already being ported to cloth info tags
10:28 gerundio             our subway system for line identification
10:29 drojf                but is that "the standard" or "one standard"? what is w3c saying about it?
10:30 gerundio             don't really know
10:30 gerundio             take a look at the overall chart http://www.colblindor.com/2010/01/13/coloradd-a-color-coding-system/
10:30 gerundio             don't really know if this as that much publicity close to web developers' communities
10:31 * magnuse            had not seen http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Interface_patterns before
10:32 gerundio             and I don't think it caught w3's eye yet
10:41 gerundio             ok, now the fun part of the meeting
10:41 cait                 hm?
10:41 gerundio             I have some questions to check if I can manage to do some things in Koha
10:43 drojf                ask?
10:43 wahanui              Don't ask to ask, just ask.
10:57 drojf                i suppose he meant to ask his people and not us then?
11:02 magnuse              probably
11:04 magnuse              @later tell jcamins bug 8805 needs a new patch when your new patch on bug 8665 gets pushed, right?
11:04 huginn               magnuse: The operation succeeded.
12:08 jcamins_away         bug 8805
12:08 huginn               04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8805 major, P5 - low, ---, magnus, Needs Signoff , Add a biblio-zebra-indexdefs.xsl for NORMARC
12:08 jcamins_away         bug 8665
12:08 huginn               04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8665 critical, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, Needs Signoff , DOM indexing fails to index some bib records
12:09 jcamins_away         magnuse: yes.
12:10 magnuse              jcamins_away: ok, i'll obsolete my patch
12:10 * jcamins_away       should sign off on 8805 once that happens.
12:11 jcamins              mtj: "Limit to available" doesn't work.
12:11 jcamins              Period.
12:11 jcamins              Not in GRS-1 or DOM.
12:12 magnuse              jcamins: a signoff would be great :-)
12:12 cait                 jcamins: maybe we should hide it :(
12:13 magnuse              sounds like it
12:13 cait                 jcamins: what's the big problem? shouldn't it just limit onloan being something?
12:13 cait                 or not being?
12:14 jcamins              cait: I think we should, yes.
12:14 jcamins              cait: that would make sense, but that's not what it does.
12:15 cait                 :(
12:15 magnuse              fix it or remove it (temporarily), i'd say
12:15 cait                 do I want to ask? probably not
12:15 cait                 I am more for fixing it... but not sure how hard itis
12:15 cait                 it's a popular feature in opacs
12:15 jcamins              cait: very.
12:15 cait                 but can't leave it like it is
12:15 magnuse              jcamins: very popular or very hard to fix?
12:16 jcamins              magnuse: very hard.
12:16 magnuse              :-(
12:17 cait                 :(
12:17 jcamins              It is impossible to make it work with GRS-1, and making it work with DOM will be impractical at least until I've finished the funded parts of the search rewrite.
12:17 cait                 hm
12:17 jcamins              At that point, it will merely be very difficult.
12:17 cait                 so what should it do?
12:17 magnuse              sounds liek we should comment it out in the template until someone gets around to fixing it then
12:18 cait                 limit the search to records, that have at least one entry with onloan being empty?
12:18 cait                 ok, you would kick out electronic and serials this way, but it would do somewhat would you expcet
12:18 jcamins              cait: we can't do that.
12:18 cait                 and what if we said something like... onloan not starting with 2?
12:19 cait                 something stupid?
12:19 jcamins              The best we can do with GRS-1 is limit to records that do not have any checked out items.
12:19 cait                 becuse it has a date... so when there is one onloan field in the record that is not having a date... it would bring it up
12:19 cait                 jcamins: oh?
12:19 cait                 I was thinking about the itemtype limits
12:19 cait                 where is the big difference here?
12:20 jcamins              cait: item types have data.
12:20 cait                 yeah
12:20 cait                 that's why I mant: not have a date
12:20 jcamins              I think changing everything to understand onloan being set to a true value that isn't a date would be just as problematic as fixing the indexes.
12:21 WaylonR              wow.. i would of thougth  that bug was a huge bug... as in critical.
12:21 cait                 WaylonR: I think we agree with you...
12:22 WaylonR              how has libraries, such as HLT, coped without it?
12:22 jcamins              Libraries that only have a single copy of a given book aren't affected.
12:22 cait                 WaylonR: I think most libraires don't notice
12:22 cait                 you wouldn't think that
12:22 cait                 I agre
12:22 cait                 but they don't
12:22 cait                 I never got any bug report about it
12:23 WaylonR              sounds like the librarians never tried the flag.
12:23 WaylonR              and patrons didn't really mind the problem enough to complain.
12:24 jcamins              Exactly.
12:24 WaylonR              or never had the will to complain.. "oh.. huh.. doesn't work. Okay.. hrm."
12:25 WaylonR              Or didn't know who to complain to.
12:25 WaylonR              But sooner or later, someone will notice, someone will complain, and we'll have to have a fix.
12:25 tcohen               morning #koha!
12:26 tcohen               its friday!
12:26 jcamins              Yes, I would love to have it fixed.
12:26 jcamins              I was hopeful it would be fixed as part of the DOM indexing project.
12:26 WaylonR              DOM supports all the features of GRS-1?
12:27 jcamins              And a lot more.
12:29 WaylonR              how difficult is it to convert all the GRS-1 configs, to DOM?
12:29 cait                 that's been done I think
12:29 cait                 the problem is we don't want to convert them the way they are... I guess
12:29 cait                 bcause that means not making use of the dom features we want?
12:30 jcamins              WaylonR: we already did that. It wasn't that hard.
12:31 magnuse              jcamins: is that conversion just a starting point, or will we continue to generate the dom configs from the grs-1 config?
12:31 jcamins              magnuse: just a starting point.
12:31 jcamins              The GRS-1 to DOM script should *never* be run again.
12:31 * WaylonR            has a GRS-1 custom config that i need to convert.
12:32 jcamins              Unless someone has a custom record.abs they want to keep.
12:32 jcamins              Which, granted, is probably going to be pretty common.
12:32 cait                 ah
12:32 WaylonR              custom record.abs, modified bib1.att, and ccl.properties.
12:32 cait                 so I think I misunderstood what you wrote to the list earlier
12:33 WaylonR              so yea.. an automated conversion process would be much appreciated.
12:34 jcamins              WaylonR: you can keep your bib1.att and ccl.properties files.
12:34 WaylonR              ah? dom only replaces record.abs?
12:34 jcamins              Right.
12:34 jcamins              It replaces indexing configuration.
12:35 magnuse              jcamins: "The GRS-1 to DOM script should *never* be run again" --> that is once we start editing and improving the dom config?
12:36 WaylonR              how do i get this GRS-1 to DOM script?
12:36 jcamins              magnuse: right.
12:36 magnuse              jcamins: thanks
12:36 jcamins              Once the configuration has been created and signed off, DOM configs will necessarily start diverging.
12:36 jcamins              WaylonR: misc/maintenance/grs1-to-dom or something like that.
12:37 magnuse              WaylonR: http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=blob;f=misc/maintenance/make_zebra_dom_cfg_from_record_abs;hb=HEAD
12:37 jcamins              That's the one.
12:38 magnuse              this is also involved: http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=blob;f=etc/zebradb/xsl/koha-indexdefs-to-zebra.xsl;hb=HEAD
12:38 jcamins              Right.
12:38 jcamins              koha-indexdefs-to-zebra.xsl is still used.
12:39 magnuse              i followed the two steps at the very bottom here to generate the dom config : http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Switching_to_dom_indexing
12:46 oleonard             Hi #koha
12:47 WaylonR              Oh yeah! my secure search mod works well.
12:48 jcamins              WaylonR: what does it do?
12:48 WaylonR              so, from one koha install, one koha db, one apache server, multiple virtuhosts can equal multiple libraries, and those libraries, unless the user is logged in, will only be able to access their own records.
12:48 jcamins              Oh.
12:48 jcamins              Right.
12:48 jcamins              You told me about this.
12:48 WaylonR              yup
12:49 cait                 hey oleonard :)
12:49 cait                 it's good to see you
12:49 cait                 and your many patches!
12:49 cait                 oleonard++
12:49 jcamins              Now you can submit a patch. :)
12:49 magnuse              @arewethereyet
12:49 huginn               magnuse: Not yet - wait 27 days
12:49 magnuse              ooh...
12:50 gmcharlt             good morning
12:50 cait                 hi gmcharlt :)
12:50 WaylonR              then, once the user is logged in, if they have been given access to other libraries, in secure mode, they are able to search their branch + assigned others, assigned by branchcode extended attributes.
12:50 cait                 we were discussing dom and indexing questions earlier
12:51 cait                 WaylonR: sounds good :) whatabout records with items from mulitple libraries?
12:51 jcamins              My electrical bill is almost reasonable this month.
12:51 jcamins              Well- reasonable for this apartment.
12:51 jcamins              Which is not reasonable at all.
12:51 WaylonR              And, if multiple library searching mode is on, they get the abilty to select via checkboxes on a dropdown, which libraries to do a search on, in advanced search.
12:52 WaylonR              yes, cait.. it searches based on branch:
12:52 WaylonR              so.. that means home branch of an item?
12:52 cait                 do you see the items of other branches on the records? we were discussing ways to limit to the library only at work
12:53 cait                 oh, and records without any items (serials)
12:53 WaylonR              records without any items.. ah.. don't show up.. yeah, didn't think about that.
12:54 WaylonR              not sure how to handle that.
12:54 WaylonR              all our pdfs get given branches to belong to.
12:54 * jcamins            heads into the city.
12:55 WaylonR              and items get automatically created accordingly.
12:55 WaylonR              hmm.. heres an explaination of our library..
12:55 WaylonR              waylon?
12:55 wahanui              waylon is, like, the 33rd developer of Koha, currently working for Mandumah.com, a digital library archive. Hes currently porting koha 3.0 modifications to Koha 3.10
12:56 WaylonR              so... journals have volumes, then issues, then articles.
12:56 WaylonR              so.... we have a journal table, that says what branches a journal belongs to.
12:57 WaylonR              each time we enter a article in, it gets the journal inputted.
12:57 WaylonR              and system creates an item or items in the branches accordingly.
12:57 WaylonR              make sense, cait?
12:58 cait                 hm
12:58 cait                 trying :) but I guess it does :)
13:10 WaylonR              cait, so, in your case... hmm.. yeah, in searches, you'd be restricted to items in your specific branch or branches allocated. But you'd see that they are in other branches you don't have access to.
13:10 WaylonR              since thats an output of XSLT right?
13:10 WaylonR              locations available.
13:10 cait                 hm not strictly only the xslt
13:10 cait                 xslt in results
13:11 WaylonR              right.
13:11 cait                 items table from the database in details
13:11 WaylonR              yes.... but yea.. can't see how to stop users from seeing that other branches exist.
13:11 WaylonR              other than not show them locations available.
13:20 gerundio             ... and back
13:20 gerundio             all universities in Portugal just suffered a internet outage :|
13:22 gerundio             cait, drojf, wahanui still around?
13:22 cait                 yes
13:22 gerundio             lets see if I can post my questions now :)
13:22 gerundio             earlier I was saying that
13:23 gerundio             we have an in-house academic managment system with all our to-be patron details
13:24 gerundio             is it possible to extend the patron's profile with a new attribute who's value would be a contatenation of a fixed URL + an id mapped from LDAP?
13:24 cait                 i am not sure I understand what you want/need to do
13:25 cait                 you can define your own patron attributes in koha but I think there is a patch waiting for sign off to make this work with ldap
13:25 cait                 you could also always reuse one of the existing fields I think
13:25 gerundio             yes, I'll be testing that later on
13:26 gerundio             the doubt here is if the field can be a sum of a fixed part + a value from LDAP
13:27 gerundio             lets assume the fixed URL part is http://koha:8080/cgi-bin/koha/members/moremember.pl?borrowernumber=
13:27 gerundio             and the borrowernumber would come from a field in LDAP
13:28 cait                 what do you want to use that for?
13:28 gerundio             I know this is far fetched
13:28 gerundio             but I got asked about this
13:28 cait                 I mean if the part is fix for all borrowers... do you really need to have it there?
13:28 cait                 couldn't the system using the value just add it?
13:28 cait                 in display?
13:29 gerundio             the borrower URL was just ment as an example
13:29 cait                 yep I know
13:29 cait                 but if the fixed part is fixed...
13:29 gerundio             library staff want a direct link from the koha patron details screen to our own academic record where there are additional details
13:30 cait                 ah
13:30 cait                 you could use jquery to do that
13:30 cait                 you will have to use jquery, to add the anchor tag anyway
13:30 gerundio             ok, so the straight answer is "no possible" :D
13:30 gerundio             not ^
13:30 cait                 well everything is possible - it's open source :)
13:30 cait                 and free software
13:30 gerundio             I know
13:30 cait                 heh
13:31 cait                 I think easiest way to do is safe it into the database
13:31 cait                 and do some jquery magic to make the informatoin appear as a link and add the fixed part there
13:31 cait                 because only a link in the field will still require copy and paste
13:31 cait                 hm or
13:31 cait                 you could enhance the patron attributes to have a new option for an ulr
13:31 cait                 url
13:31 cait                 that should not be so hard
13:32 cait                 hm hope that makes sense
13:32 gerundio             but our premise around here is "use what's provided on the official package so we can reduce maintenance costs over time"
13:32 cait                 yep
13:32 cait                 i was thinking giving that back as a new feature :)
13:32 cait                 because it would be nice
13:33 cait                 so change once ... and get it in standard koha before your next update
13:34 cait                 and jquery would also be a way to do it safe
13:35 gerundio             that's our premise too, like the LDAP patch :)
13:35 gerundio             but this feature is low priority, so I wouldn't get the expectations too high
13:36 cait                 yeah I understand
13:36 cait                 as I said, adding some local jquery should work I think to give you a link
13:36 cait                 I have to do some reading now - will be bck later :)
13:36 gerundio             2nd question: is it possible to assign two different categories for a single patron?
13:36 cait                 no
13:36 cait                 the category dictates the issuing rules
13:37 cait                 if you need more, maybe using the bsort statistics fields and/or patron attribures will help
13:37 WaylonR              okay... hmm... am i missing something here....
13:37 gerundio             we have this rule for books which are bought from our research projects
13:38 WaylonR              two different borrower categories?
13:38 WaylonR              or two different branches?
13:38 cait                 gerundio: what is the rule?
13:39 WaylonR              Yes, thats the best question.
13:39 gerundio             sorry, got a visit in office :s
13:39 WaylonR              I'll hold.
13:40 gerundio             so just picture this, lets say I'm a teacher here at the faculty
13:41 gerundio             I'm assign to a teacher patron category which allows me to do 15 checkouts for a loan period of 150 days
13:41 gerundio             on another perspective I'm also doing reaserch on some project
13:42 gerundio             and bought a few books which are given to the library and are a part of the catalogue
13:43 cait                 hm if you can't use different itemtypes, you will have to use the specify due date feature and or different patron accounts with different categories i think... something like that
13:43 gerundio             so, the exception is that if I checkout one of this project books I can have them for unlimited (or a lot longer period) time
13:44 gerundio             have you been faced with this problem before?
13:44 cait                 if the project books are a special part of the collection, you could give them a separate itemtype
13:49 cait                 oleonard: the preselected new search terms is a really bad idea
13:49 cait                 I commented on the bug. - I had a library requesting this for a project... no fun.
13:50 oleonard             I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks so. I feel like I'm coming off as belligerent in that bug
13:50 cait                 no you are doing good
13:51 oleonard             What do you think about adding "and" to the basic form? Useful? Too much information?
13:51 cait                 and would it work with the cloning of fields? I have only taken a short look at the codeand your comment
13:51 cait                 I think it's what people expect, so we don't need to show it
13:52 cait                 if you enter more than one term... you want your results to have both
13:52 cait                 I think?
13:52 oleonard             Yeah I wouldn't expect an inexperienced user to think they would get an "OR" search
13:53 drojf                no idea what bug you are talking about but +1 from me. everything else than default "and" is crazy and useless and makes me angry
13:53 oleonard             I can see the accessibility argument that the fields need labels though. Not sure how important it is
13:54 cait                 bug 8712
13:54 oleonard             How I might style it: http://screencast.com/t/AHX9xhM2
13:54 huginn               04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8712 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Needs Signoff , We should use WAI-ARIA guidelines to help with accessibility -OMNIBUS bug
13:54 drojf                and i think if i want to be able to change this, i have an advanced search page to do that
13:54 cait                 drojf: the discussion is about the more and fewer options
13:55 cait                 oleonard: hm, I think I like it better the way it is
13:55 cait                 but if we need it, yours doesn't look bad
13:55 cait                 :)
13:56 cait                 oleonard: btw - I have a bug reported for the bad behaviour of koha here... somewhre in bugzilla
13:56 oleonard             I like getting suggestions about accessibility, but I don't like hearing them second-hand. It'd be nice to have a discussion on the list
13:56 cait                 yeah
14:18 oleonard             Ha, I Googled for studies on advanced search form usability and found a report from 1999 comparing HotBot, AltaVista, and Lycos!
14:25 jcamins              oleonard: how to AltaVista and Lycos stack up? :P
14:25 oleonard             I don't know, after the screenshots started my eyes started to hurt and I left
14:25 jcamins              Hehe.
14:26 jcamins              You know, I don't think I ever used the advanced search screen on the OPAC.
14:27 oleonard             When I do it's usually to limit by collection code (which in my library means audience+format)
14:27 jcamins              Oh, you're right.
14:27 jcamins              Occasionally I do it for limiting.
14:28 cait                 same here
14:28 cait                 and searching for new books using date range
14:29 cait                 I never use the search options I think, only the limits
14:29 cait                 and the date range
14:29 wahanui              the date range is in the item record and nengard's records don't have items
14:32 jcamins              I think I mostly use yr,gt:2000, but possibly I've used that feature, too.
14:32 sophie_m             hello : could someone send me the list of languages to load as authorised value LANG in authroised_values table in english (I've only got it in french). Thank you
14:33 jcamins              sophie_m: that's not a default category.
14:33 jcamins              You'll have to just translate the French to English, I think.
14:34 cait                 sophie_m: i think it#s currently only used in UNIMARC for cataloguing
14:35 sophie_m             cait: it is also use to limit search on languages, don't you use it in marc21 ?
14:35 wahanui              okay, sophie_m.
14:35 jcamins              sophie_m: that's not from authorized values.
14:35 jcamins              That's from the language stuff.
14:36 cait                 the advanced search builds on the language tables
14:36 cait                 the descriptions and pull down there
14:36 cait                 and in cataloguing catalogers enter the codes and use the plugin for the controlfield
14:36 cait                 jcamins: that right?
14:37 jcamins              You can look in installer/data/mysql/en/mandatory/subtag_registry.sql
14:37 jcamins              That's correct, yes.
14:37 cait                 ok, i am off to the super market - bbiab
14:38 sophie_m             thank you cait and jcamins
14:38 jcamins              For fennel? :)
14:38 cait                 jcamins: hm I have fennel, maybe a mango
14:38 cait                 bread most of all
14:38 jcamins              Yay!
14:38 cait                 :)
15:06 phasefx              hey guys, for the OPACNoResultsFound system preference, are there any macros/variables available there where we could say, propogate search terms to other catalogs/engines via the HTML placed there?
15:06 jcamins              phasefx: no.
15:06 jcamins              There was a patch do add that, but it didn't work consistently.
15:07 jcamins              Bug...
15:07 phasefx              jcamins: thanks.  I tried suggesting something to someone involving javascript and parsing the location object, but it was a bit much
15:07 jcamins              Bug 7620
15:07 huginn               04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7620 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, koha, Needs Signoff , OPACNoResult, add search string to available parameters
15:07 phasefx              jcamins++
15:07 jcamins              Oh, there's a new patch.
15:07 jcamins              You should test it and sign off if it works.
15:08 * phasefx            shall so endeavor
15:08 lavamind             Hi, I just upgrade my Debian Koha packages, but having a problem with indexing. rebuild_zebra.pl now only works as root, running with the -koha user (while no error message appears) doesn't produce any *.mf index files...
15:08 jcamins              lavamind: you should not be running rebuild_zebra.pl directly when using packages.
15:09 jcamins              Do a chown -R user-koha:user-koha /var/lib/koha/user/[whatever]
15:09 jcamins              Then run sudo koha-rebuild-zebra --full user
15:09 jcamins              (substituting your instance name for "user")
15:10 lavamind             jcamins: I made sure to set the environment variables in the command, following whats in koha-rebuild-zebra
15:10 jcamins              lavamind: ah, that was wise.
15:10 jcamins              In that case, probably you just need to change the ownership on the files and rebuild.
15:10 jcamins              Why were you running rebuild_zebra directly?
15:11 lavamind             jcamins: I've checked ownership, everything is owned by the correct user...
15:12 jcamins              lavamind: oh, did you use su -? If you just use su, sometimes the effective UID gets screwed up.
15:12 lavamind             jcamins: I resorted to rebuild_zebra.pl after trying koha-rebuild-zebra unsuccessfully, leading me to figure out that running it as root produced the files
15:13 lavamind             no, sudo -u <user> -H command, as in koha-r-z
15:13 jcamins              lavamind: hm. Definitely ownership issue then.
15:13 jcamins              Okay, sudo -u sets the effective UID correctly.
15:13 jcamins              And you just upgraded koha-common?
15:13 lavamind             could  other directories or files be involved ?
15:13 jcamins              From which version to which version?
15:14 lavamind             3.2.5 to 3.8.6
15:14 jcamins              Wow. Big jump.
15:14 jcamins              So you moved from a non-package install to a package install.
15:15 lavamind             no, the previous install was from packages as well
15:15 jcamins              3.2.5?
15:15 lavamind             yes
15:15 jcamins              I didn't think Koha was packaged until 3.4.
15:15 jcamins              Apparently I was wrong.
15:15 lavamind             I can check my dpkg logs, one sec
15:16 jcamins              No, I just checked.
15:16 jcamins              There _were_ packages for 3.2.
15:16 lavamind             /var/log/dpkg.log:2012-10-25 12:08:28 upgrade koha-common 3.2.5-1 3.8.6-1
15:16 * jcamins            didn't know that.
15:16 jcamins              Did you run koha-upgrade-to-3.4 or whatever the script is?
15:17 lavamind             the package upgrade ran them automatically, as far as I can tell
15:17 reiveune             bye
15:17 lavamind             after upgrading the packages and updating translations, everything looked pretty fine
15:19 lavamind             I must say, aside from this zebra pain, I was surprised how streamlined the upgrade went, Koha has great Debian packagers
15:19 cait                 :) eythian++
15:19 jcamins              Yeah, packages are great.
15:20 lavamind             here's a log of rebuild_zebra.pl as my koha user : http://pastebin.com/3e9VwCUp
15:20 jcamins              It has to be permissions, but I don't know exactly which directory it's likely to be.
15:20 lavamind             with -v -v
15:21 gerundio             cait, sorry for the long absence
15:21 gerundio             hate to leave people hanging
15:21 gerundio             even more when I'm the one asking the questions :)
15:21 cait                 gerundio: it's ok - I was at the super market in the meantime ;)
15:21 gerundio             ;)
15:21 jcamins              What does `ls -lR /var/log/koha` give you?
15:22 gerundio             the project books are regular books for all that matters
15:22 gerundio             if a patron, other than the project researchers, want to checkout one of these books
15:23 gerundio             they would follow the normal circulation rules
15:23 lavamind             jcamins: empty zebra-* logs
15:23 lavamind             and root-owned intranet- and opac- logfiles (!)
15:24 cait                 sorry gerundio, I don't think koha has a feature specific for that workflow
15:24 gerundio             I don't think it's possible to use koha to this extent
15:24 gerundio             exactly my thoughts
15:24 jcamins              lavamind: I'm interested in the ownership of the folders.
15:24 jcamins              Wait.
15:24 jcamins              I meant `ls -lR /var/lib/koha`
15:24 jcamins              Sorry.
15:24 * jcamins            was looking in logs for something else.
15:25 gerundio             the only workaround I see is to define a specific item type to the books of each project
15:25 gerundio             but even so, there's no way to identify the project members
15:25 gerundio             as they can be students or teachers
15:26 gerundio             I guess they'll just hear a 2nd no :)
15:26 lavamind             jcamins: http://pastebin.com/gfaDJ4qb
15:26 cait                 hm
15:26 cait                 sorry, I have no idea for a work around
15:26 jcamins              lavamind: what's the ownership on /var/lib/koha/prof and /var/lib/koha/prof/biblios?
15:28 lavamind             drwxr-xr-x 53 root    root    4,0K 11 oct 11:59 koha  ---- drwxr-xr-x 6 prof-koha prof-koha 4,0K 25 oct 12:09 biblios
15:29 gerundio             meanwhile I've started looking for that LDAP related bug you wanted me to sign off
15:29 gerundio             bug 8919
15:29 huginn               04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8919 critical, P1 - high, ---, dpavlin, Needs Signoff , ExtendedPatronAttributes not populated from LDAP
15:30 gerundio             since I'm a noob at koha I'll need some guidance :)
15:30 lavamind             jcamins: I think I've got it
15:30 jcamins              lavamind: oh?
15:30 gerundio             the ExtendedPatronAttributes refered in the bug are the ones defined in the Patron attribute types admin area, right?
15:30 lavamind             jcamins: in /var/lock/koha/prof there's a couple of root-owned files
15:31 lavamind             -rw------- 1 root      root      10 26 oct 10:29 state..LCK
15:31 jcamins              lavamind: that might be it.
15:32 jcamins              lavamind: Do a `sudo service koha-common stop` followed by a `sudo service koha-common start` and see if that fixes it.
15:32 lavamind             jcamins: running koha-rebuild-zebra -v --full prof
15:34 lavamind             jcamins: what do you think about adding a line or two about which directories to check for ownership to http://koha-community.org/faqs/zebra-indexing-wont-work-fix-it-aka-search-stuff-up-help/
15:34 jcamins              I think that's an excellent idea.
15:35 jcamins              I'll just have to figure out who has write access who I can ask to add it.
15:35 lavamind             jcamins: sucess! search is back
15:35 jcamins              Hooray!
15:36 lavamind             jcamins: so yeah, /var/lib/koha/<user> and /var/lock/koha/<user>
15:37 cait                 jcamins: interesting question with liz moving!
15:40 lavamind             jcamins: I'd be enclined to also remove the "(or root, depending on your setup)" passages 1) you're note supposed to run that stuff as root and 2) if you are, you'd better know what you're doing
15:41 jcamins              lavamind: that's a good point.
15:45 lavamind             jcamins: perhaps introducing some kind of basic sanity check for ownership in koha-rebuild-zebra could also help
15:45 jcamins              lavamind: brilliant!
15:49 lavamind             jcamins: do you happen to know who's responsible for koha-common ?
15:49 jcamins              lavamind: eythian. I reported a bug on the packaging, and with luck he'll be able to patch koha-rebuild-zebra before I can.
15:50 mib_78v6t5           hello!!!!!!!!!!!!!
15:50 wahanui              hello are u there?
15:51 mib_78v6t5           yeah
15:51 jcamins              lol
15:51 jcamins              Wonder who taught him that.
15:51 jcamins              mib_78v6t5: wahanui is a bot.
15:51 mib_78v6t5           lol
15:51 mib_78v6t5           is my 1st time here
15:52 mib_78v6t5           I'm searching and learning how to use koha
15:52 mib_78v6t5           (:
15:52 jcamins              Perhaps I shouldn't have told you... you could have provided a Turing test for him. ;)
15:52 mib_78v6t5           lol
15:52 mib_78v6t5           thanks for that, now is too late
15:52 mib_78v6t5           haha
15:52 jcamins              A good place to start is the manual.
15:52 jcamins              manual?
15:52 wahanui              manual is at http://www.koha-community.org/documentation
15:52 mib_78v6t5           yes, I've read it
15:52 jcamins              The Koha website is, of course, koha-community.org.
15:52 jcamins              Excellent!
15:53 mib_78v6t5           I really need to, we gonna use it from now on in this library
15:53 jcamins              The latest stable version of Koha is 3.8.6.
15:53 mib_78v6t5           and I work here
15:53 huginn               New commit(s) kohagit: Bug 8947: [SIGNED-OFF] XSLT fallback logic backwards <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=9ea2bb7eca37ded5637be28b888da5af503b89c5> / Bug 8939 follow-up welcome to Robert Williams 194th contributor <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commitdiff;h=be3441d64833a48b26912141d85d1470be52f135> / Bug 8939 : Fines being charged during the grace period <http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb
15:55 jcamins              Welcome to the Koha community. :)
15:55 mib_78v6t5           Thank you!
15:56 mib_78v6t5           Happy weekend to everyone, see you guys on Monday lol!
15:56 jenkins_koha         Starting build #917 for job Koha_master (previous build: SUCCESS)
15:56 cait                 bye :)
16:08 lavamind             jcamins: thanks for the bug report, I think that will make a great enhancement -- on the short-term though, I think updating the documentation page I brought up would still be pretty relevant. problems with zebra seem endemic amoing new/inexperienced koha admins
16:09 jcamins              Agreed.
16:09 jcamins              The person I'd usually ask to make the change is currently moving... 18 time zones.
16:15 jcamins              Alas, the hurristormpocalypse may cause our CSA pick up to be rescheduled.
16:16 cait                 jcamins: 18!
16:18 jcamins              cait: GMT-6 to GMT+12
16:27 tweetbot`            [off] twitter: @hbraum: "Come work for us! @nekls in Lawrence, KS is hiring a Systems Administrator http://t.co/mF5eEIWS #wordpress #opensource #libraries #kohails"
16:29 bag                  tag 010
16:30 jcamins              @marc 010
16:30 jcamins              huginn: noooo!!!! What has happened to you?
16:30 huginn               jcamins: A unique number assigned to a MARC record by the Library of Congress. Valid MARC prefixes for LC control numbers are published in MARC 21 Format for Bibliographic Data. [a,b,z,8]
16:30 huginn               jcamins: I suck
16:30 jcamins              Oh. Nothing.
16:30 wahanui              i guess nothing is a requirement, we have guidelines though
16:36 bag                  thanks jared
16:37 jcamins              You're welcome. You probably want 010$a.
16:47 tcohen               anyone, a jquery plugin for making ul collapsable? oleonard?
16:47 jcamins              tcohen: the tree view one might do it.
16:47 jcamins              Don't remember what it's called...
16:47 oleonard             we don't use anything standard at the moment tcohen, but jqueryUI has the accordion plugin which might also work
16:48 jcamins              jstree.
16:48 jcamins              jstree is standard!
16:48 tcohen               https://github.com/jzaefferer/jquery-treeview
16:48 tcohen               ok!
16:48 jcamins              I'm the only one using it.
16:48 jcamins              :P
16:48 oleonard             Where jcamins?
16:48 wahanui              somebody said jcamins was too young to be the President of the United States.  Which is a pity, because he had the votes at the 3.12 election.
16:48 jcamins              Ergo, 100% of our tree usage is jstree.
16:48 jcamins              :)
16:48 jcamins              oleonard: authority hierarchies.
16:48 oleonard             Oh right, I remember now
16:58 tcohen               thanks jcamins,oleonard
17:04 jenkins_koha         Project Koha_master build #917: SUCCESS in 1 hr 7 min: http://jenkins.koha-community.org/job/Koha_master/917/
17:04 jenkins_koha         * mathieu.saby: Bug 8958: Make facets more UNIMARC compliant (revision 1)
17:04 jenkins_koha         * williams: Bug 8939 : Fines being charged during the grace period
17:04 jenkins_koha         * Paul Poulain: Bug 8939 follow-up welcome to Robert Williams 194th contributor
17:04 jenkins_koha         * jcamins: Bug 8947: [SIGNED-OFF] XSLT fallback logic backwards
17:04 huginn               04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8958 normal, P5 - low, ---, mathieu.saby, Pushed to Master , Facets are not fully UNIMARC compliant
17:04 huginn               04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8939 major, P5 - low, ---, koha-bugs, Pushed to Master , Fines Charged During Grace Period
17:04 huginn               04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=8947 normal, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, Pushed to Master , Search does not work with CCSR theme and language = nb-NO
17:45 cait                 hmm
17:46 cait                 http://www.sanjuanislander.com/island-newshome/more/library/5787-sji-library-to-return-to-former-information-system
17:47 jcamins              Looks like they need to think about Koha. :)
17:48 cait                 hm thy don't say how big they are
18:03 drojf                can i put several things in one cookie value? something like 'piwik=yes+socialnetworks=no+amazon=no+google=yes' or is that bad for some reason? i would prefer not to use one cookie per possible privacy setting
18:04 jcamins              drojf: sure. You just have to URLencode it, I think.
18:05 drojf                cool
18:05 drojf                i have baked cookies before, but setting them…
18:05 cait                 heh
18:06 drojf                hm. i think i have to bake cookies. thanks, brain
18:07 cait                 cookies yay!
18:07 * cait               tell your brain her address for the package
18:07 drojf                he
18:08 drojf                reminds me that i forgot to send in my broken headphones :(
18:08 drojf                thanks again, brain
18:08 oleonard             SJL's 2010 annual report says their circ was 177,077. Not very big.
18:09 cait                 ah nope
18:10 cait                 that's not exactly good publicity for wms
18:12 oleonard             Why would they switch back to something that they know they have to switch away from again?
18:13 jcamins              oleonard: anything is better than WMS?
18:13 cait                 oleonard: perhaps because the contract was still there?
18:14 oleonard             Now I'm curious about how bad WMS is.
18:14 cait                 I mean they could go back to it maybe for less cost and no trainingfor staff
18:14 cait                 of course... everything is only a guess
18:14 jcamins              drojf: around?
18:15 drojf                jcamins: a minute maybe :9 why?
18:15 jcamins              drojf: wondering about RAM usage for Plack without Starman.
18:17 jcamins              What's the virtual memory size of Koha under Plack?
18:25 drojf                sorry phone
18:25 drojf                i think i have something around 60mb x2 for plackup, two more plackup with ~6mb and mysql with… 50mb or something
18:25 drojf                for virtual size, let me have a look
18:26 drojf                i don't think my numbers are fair anyway since it never ran really long or was heavily used
18:26 jcamins              drojf: I'm wondering for a development machine.
18:27 jcamins              I'm using starman instead of plackup, and I don't know how the memory usage compares.
18:27 drojf                2230 mysql     20   0  321m  53m 5664 S   0,3 22,9   0:07.12 mysqld                                                   2624 koha-koh  20   0 70588  54m 5132 S   0,0 23,4   0:29.31 /usr/bin/placku
18:27 drojf                2619 koha-koh  20   0 42880  31m 3360 S   0,0 13,5   0:08.08 /usr/bin/placku
18:27 drojf                heh not very useful paste
18:28 drojf                321m  53m mysqld
18:28 drojf                70588  54m /usr/bin/placku
18:28 drojf                42880  31m /usr/bin/placku
18:29 drojf                but i had just restartet it
18:29 drojf                i have never managed to run starman. how much ram does that take?
18:29 jcamins              A lot more.
18:30 drojf                keep in mind i font have much more and i dont know if it would just die if it's "really" used
18:30 drojf                s/font/don't/
18:31 drojf                i will try it with the 512mb ram version next week i hope
18:31 jcamins              I still haven't figure out _exactly_ how much it's using, but VSZ is 200-something MB, and the debug console reports memory usage as 64MB.
18:32 jcamins              *figured
18:33 drojf                how many threads did you enable in starman?
18:33 jcamins              Ummm...
18:34 jcamins              2.
18:34 jcamins              No point in having lots if it's just me.
18:37 bag                  @seen sekjal
18:37 huginn               bag: sekjal was last seen in #koha 1 week, 0 days, 2 hours, 41 minutes, and 30 seconds ago: <sekjal> this is one of the first times I've listened to music at work… that's definitey something I miss from my home office days
18:49 user00               @seen nengard
18:49 huginn               user00: nengard was last seen in #koha 23 hours, 20 minutes, and 30 seconds ago: <nengard> oleonard, i understand it all, but can't explain right now ;)
18:50 nengard              hi
18:54 rhcl                 hey, u make it home ok? We had a 6 hour delay out of SFO
18:58 nengard              i had a 30 min delay out of san jose
18:58 nengard              and a 2 hour delay out of msp
18:58 nengard              but yes, i made it home!
18:59 nengard              6 hour is crazy!!!
19:14 Brooke               o/
19:14 jcamins              o/
19:15 cait                 hi Brooke
19:15 Brooke               hallo
19:16 Brooke               wie geht's?
19:16 cait                 gut :)
19:32 cait                 @wunder wellington, nz
19:32 huginn               cait: The current temperature in Wellington, New Zealand is 14.0°C (8:00 AM NZDT on October 27, 2012). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 72%. Dew Point: 9.0°C. Pressure: 29.74 in 1007 hPa (Steady).
19:32 * Brooke             throws a pink flag.
19:32 Brooke               Taunting. 15 Yard penalty. Loss of Down.
21:35 YoungPublicLibrarian Okay, how do I get a report to return the "Librarians Only" messages in a query?
21:39 drojf                YoungPublicLibrarian: i think it is weekend in most parts of the world already
21:43 YoungPublicLibrarian Like, the "borrowers.borrowernotes" returns the notes in the Circ field under EDIT, "messages.message" gives the "Patron" messages, but nothing that I can find gives the "Librarians Only" messages...
21:43 YoungPublicLibrarian drojf: I thought that might be the case. I guess I'll try Monday or Wednesday...Just very odd that I can't find that one particular field in the schema...