Time  Nick                 Message
23:55 bg                   hey papa
23:03 bag                  I'm a one knee surfer
23:02 bag                  me either
22:59 rangi                but i never was any good
22:58 rangi                91 :)
22:58 bag                  s/word/surfboard
22:58 * bag                expects that he'll say "yeah, havent touched word since hmm 1996"
22:58 rangi                91
22:58 rangi                heh, its been a long long time
22:57 * bag                wants to see rangi on a surf board…
22:55 YoungPublicLibrarian Hm...well, my library still uses MS Word...
22:54 Space_Librarian      lol
22:52 ibeardslee           lucky you
22:50 rangi                yeah, havent touched word since hmm 1996
22:47 Space_Librarian      most of these guys use libreoffice or open office though...
22:47 Space_Librarian      goodness. That was a long time ago.
22:45 YoungPublicLibrarian Okay...is anyone familiar with the mail merge feature of MS Word? I'm trying to use it in conjunction with the csv files downloaded from the report I just created...
22:44 Space_Librarian      unless you ask, you won't learn
22:44 YoungPublicLibrarian lol, just curious, since my questions seem to be a bit in-depth...
22:39 Space_Librarian      there's a quota?
22:38 YoungPublicLibrarian I have another question if I haven't used up my daily quota :/
22:38 cait                 rangi++ :)
22:35 rangi                or something :)
22:35 rangi                2 counters, just for dr
22:35 Space_Librarian      awesome
22:35 wahanui              rangi has karma of 301
22:35 rangi                karma for rangi
22:34 huginn`              rangi: Highest karma: "rangi" (543), "oleonard" (473), and "wizzyrea" (320).  Lowest karma: "<!" (-109), "failed" (-73), and "-" (-44).  You (rangi) are ranked 1 out of 2010.
22:34 rangi                @karma
22:34 rangi                heh
22:34 liw                  (how big are karma counters? I hope that didn't overflow)
22:33 liw                  rangi << 32
22:33 rangi                cool
22:31 YoungPublicLibrarian Okay, that worked! Thank you so much rangi!
22:26 YoungPublicLibrarian lol, okay rangi, the second one is a bit confusing...but the first one I'll try to get to work...
22:26 * rangi              hopes he is helping not confusing
22:25 rangi                (TO_DAYS(curdate())-TO_DAYS( date_due) IN (<<Days overdue>>,<<Days overdue2>>)
22:25 rangi                you could do it with an IN too
22:24 rangi                (ull want 2 variable so you can choose to different dates)
22:24 rangi                ((TO_DAYS(curdate())-TO_DAYS( date_due)) = <<Days overdue>> OR  (TO_DAYS(curdate())-TO_DAYS( date_due)) = <<Days overdue2>>)
22:24 Space_Librarian      rangi++
22:23 rangi                it needs to be
22:23 rangi                yeah it wont
22:22 * rangi              has had coffee, an easter egg and a blueberry muffin brought to his desk today .. not a bad day back at work after a 4 day weekend
22:21 YoungPublicLibrarian Okay, this: WHERE issues.branchcode = <<Branch Code>> AND (TO_DAYS(curdate())-TO_DAYS( date_due)) = (<<Days overdue>> OR = <<Days overdue>>) didn't work...I did it wrong didn't I?
22:20 rangi                WHERE (something = soething OR something=somethingelse) AND someotherthing = cheese
22:20 rangi                brackets evaluate first
22:20 YoungPublicLibrarian ah, okay. Thanks! You guys are awesome!
22:19 rangi                its just like math
22:19 rangi                you might want to wrap it in ( )
22:19 rangi                it can't be both at once :)
22:19 rangi                AND should be OR
22:19 rangi                sorry
22:19 rangi                yep, the above is the exact one
22:18 YoungPublicLibrarian a range would give me everything in between though wouldn't it? I want just overdues for 7 days and overdues for 21 days...
22:18 rangi                WHERE something = something AND something = somethingelse
22:18 Space_Librarian      if you find a date range command in one of the other reports, copy that across.
22:17 YoungPublicLibrarian alright! Thanks! Now, is there a way to say two specific number (ex. '7' and '21' days)? or is that asking too much :)?
22:06 Space_Librarian      yep
21:55 YoungPublicLibrarian Okay, so in the Overdues /w Contact Info, http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/SQL_Reports_Library#Overdues_w.2F_Contact_Info, I would change the '>=' in the WHERE statement to '=' correct?
21:52 Space_Librarian      YoungPublicLibrarian any of them...
21:52 YoungPublicLibrarian ethian, in which report? The Overdues Materials report that was linked or the Overdues w/ Contact Info that I was talking about?
21:51 YoungPublicLibrarian Ah okay! I've only had one class in SQL and that was a while ago...Thanks!
21:51 Space_Librarian      what eythian said, actually.
21:51 Space_Librarian      YoungPublicLibrarian it was pretty straight forward to get a specific overdue days
21:50 eythian              in fact, change the '>' to '=' will probably do it.
21:50 Space_Librarian      heh
21:50 wizzyrea             sorry sorry
21:50 Space_Librarian      wizzyrea: see the link above, hon. :p
21:49 Space_Librarian      It is.
21:49 eythian              it would be pretty easy to adapt I expect
21:49 wahanui              i guess reports library is found at http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/SQL_Reports_Library
21:49 wizzyrea             reports library?
21:49 * Space_Librarian    checks her report library
21:47 YoungPublicLibrarian yep, but all it has is one report that allows you to input a number of days. But when you do it gives you anything over that specified number of days. It is the Overdues w/ Contact Info report. I need a report that allows you to input a number and have it give you overdues for that specific number of days and nothing else.
21:43 Space_Librarian      specifically http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/SQL_Reports_Library#Overdue_materials
21:41 Space_Librarian      http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/SQL_Reports_Library
21:40 Space_Librarian      have you looked at the reports library?
21:39 YoungPublicLibrarian okay, anyone good at making reports? I'm trying to get the report to give me only overdues that are 7 days overdue. Nothing under or over...
21:28 eythian              at least, that's what I assume was happening
21:27 cait                 ah :)
21:27 cait                 made me feel less lonely... but perhaps you still want to check
21:27 eythian              I have, I had a VPN connection that was going spazzy and breaking my connection a lot.
21:27 cait                 you filled the logs appearing and disappearing over the weekend :)
21:26 cait                 you should fix your chat thing
21:26 cait                 hi eythian
21:26 wahanui              niihau, eythian
21:26 eythian              hi
21:24 cait                 hi again YoungPublicLibrarian
21:22 YoungPublicLibrarian Hello again everyone!
21:06 wizzyrea             oh bz. we can never be mad at you
21:06 rangi                bz is the winner so far
21:06 wizzyrea             *nod*
21:06 rangi                only started last night
21:06 rangi                the bit i like is seeing the commands i use a lot
21:06 rangi                yup
21:00 wizzyrea             that is silly fun.
20:59 * wizzyrea           would add that to the aliases :P
20:59 wizzyrea             ohhh
20:59 Space_Librarian      nice! :)
20:58 rangi                i didnt do it global, and changed the code to only look for local, then i manually do git achievements -p to push it
20:58 rangi                git config --global achievement.upload "true"
20:58 rangi                but this bit
20:58 rangi                https://github.com/icefox/git-achievements you can make your own pretty easily
20:57 cait                 lol
20:57 cjh                  awesome
20:57 rangi                http://ranginui.github.com/git-achievements/
20:54 * Space_Librarian    puts up hand
20:54 wizzyrea             oh me me pick me
20:54 rangi                ok who wants to see something pointless and kinda silly?
20:53 sekjal               cheers, #koha!
20:53 sekjal               time for me to pack up, as well... got to get across the river for Game Night (and route 9 is a bear this time of day)
20:52 * jcamins_away       heads out for a reception at which TAOCP will probably not come up.
20:52 Space_Librarian      jcamins_away - Tomes is the right word
20:51 cait                 for me at least :)
20:50 cait                 tryin to work on that... but ew. not easy.
20:50 cait                 and I would like to see some clean up of the logs
20:50 cait                 I fully agree with these goals
20:50 * jcamins_away       got half-way through number two.
20:50 sekjal               cait:  thanks for keeping on top of it.  my goal is for us to get all the blockers and criticals taken care of before release time, and as many majors as possible, too
20:49 jcamins_away         Knuth's magisterial tomes of wisdom.
20:49 jcamins_away         The Art of Computer Programming.
20:49 cait                 to = 2
20:49 cait                 sekjal: I found to other evil bugs I marked blocker - not patches yet
20:47 sekjal               gmcharlt:  ah.  I don't have my copy with me in the office, since I'm not officially doing Perl anymore
20:46 gmcharlt             sekjal: re citation, I'm pretty sure it's in PBP
20:46 sekjal               thanks, rangi
20:46 sekjal               TAOCP?
20:46 rangi                ill sign off today, if no one beats me to it
20:46 jcamins_away         sekjal: TAOCP.
20:46 huginn`              04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7834 critical, P5 - low, ---, katrin.fischer, Needs Signoff , order search at the top of acq does nothing
20:46 sekjal               request for signoff:  bug 7834.  needs to get fixed before 3.8
20:41 sekjal               gmcharlt:  I had thought I'd remembered something like that from my CS classes, but I couldn't find a good citation online to back me up
20:40 rangi                its really lazy
20:40 rangi                exacterly
20:39 gmcharlt             sekjal: correct - and arguably, exit() should never be used to get out of routines regardless
20:37 sekjal               my readings on mod_perl suggest that exit() shouldn't be used (for mod_perl, anyway)
20:37 rangi                CGI->new();
20:37 rangi                yeah
20:37 sekjal               as well as my $query = new CGI;
20:36 sekjal               okay, didn't think so.  the /svc directory is rife with this
20:36 rangi                no
20:34 sekjal               one doesn't need an "exit 0" statement in Perl if all the subsequent lines are declared subroutines, right?
20:33 cait                 oh
20:32 cait                 ah... I am always too slow for him
20:30 wizzyrea             la--- oh bother.
20:30 rangi                cya oleonard
20:30 oleonard             More later. Bye #koha
20:28 cait                 oleonard++
20:09 rangi                Ok my stop bbiab
19:56 huginn`              04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7935 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, katrin.fischer, Needs Signoff , Introduce sys pref to control 'browse results' in OPAC
19:56 rangi                Bug 7935
19:56 rangi                Cait++
19:55 nengard              i know usage only
19:55 nengard              not that  i wrote
19:55 sha                  any configuration tutorial??
19:55 nengard              so now i'm copying it to the help files
19:55 nengard              I think I finished updating the manual today ? i think
19:54 nengard              just fyi if you want to sign off on something easy
19:54 huginn`              04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7936 major, P5 - low, ---, nengard, Needs Signoff , general ticket for 3.8 help file updates
19:54 nengard              bug 7936 has the updated help files for 3.8 - I'll probably finish them up tomorrow or Weds
19:54 wizzyrea             hi sha
19:51 sha                  hi all
19:47 chris_n              I just needed to know what direction to go with on a local enh I'm porting forward
19:46 rangi                What he said
19:46 rangi                Thats the plan I think but not for 3.6.x and not totally for 3.8 yet
19:46 chris_n              great
19:46 sekjal               chris_n:  we're moving towards that, yes:  DateTime and Koha::Calendar should be able to fully replaced C4::Dates
19:45 cait                 morning :)
19:45 chris_n              rangi do you know if we're using DateTime and deprecating C4::Dates now?
19:44 chris_n              heya rangi
19:44 rangi                Morning
19:43 huginn`              04Bug 5549: enhancement, P1 - high, ---, chris, Signed Off , Hourly Loans
19:43 cait                 perhaps this: http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=5549#c5
19:43 cait                 ah, and the bug isnot helpful
19:42 chris_n              just for querying
19:42 chris_n              this is not for display
19:42 chris_n              no
19:42 cait                 if you have an enhancement to dates that is displaying a date somewhere in the templates - you want to use that :)
19:42 cait                 talkign about dates - have you seen the plugin for dates?
19:41 huginn`              04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7409 normal, P5 - low, ---, robin, Pushed to Master , Missing dependencies for Debian package
19:41 cait                 bug 7409
19:41 chris_n              I have an old enhancement I have to port to 3.8 which needs to be able to pass dates formated in ansi sql
19:41 cait                 but I can find the bug for you
19:41 cait                 they talked about it being cool - but no idea :)
19:40 chris_n              it has many format options
19:40 chris_n              DateTime would be cool
19:40 cait                 chris_n: thereis a patch pending I think for new dependencies
19:40 cait                 chris_n: and I think a new deependance was introduced to - but I would start looking in the Koha namespace
19:40 * chris_n            looks to see if its in the dep list yet
19:39 chris_n              DateTime... maybe
19:39 cait                 chris_n: there is a DateUtils and another related to dates somehow
19:39 cait                 chris_n: I thinkthe new modules in Koha:
19:34 * chris_n            wonders if it handles dates in ansi-sql format
19:33 chris_n              any idea what's being used in its place?
19:32 cait                 I think sekjal and libsysguy were discussing this here a few days ago
19:31 chris_n              are we trying to deprecate C4::Dates?
19:25 cait                 nengard++ :)
19:19 nengard              got it working
19:15 cait                 hah! found it - was missing a :
19:13 cait                 YoungPublicLibrarian: that's ok - was hoping someone had an idea what's going wrong here :)
19:13 YoungPublicLibrarian Sorry cait, I'm absolutely positive you know more than me, so I can't answer you...
19:13 nengard              so i open up virtual box, start up koha (debian) and then go to firefox on the mac and type that in
19:13 nengard              no that's from the browers on my computer so i can view the vm
19:13 oleonard             nengard: Is that from the browser in your VM?
19:12 nengard              so yes, i think i have the ports set up
19:12 nengard              it's kohavm for the opac and http://kohavm:8080/ for the staff
19:12 nengard              sorry i was wrong
19:12 wahanui              somebody said oleonard was still here, if you just wish hard enough. or Koha's master UI designer
19:12 nengard              oleonard
19:11 nengard              not hand
19:11 nengard              handy
19:11 nengard              just want my hand drag and drop interface :)
19:11 nengard              and i can use the scp command already
19:10 nengard              to get to it in the browser i type http://kohavm for opac and http://kohavm:80 for staff
19:10 oleonard             nengard: localhost:80 (OPAC) and localhost:8080 (staff client) ?
19:10 nengard              um ? hehe
19:10 oleonard             nengard: Do you have Koha set up on different ports in your VM? (:80 and :8080 ?)
19:10 wizzyrea             or scp
19:09 wizzyrea             yea, once you have ssh you can sftp
19:09 oleonard             http://shoaibmir.wordpress.com/2009/09/13/configuring-ssh-access-for-virtualbox-guest-host/
19:08 nengard              i need to update the help files for Koha 3.8 and it's too much to do this all on the vm
19:08 nengard              and i guess make sure that my user has the right permissions
19:08 nengard              IP, port, etc etc
19:08 nengard              can anyone tell me how to use a desktop ftp client with my koha vm? I just need to know how to find the info needed to connect to my koha vm via sftp
19:08 YoungPublicLibrarian Ah! I didn't even see the "</item>" otherwise I could have figured out what it was for! lol Thanks!
19:08 cait                 I added a new pref to the opac.pref file... but it's refusing to show up in system preferences editor?
19:07 cait                 I have a problem
19:07 cait                 ok
19:06 oleonard             Since that shows up for everyone you wouldn't want to use it on anything others use
19:05 oleonard             I use that
19:05 pastebot             "oleonard" at pasted "Put a sytem preferences search into the top menu bar (dev systems only)" (3 lines) at http://paste.koha-community.org/335
19:04 cait                 oleonard: yeah - wishful thinking :)
19:04 cait                 << >> are placeholders for data that will be put in when the letter is generated
19:04 oleonard             cait: You are imagining a system preference search
19:04 cait                 so it will output all fields between those markers that you mention in between
19:03 cait                 aremarkers to output a list of items
19:03 cait                 <item> </item> (must be one line - be careful!)
19:03 cait                 oleonard: I think it perhaps was only a link always and I have a link
19:02 YoungPublicLibrarian <item>"<<biblio.title>>" by <<biblio.author>>, <<items.itemcallnumber>>, Barcode: <<items.barcode>> Fine: <fine>GBP</fine></item> in this line here, does anyone know what the difference is in <item> and "<<biblio.title>>"?
19:02 cait                 oleonard: but I kinda miss the system preference search? or did I imagine it was there before? :(
19:02 cait                 oleonard: pending suggestions show up for me
19:01 YoungPublicLibrarian mail merge. Got it, thanks jwagner!
18:56 jwagner              YoungPublicLibrarian, search on mail merge
18:55 YoungPublicLibrarian Hmm...google isn't coming up with much about making a MS Word letter from MS Excel. But I'll keep looking! lol
18:54 cait                 :)
18:54 YoungPublicLibrarian Okay, thanks! You've been a huge help!
18:53 cait                 also look at the manual about overdue letters - there are a lot of differnet options for setting them up
18:53 cait                 np :)
18:52 YoungPublicLibrarian Okay I will look there! Thanks!
18:52 cait                 but you can define different letters
18:52 cait                 normally ODUE
18:52 cait                 you define yourself how it looks like - it's one of the templates from tools > notices
18:51 cait                 YoungPublicLibrarian: I only now the german word - not sure how the feature is called in English correctly - so perhaps be careful when searching for serial letters :)
18:51 YoungPublicLibrarian Also, you said that KoHa sends a letter via email to patrons with overdues. Is there a way we can see what that letter looks like?
18:50 YoungPublicLibrarian Oh! That would be nice. I will look into that! Thanks!
18:50 cait                 there are also other programs you could use I think
18:50 cait                 where you can create letters from a spreadsheet of data
18:50 cait                 I was thinking of a feature word and perhaps writer (libreoficce openoffice too) have
18:49 YoungPublicLibrarian Hmm...okay. So if we run the report and get all the overdues in an excel sheet, how would I then get it formatted? Would I have to go through each overdue and create a page manually? Or is there a way in KoHa to do it? You mentioned Serial Letters, but I don't know what that is...sorry. Not trying to be difficult...
18:46 cait                 What Koha can do is create somehting like a search form (runtime parameters) to influence the conditions for a report
18:46 cait                 normally you would get the data and use something else for formatting, like using a... serial letter? (not sure that's the right word) to create the mails from a spreadcheet
18:46 YoungPublicLibrarian right, but you can format your reports can't you? I mean in my beginners SQL class they talked about creating reports with buttons and fields and things...
18:45 cait                 sql is to retrieve data - not for formatting
18:45 cait                 i think you can't really do that with sql
18:44 YoungPublicLibrarian Well, I've been able to recreate the overdues report. But I don't know enough about SQL to format it so that the information of one patron fits on one single page....
18:32 cait                 peraps wizzyrea had nothing waiting?
18:32 cait                 hm
18:28 huginn`              04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7928 normal, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, ASSIGNED , suggestion, tags numbers missing from mainpage
18:28 oleonard             Hmmm... Actually Bug 7928 works for me
18:15 YoungPublicLibrarian Hmm...the current overdues report from the circulation page prints out an excel list for everyone that has overdues. But we want them all to be single page entities... Is this possible at all? We'd like to do that with all of our patrons, not just the ones that don't have emails...
18:14 huginn`              jcamins: Quote #113: "<jcamins> I merely opened my hands and allowed a butterfly to flutter its wings once, thus ensuring that the record I was interested in would automatically show up on the terminal when I was walking by." (added by druthb at 02:18 PM, December 21, 2010)
18:14 jcamins              @quote get 113
18:14 huginn`              cait: Quote #135: "rangi: $tempate->{VARS}->{'LoginBranchname'} - without the typo" (added by cait at 07:30 PM, May 20, 2011)
18:14 cait                 @quote get 135
18:14 huginn`              jcamins: 23 found: #101: "<darling> I still need to catch up with current...", #113: "<jcamins> I merely opened my hands and allowed...", #119: "<wasabi> wow, and a pig!!! -> http://www.blaine...", #122: "<member:oleonard>Everyone is doin' the hot new...", #127: "Oracle now has little choice but to abandon its...", #12: "<owen> Every time you check in a book a little...", #143: "rhcl: Blame the C coders; if it (3 more messages)
18:14 huginn`              cait: 2 found: #135: "rangi: $tempate->{VARS}->{'LoginBranchname'} -..." and #82: "<pianohack> nengard: If you were using a..."
18:14 jcamins              @quote search tt
18:14 cait                 @quote search typo
18:13 huginn`              cait: No matching quotes were found.
18:13 cait                 @quote search template
18:13 wahanui              cait: i haven't a clue
18:13 cait                 wahanui: template params?
18:13 cait                 hm
18:13 wahanui              cait: no idea
18:13 cait                 wahanui: template param?
18:10 jcamins              And by "wouldn't recommend it," I mean "I'm horrified that I even mentioned the possibility it's such a horribly, terribly, massively BAD idea."
18:10 cait                 the overdues job mails you a file with letters for borrowers without email address by default
18:10 jcamins              I guess maybe you could do an incredibly complicated thing with CONCAT, but I wouldn't recommend it.
18:10 cait                 and what jcamins said
18:09 cait                 page
18:09 cait                 adn you can downlowd a csv with overdues from one of the reports on the circulation patge
18:09 jcamins              YoungPublicLibrarian: I think the overdues job handles that.
18:09 cait                 YoungPublicLibrarian: I am not sure you can do a paged report like this with the custom reports
18:08 cait                 no problem :)
18:08 YoungPublicLibrarian Hello cait! Sorry missed your 'hi'!
18:07 edveal               Ok, good idea.
18:06 oleonard             edveal: Looks like you'll have to look for the link text
18:06 YoungPublicLibrarian The report is for Overdues that we want to mail out from the library, not use peoples' emails. It needs to show the patrons' information and just the items that are overdue all on a single page. Each page needs to have one patron only. Can anyone help me with this?
18:04 edveal               I am trying to hide the "Delete All Items" button for a library and can't quite get it. Anyone out there have any hints?
18:02 YoungPublicLibrarian Hello everyone. I need help creating a customized report.
18:02 cait                 hi YoungPublicLibrarian
17:58 cait                 oleonard++ jcamins++
17:58 cait                 sounds good to me :)
17:57 oleonard             Maybe "Disable/enable browsing and paging search results from the OPAC detail page
17:56 cait                 Disable/enable browsing and paging in results fromn the detail page in OPAC
17:54 cait                 OpacBrowseResults
17:54 cait                 I was thinking
17:54 cait                 yep
17:53 oleonard             Meaning the new navigation options on the detail page?
17:53 cait                 Disable/enable browsing result pages and ... in OPAC
17:52 cait                 i am stuck on describing the feature
17:51 huginn`              04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7935 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, katrin.fischer, NEW , Introduce sys pref to control 'browse results' in OPAC
17:51 cait                 I am searching for a nice description for the new system preference I propose in bug 7935
17:51 oleonard             Yes
17:51 cait                 oleonard: do you have a second to help a non native speaker? :)
17:49 cait                 oleonard: yeah :(
17:43 huginn`              04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7781 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, adrien.saurat, Pushed to Master , Enhancements to the main page (first step)
17:43 huginn`              04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7928 normal, P5 - low, ---, paul.poulain, NEW , suggestion, tags numbers missing from mainpage
17:43 * oleonard           was worried that Bug 7928 was going to happen if we redesigned the home page, didn't realize it would happen because of Bug 7781
17:34 cait                 that I saw when reading through your changes
17:34 cait                 like call number, card number, URL
17:34 cait                 I also did some normalizations
17:34 cait                 at least for the forms
17:34 cait                 I thought perhaps we can finish i toff
17:33 oleonard             Of course it's okay
17:33 cait                 hopefully I made not too many mistakes
17:33 oleonard             cait++ # for Easter holiday work
17:33 cait                 I hope it's ok - I tried continuing your work
17:33 oleonard             Hi cait
17:33 cait                 hi oleonard :)
17:33 cait                 I wish eythian would stop doing that
17:19 sekjal               and a good step towards metadata schema independence
17:19 jcamins              Yes, removing MARC definitions from frameworks would be a huge step towards our MARC support not being painful.
17:18 sekjal               marc defs could be file-based; they don't really change all that much
17:18 sekjal               hopefully structured in a way that would be as quick to load as possible
17:17 jcamins              That would be great.
17:17 sekjal               MARC definitions need to be separated from frameworks
17:16 jcamins              So the bug isn't that 090 doesn't appear on the expanded MARC view. It's that the "hidden" attribute hasn't been taken out back and shot.
17:15 jcamins              But it doesn't.
17:15 jcamins              I agree it should.
17:15 nengard              it's confusing to the librarian
17:15 nengard              my argument there is that it should control everything then
17:14 jcamins              Remember the "hidden" attribute only controls expanded MARC view and cataloging.
17:14 jcamins              nengard: did you check your frameworks re: 7933?
17:12 nengard              i see
17:12 nengard              oh
17:12 cait                 only check all / uncheck all would not work without selecting a vendor
17:12 cait                 and the checkboxes work
17:12 cait                 it works once you select a vendor
17:11 nengard              then the checkbox shouldn't be there at all - will go read the bug
17:11 cait                 it's because you can only do 1 vendor at a time
17:11 cait                 I explainedon the bug
17:11 nengard              that too seems silly
17:11 nengard              cait why would i not be allowed to check all the boxes on that page without a filter?
17:10 huginn`              04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=5347 blocker, P2, ---, jonathan.druart, ASSIGNED , late order management
17:10 cait                 bug 5347
17:10 cait                 nengard: I have an open bug for mails not working and a perl error message on that page
17:06 cait                 that's also by design :)
17:06 huginn`              04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7930 minor, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, NEW , late order report not showing 'check all'
17:06 cait                 I am writing a comment on bug 7930
17:06 sekjal               I know libraries that want to keep all orders for particular serial to be in the same basket, year after year
17:05 nengard              updated the report summary in the manual for now
17:05 cait                 but once you are placing the order, you sould close the basket
17:05 cait                 like when you want to reach a minimum order amount
17:05 cait                 you might keep orders open to gather titles you want to order
17:05 cait                 but I think it makes sense to make it a little more strict here
17:05 cait                 I think koha was less strict on tha tin the past
17:04 sekjal               that's how I typically use it
17:04 cait                 it's the only indicator we have for that
17:04 cait                 witht he vendor
17:04 cait                 the order has been placed
17:04 cait                 i think closing a basket means
17:04 sekjal               from a workflow point of view
17:04 sekjal               sounds like the problem is around open/closed baskets.  I think we need a more concrete idea of what that actually means
17:04 cait                 the pull down list gets too long
17:04 cait                 I have a library with over 600 vendors
17:04 cait                 I think it's better this way
17:03 nengard              for now i'll update the manual
17:03 nengard              just what i think will happen
17:03 nengard              okay if i close a basket it shows - but i can tell you that this is going to be a support question I get 100 times - libraries would rather see all their vendors and get a message saying no late orders for this vendor than having koha try to be smart for them
17:02 cait                 I think so - that's what i remember
17:02 nengard              then i need to document that it only works for closed baskets?
17:02 cait                 can you check by closing one o fthose orders?
17:02 cait                 that's why then probably
17:02 nengard              nope
17:02 nengard              and it's not showing them
17:02 cait                 are your orders closed?
17:02 nengard              cause i have other vendors with orders places last year
17:01 cait                 it depends
17:01 nengard              that's not true though
17:01 cait                 nengard: I think the late orders is clever - itshows only the branches with late orders
16:50 huginn`              bag: The current temperature in K6LCM-Westside/Mesa, Santa Barbara, California is 16.4°C (9:49 AM PDT on April 09, 2012). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 71%. Dew Point: 11.0°C. Pressure: 29.97 in 1015 hPa (Falling).
16:50 jwagner              Syntax in a patch you sent gave me a clue about how to solve a completely different problem.
16:50 bag                  @wunder 93109
16:50 cait                 jwagner: what for?
16:50 cait                 thx :)
16:50 nengard              will try :)
16:49 cait                 nengard: can you keep an eye on the new capitalization rules?
16:49 jwagner              cait++
16:48 nengard              can you all tell  that today is manual updating day? keep finding all kinds of little bugs :(
16:02 huginn`              04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7838 major, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, Signed Off , Add sort-string-utf.chr for Ukrainian and Russian
16:02 jcamins              Bug 7838
16:01 Morthland2           How can I test the overdue notice?
15:27 sekjal               so the rest of the code would just need to be wrapped in an 'else' statement
15:26 sekjal               I think a lot of them run in various conditionals
15:21 sekjal               but mod_perl doesn't like exit at all, 0 or 1
15:20 huginn`              04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7829 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, dpavlin, Pushed to Master , reports/ remove all exit(1) for plack
15:20 sekjal               bug 7829 is a start
15:16 jcamins              sekjal: didn't someone file a bug about that?
15:15 sekjal               at least that's what my reading is telling me
15:14 sekjal               plack is okay with them, so long as they're exit(0), but mod_perl doesn't like them at all
15:13 sekjal               apparently, those don't work so well for mod_perl
15:13 sekjal               hmmm, we have a lot of exit statements in our code.
15:13 cait                 and I thought we agreed on keeping it for administrators
15:13 cait                 hm if that is gone it's annoying
15:12 * jcamins            is one of those users. ;)
15:11 jcamins              wizzyrea: yes, only for users with permission to modify sysprefs.
15:11 cait                 and I did a lot of capitalization patches
15:10 cait                 oh
15:10 wizzyrea             no - but only for superlibrarians
15:10 jcamins              There should be.
15:10 jcamins              *tab
15:10 jcamins              Also, is there a syspref search box on the main page?
15:10 cait                 basically all hackfest in marseille
15:10 cait                 to me too - but I needed some time
15:10 jcamins              The removed features, not so much.
15:10 jcamins              wizzyrea: I think the search boxes make sense to me.
15:09 * wizzyrea           will look
15:09 * wizzyrea           is trying to decide if I don't like it because it's different or if I don't like it because it doesn't make sense.
15:09 cait                 hehe :)
15:09 cait                 I have some other nice bug fixes waiting for sign-off... *hint*
15:06 wizzyrea             :) no worries
15:06 cait                 but first I have to fix jared's bug
15:06 cait                 wizzyrea: we will get them back, don't worry
15:05 wizzyrea             oh I see.
15:05 sekjal               7781 skipped the normal QA process
15:04 * wizzyrea           would really be irritated if they went away.
15:04 wizzyrea             do you know, since the introduction of those numbers, pending suggestions and tags for libraries have dropped dramatically?
15:03 huginn`              04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7928 normal, P5 - low, ---, paul.poulain, NEW , suggestion, tags numbers missing from mainpage
15:03 wizzyrea             bug 7928
15:00 wizzyrea             yea
15:00 cait                 file a bug?
15:00 cait                 yep
15:00 wizzyrea             and the numbers thing needs to be fixed.
15:00 cait                 but it's really the same amount of clicks... hope that helps to make them scream less?
15:00 cait                 hm... I agree its a bigger change
14:59 wizzyrea             will have to be spoon fed to our librarians.
14:59 wizzyrea             yea, it's a pretty big change though
14:58 cait                 it's the same number of clicks
14:58 * wizzyrea           waits for the screaming
14:58 cait                 wizzyrea: the numbers are sure not intentional  - but the search boxes are on top now
14:58 wizzyrea             yea
14:58 wizzyrea             http://git.koha-community.org/gitweb/?p=koha.git;a=commit;h=3583eee50feee252e332707828874b34c8e51a37
14:58 huginn`              04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7781 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, adrien.saurat, Pushed to Master , Enhancements to the main page (first step)
14:58 jcamins              Bug 7781?
14:57 jcamins              Ummm...
14:57 huginn`              jcamins: 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7844 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, dpavlin, In Discussion , plack scripts for developers
14:57 huginn`              jcamins: 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=6875 blocker, P1 - high, ---, paul.poulain, ASSIGNED , de-nesting C4 packages
14:57 huginn`              jcamins: 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=6276 normal, P5 - low, ---, robin, NEW , Access denied for user ...@localhost
14:57 huginn`              jcamins: 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7623 major, P5 - low, ---, paul.poulain, NEW , help won't load on main page
14:57 huginn`              jcamins: 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=5515 major, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, NEW , Leading 'and' in search never returns a result
14:57 jcamins              @query mainpage
14:57 jcamins              Well, that didn't help.
14:56 huginn`              jcamins: 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=5438 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, kyle.m.hall, NEW , Holds managed in circ rules
14:56 huginn`              jcamins: 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7372 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, koha.sekjal, NEW , RoadTypes should be folded into Authorised Values
14:56 huginn`              jcamins: 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=6866 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, NEW , Accessing 'additem.pl' with no CGI params causes error
14:56 huginn`              jcamins: 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=3708 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, chris, NEW , Add another customizable region to the OPAC: right sidebar
14:56 huginn`              jcamins: 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=1778 enhancement, P3, ---, chris, NEW , Redirect to referring page from selectbranchprinter.pl
14:56 jcamins              @query main page
14:56 jcamins              It was just pushed...
14:56 wizzyrea             for the search boxes
14:56 jcamins              Check with oleonard, though.
14:56 wizzyrea             what was the bug
14:56 jcamins              I don't think they were intentional.
14:56 wizzyrea             ! oh boy.
14:56 jcamins              Not sure about the numbers.
14:56 jcamins              The search boxes were moved intentionally.
14:55 * wizzyrea           goes to look through commits
14:55 wizzyrea             (there are no search boxes or numbers anymore?)
14:55 wizzyrea             hm did we do this on purpose: 3.6.4: http://screencast.com/t/CUyYg639zD vs. Master: http://screencast.com/t/AcNAVm4DFxY
14:54 huginn`              04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7284 major, P3, ---, jcamins, Pushed to Master , Authority matching algorithm improvements
14:54 jcamins              Someone else eagerly awaiting bug 7284. :)
14:48 slef                 heh. fudge-packers.
14:45 cait                 well.. for a package of fudge....
14:45 chris_n              LOL
14:45 cait                 heh
14:44 * jcamins            is generous like that.
14:44 cait                 this one is small
14:44 cait                 heh
14:44 jcamins              You have my permission to do my bug first. :P
14:44 cait                 oh
14:44 huginn`              04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7926 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, oleonard, NEW , Acq search results show empty parenthesis for orders without basket group
14:44 jcamins              Bug 7926
14:43 cait                 right after 7926 :)
14:43 cait                 ok
14:43 cait                 ah right
14:41 huginn`              04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7845 normal, P5 - low, ---, katrin.fischer, NEW , Multiple 260s don't display properly in search results
14:41 jcamins              Bug 7845.
14:40 cait                 i remember that too :)
14:40 jcamins              cait: I remember there was one.
14:39 cait                 jcamins: do you remember the bug you filed I promise to fix?
14:38 chris_n              feel free to follow up with any suggestions
14:37 jcamins              Hehe.
14:37 chris_n              now its lab time
14:37 jcamins              Fun!
14:37 jcamins              Ah.
14:37 chris_n              we were just having a class in cataloging e-resources
14:37 cait                 jcamins: hi :)
14:37 chris_n              hi jcamins
14:37 * chris_n            heads off to utilize his new knowledge
14:37 jcamins              chris_n: I was, but I'm not anymore.
14:35 cait                 ah, but you only have normal, so not broken for you
14:35 cait                 isbd too
14:35 cait                 and it will work in all views :)
14:35 wizzyrea             noice!
14:35 cait                 will be in 3.8
14:35 cait                 I recently did {ISSN} :)
14:35 wizzyrea             it also enabled the facebook and twitter like+tweet thing
14:35 chris_n              thanks for the help wizzyrea & cait
14:34 wizzyrea             I'd have to go back and look.
14:34 wizzyrea             could be.
14:34 wizzyrea             hmm
14:34 cait                 {TITLE}
14:34 cait                 ah, I thnk that was nicole :)
14:34 wizzyrea             or <<author>>
14:33 wizzyrea             probably <<title>>
14:33 wizzyrea             so you can do http://site.you.want.to.search/query=<title> or soemthing
14:32 wizzyrea             yea, I think he added the bits and bobs that let you use certain tags in the more searches
14:32 chris_n              all of those links are duds
14:32 cait                 wizzyrea: magnus stuff?
14:32 chris_n              must of changed their structure?
14:32 cait                 now I got him :)
14:32 wahanui              jane eyre can be found at http://www.imdb.com/M/title-substring?title=jane+eyre&type=fuzzy
14:32 cait                 wahanui: imdb jane eyre
14:32 chris_n              opps
14:31 wizzyrea             weird!
14:31 wizzyrea             that is possible due to magnuse's stuff
14:31 cait                 aha!
14:31 wahanui              is jane eyre? can be found at http://www.imdb.com/M/title-substring?title=is+jane+eyre?&type=fuzzy
14:31 cait                 wahanui: imdb is jane eyre?
14:31 cait                 I shoul stop torturing the bot
14:31 wizzyrea             yea, that was a burst of inspiration I had one day when I realized that the query strings for IMDB were easy to pass queries to
14:31 wahanui              cait: I forgot imd
14:31 cait                 forget imd
14:31 cait                 forgt imd
14:31 cait                 lol
14:31 wahanui              OK, cait.
14:31 cait                 wahanui imd is a great idea
14:30 wahanui              i don't know, cait
14:30 cait                 wahanui: imdb?
14:30 cait                 where did wahanui learn this?
14:30 cait                 hm
14:30 cait                 imdb jane eyre
14:30 cait                 oh
14:30 chris_n              are you all doing your customization via css
14:29 wahanui              is a great idea! can be found at http://www.imdb.com/M/title-substring?title=is+a+great+idea!&type=fuzzy
14:29 cait                 wizzyrea: imdb is a great idea!
14:29 cait                 oleonard's catalog has something nice too
14:28 wizzyrea             ^^
14:28 cait                 chris_n: you can certainly make it more prominent using css
14:28 chris_n              this discussion has been a big help
14:28 cait                 [off] no 36 https://hfjs.bsz-bw.de/cgi-bin/koha/opac-search.pl?idx=kw&q=de-576&offset=40
14:28 chris_n              cait: nice
14:28 chris_n              I'd love to break it out and display it separately
14:27 cait                 chris_n: it shows on the result list too
14:27 chris_n              on the topic of formatting: our catalogers have entered most of the TOC data in our collection
14:26 cait                 it's repeated 856 with a u and an x or z (always confuse where the note goes)
14:26 chris_n              this is great
14:26 cait                 yep
14:26 cait                 I think it once was bigger...perhaps something wrong in the css
14:26 cait                 I should make the font bigger sometime
14:25 wizzyrea             if you don't like that list
14:25 wizzyrea             and it could be styled with jquery + css prolly
14:25 wizzyrea             with appropriate descriptions that would be just fine.
14:25 wizzyrea             oh, yea, that's not a bad display
14:25 huginn`              wizzyrea: The operation succeeded.  Quote #199 added.
14:25 wizzyrea             @quote add chris_n: considering marc is scary to us, I can't imagine what it does to patrons.
14:24 cait                 [off] https://hfjs.bsz-bw.de/cgi-bin/koha/opac-detail.pl?biblionumber=56
14:24 wizzyrea             ^^
14:24 chris_n              considering marc is scarry to us, I can't imagine what it does to patrons
14:24 wizzyrea             actually that's what it looks like in production too :)
14:24 wizzyrea             we are patron friendly here >.>
14:24 chris_n              :)
14:24 wizzyrea             >.>
14:24 * chris_n            misses the marc view on wizzyrea's test system
14:23 wizzyrea             yea, the OR is 856
14:23 cait                 chris_n: but yes to your question
14:23 cait                 sec
14:23 cait                 searching for an exmaple
14:23 chris_n              cait: do you just lump them all on the same line in your item display?
14:22 chris_n              so the "Online Resources:" field is 856?
14:22 chris_n              pictures++
14:22 chris_n              wizzyrea that helps
14:21 cait                 becaue of catalog enrichment from the union catalog
14:21 wizzyrea             we have a not-for-loan status of download
14:21 cait                 we have lots of urls
14:21 wizzyrea             I believe
14:21 wizzyrea             now, we don't have more than one, but we don't have your situation either
14:21 cait                 hi wizzyrea :)
14:21 wizzyrea             we do them like this
14:21 wizzyrea             http://catalog-test.nexpresslibrary.org/cgi-bin/koha/opac-detail.pl?biblionumber=433883
14:21 cait                 I would keep it on the same record
14:21 cait                 content / presentation wise
14:20 cait                 so as long as all urls lead to the same resource
14:20 cait                 that will show
14:20 chris_n              we will retain some local copies to avoid future unavailability
14:20 cait                 you can give a description for each 856
14:20 chris_n              sometimes public domain resources disappear
14:20 chris_n              ie... I serve a copy locally, but also want to reference it on the i-net
14:20 wizzyrea             hmm
14:19 chris_n              URL
14:19 wizzyrea             well, define location?
14:19 chris_n              so I should probably set off on the path of a new bib for e-resources and then one per location?
14:19 wizzyrea             < publics
14:18 wizzyrea             dvd
14:18 wizzyrea             large print, mass market, etc
14:18 chris_n              ahh
14:18 chris_n              or are e-resources not in the set of items?
14:18 wizzyrea             we add new bibs whenever the medium changes.
14:18 chris_n              right
14:17 wizzyrea             not real items
14:17 wizzyrea             e-items
14:17 wizzyrea             oh, never mind.
14:17 chris_n              ie, should I have one bib for each resource location?
14:17 wizzyrea             for what it's worth
14:16 * chris_n            thinks life just got harder for some reason...
14:16 chris_n              so is there a "norm" for when to add "duplicate" bibs and when to add more items to the same bib?
14:15 cait                 the one in the database or the one from zebra
14:15 cait                 not sure which xml is used
14:15 cait                 you probably can't
14:15 cait                 since we removed the items from the xml
14:14 cait                 thinking yout it , not sure you can
14:14 cait                 hm
14:14 cait                 items in general are not dealt with in the xsl
14:14 cait                 but
14:14 cait                 I tihnk you could
14:14 chris_n              so 952$u is not easily added to the stylesheet?
14:14 cait                 but much harder to make it display nicely if you want to change the default
14:13 chris_n              that was staring me in the face...
14:13 chris_n              well... it must be monday
14:13 cait                 952 $u I think
14:13 chris_n              ahh
14:13 cait                 have an url in the item
14:13 cait                 you can do that
14:13 cait                 why have it in the bib?
14:13 * chris_n            considers a case where two items attached to a bib reference copies of the resource at different locations... url-ly speaking
14:12 chris_n              why not have the resource url in the item rather than the bib?
14:11 sekjal               apparently it's Dyngus Day (http://www.dyngusdaybuffalo.com/whatisdyngusday.html)
14:11 chris_n              hmm
14:09 wizzyrea             hehe
14:09 * chris_n            was beginning to think he missed a holiday or some such ;-)
14:09 wizzyrea             mornin
14:09 chris_n              cool
14:09 chris_n              hi wizzyrea
14:08 cait                 and you can make any field display that is in your marcxml
14:08 chris_n              http://openlibrary.org/dev/docs/bookreader
14:08 cait                 and there is already a lot of code for that in the xsl stylesheets
14:08 cait                 yes you can repeat 856
14:08 cait                 ah
14:08 chris_n              internet archive
14:08 cait                 IA's reader?
14:07 * chris_n            is integrating IA's reader into his koha
14:07 cait                 there is also a system preference to show correctly formatted 856 as pictures in the record I think
14:07 chris_n              what I'm speaking of here is the links to the different electronic formats
14:07 cait                 ah ok
14:07 * chris_n            will be using that too
14:07 chris_n              yes
14:07 chris_n              cait: can I add any field to my xml stylesheet?
14:07 cait                 chris_n: are you aware of the super cool feature jared did for local cover images?
14:06 cait                 slef: scary :)
14:06 chris_n              the more the merrier they say
14:06 * slef               fails to log in on someone's website and sulks.
14:06 slef                 cait: apparently :)
14:06 chris_n              hehe
14:06 chris_n              repeated
14:06 cait                 I am recorded and repeatable? :P
14:06 chris_n              I'd use that field
14:06 chris_n              so if I want to mimic something like the left side of this page: http://archive.org/details/inmemoriamhamil00broogoog
14:05 Oak                  cait++
14:05 chris_n              ahh
14:05 huginn`              slef: recorded. (Repeatable)
14:05 slef                 @more cait
14:05 huginn`              chris_n: unknown tag more
14:05 chris_n              @marc more
14:05 huginn`              chris_n: Error: You haven't asked me a command; perhaps you want to see someone else's more.  To do so, call this command with that person's nick.
14:05 chris_n              @more
14:05 huginn`              cait: Uniform Resource Identifier The URI, which provides standard syntax for locating an object using existing Internet protocols. Field 856 is structured to allow for the creation of a URL from the concatenation of other separate 856 subfields. Subfield $u may be used instead of those separate subfields or in addition to them.Subfield $u may be repeated only if both a URN or a URL or more than one URN are (1 more message)
14:05 cait                 @marc 856 u
14:05 huginn`              cait: unknown tag u
14:05 cait                 @marc u
14:04 huginn`              cait: The information needed to locate and access an electronic resource. The field may be used in a bibliographic record for a resource when that resource or a subset of it is available electronically. In addition, it may be used to locate and access an electronic version of a non-electronic resource described in the bibliographic record or a related electronic resource. (Repeatable) (1 more message)
14:04 cait                 @marc 856
14:04 chris_n              cait: what field is typically used for url's in electronic resources?
14:04 Oak                  :)
14:03 cait                 the fourth sign of madness?
14:03 cait                 now I want to!
14:03 cait                 oh
14:03 Oak                  never mind
14:03 Oak                  *sigh*
14:03 Oak                  don't ask the 4rd
14:03 wahanui              i guess the second sign of madness is hairs on the palms of my hands
14:03 cait                 the second sign of madness?
14:02 cait                 hi chris_n
13:45 wahanui              the first sign of madness is, like, looking for hairs on the palms of my hands
13:45 slef                 wahanui: the first sign of madness?
13:43 chris_n              lol
13:42 wahanui              errrrgh arrrrgh stop it that tickles a bit!
13:42 slef                 wahanui: die!
13:42 slef                 die!
13:42 wahanui              yes, chris_n?
13:42 chris_n              wahanui ?
13:41 * chris_n            bangs a pot to see if anyone is awake :-)
13:38 chris_n              hi cait
13:38 * chris_n            wonders if jcamins_away really is
12:22 cait                 hm not too bad :)
12:22 slef                 cait: at least 17
12:20 * cait               is excited and working on the reviews.
12:20 cait                 :)
12:20 cait                 slef: how many people registered so far?
12:20 slef                 yeah, glad we're not that big
12:20 cait                 well. we don't want to get that big
12:20 cait                 ouch
12:19 slef                 more like GBP 35000
12:18 slef                 ow
12:18 slef                 http://rkd.zgib.net/http/debconf/accounting-balances.txt
12:18 slef                 I just found the accounts :)
12:18 slef                 hrm, actually GBP 25,000
12:15 slef                 debconf is over GBP 12,000 but they have many rooms and pay for some people's food and hotels and so on
12:12 slef                 no, indeed
12:11 cait                 it's still not a lot for a multi-day conference
12:11 slef                 as crowd-funding sites penalise you if you don't reach the target
12:11 slef                 I was going to set GBP 2500 as the target for crowd-funding if we did that
12:10 cait                 slef: yeah, so will not work
12:10 slef                 cait: wikipedia set a target
12:10 slef                 cait: the venue is reasonably-priced. We are hoping it is OK.
12:10 cait                 but hard to predict the total, as you say
12:10 cait                 telling people how close
12:10 cait                 i thought about how wikipedia does it - have a scale or something
12:09 cait                 I think it will work out
12:09 cait                 hmm I thought more even :)
12:09 slef                 cait: too many variables. I think GBP 2000 + printing + maybe transport (moving equipment and so on) + whatever else we want to do.
12:06 cait                 slef: do you have an idea yet how much money we will need in total?
12:06 cait                 slef: thx for changing the sponsoring text :)
12:05 jcamins              slef: I figured.
12:05 slef                 jcamins: that's not cursing. That's what I was wondering about having as a trading name. It would appear before your aaaa11111 bibliography services in the support directory.
12:04 jcamins              :)
12:04 slef                 :)
12:04 slef                 jcamins: *&!&*&$$!
12:04 slef                 cait: need all three
12:03 slef                 cait: money && social && environmental
12:00 jcamins              slef: do you know, I was thinking about doing business as "aaaa11111 bibliography services." ;)
12:00 cait                 but by the way this community works... I don't like to see so much value being put on money - sure we need it...
12:00 slef                 that's been the hardest thing for me about organising this one
11:59 cait                 giving others an idea about costs is not wrong
11:59 cait                 I think that's ok
11:59 slef                 (depending what comes in)
11:59 slef                 I agree on the confidential in general, but I'll publish a summary account of the conference and maybe hand over some money to kohacon13
11:59 cait                 hm
11:58 slef                 no me neither... previous kohacons have been a bit more opaque about money than I like
11:58 slef                 meaningful names are better than "aaaa1111 koha co"
11:58 cait                 I am not sure how other kohacons did it
11:58 cait                 random would work for me
11:57 slef                 My company names have started with s and t
11:57 cait                 youare not a librarian :)
11:57 cait                 heh
11:57 slef                 I hate alphabetic.
11:57 cait                 or alphabetic
11:57 slef                 I wonder if we can use the same thing that does the paid support listing. I'll ask wizzyrea
11:57 cait                 would work for me
11:57 cait                 random
11:56 slef                 OK... so should the ordering be random, would you say?
11:56 slef                 I can encourage them to sponsor earlier (which will help) by including them in more announcements.
11:56 cait                 yes, but I think it will work without so much encouragement
11:56 slef                 I was thinking, you see, what is there to encourage sponsors to give more than the minimum level?
11:55 cait                 give sponsors a lot
11:55 cait                 I don't think we have to do that
11:55 slef                 (I agree about the small amounts are big amounts for small companies)
11:54 slef                 cait: I agree. That's why I wanted the Kind Hearts level and not just the big one. I also wanted the numbers in general clear on the call for sponsors.
11:54 cait                 so mentioning whohas already sponsoered is ok for me, but the listing order ... I don't like that
11:53 cait                 it should be confidential
11:53 cait                 and I don't think we should encourage a "X gave more than y"
11:53 cait                 slef: I think this is a bit too much for me to feel comfortable with - small amounts can be big amounts for small companies
11:52 slef                 cait: I think know how you feel about the levels in general - this is all a bit icky, but more money means better kohacon12
11:52 cait                 i am still not sure we should put such a heavy weight on the amount
11:52 cait                 hm
11:51 slef                 cait: do you think the new paragraph on http://koha-community.org/kohacon12/sponsoring-kohacon12/ is OK? (Starts "We will announce sponsors...")
11:49 cait                 and I got the confirmation
11:49 cait                 slef: yay :)
11:45 slef                 hi sha
11:45 sha                  hii
11:45 slef                 I think sponsors 3 and 4 have just come on board too, but I'll confirm that once banks open again!
11:44 Oak                  good night rangi
11:42 jcamins              That's why I was waiting to submit a proposal, so I knew whether to propose a presentation via Skype/whatever, or whether I needed someone to read the talk.
11:42 slef                 thank rangi
11:42 rangi                ok, bedtime
11:41 jcamins              slef: yeah, I saw that.
11:41 slef                 jcamins: oh I think mle said internet is confirmed. Did you see it / should I check?
11:41 * jcamins            wants to call it "Analyze everything! Analytic records in Koha"
11:40 * jcamins            needs to submit a proposal for a remote talk on analytics.
11:40 Oak                  found it: http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.0/en/replication.html
11:40 slef                 yes, I am sure
11:40 cait                 I think close to the deadline will be some more
11:40 cait                 cool
11:40 slef                 cait: 9
11:39 cait                 hm
11:39 jcamins              And it's in one of the containers that I generally use for freezing things.
11:39 * Oak                Googles "mysql replication"
11:39 jcamins              It's not enough antifreeze to do anything useful.
11:39 jcamins              We have *never* had a car in the city.
11:38 Oak                  can you kindly point me to some link... as i don't know what the term 'replication' means for DB backup.
11:38 jcamins              We don't have a car.
11:38 cait                 slef: how many submissions so far?
11:38 jcamins              We have a sealed container with something that looks very much like antifreeze sitting on my dresser.
11:38 cait                 what did you find?
11:38 jcamins              You know, sometimes one discovers the weirdest things around one's home.
11:37 slef                 ok, cool
11:37 slef                 everything else is out to reviewers
11:37 cait                 why not :)
11:37 slef                 cait: would you like some hackfest papers?
11:37 rangi                Oak: replication is easy, if you have a spare box to replicate too, (and if losing a days data is a worry)
11:36 cait                 slef: anything to review for me? :)
11:36 cait                 oh
11:36 Oak                  congratulations rangi :)
11:36 Oak                  for now, RAID is not in the equation.
11:36 slef                 (and congratulations to rafael on having the second paper accepted for kohacon12)
11:36 rangi                yay!
11:35 slef                 congratulations to rangi on having the first paper accepted for kohacon12 ;)
11:35 jcamins              Do the backup off the slave.
11:35 rangi                yep
11:35 * jcamins            would recommend replication.
11:35 rangi                plus running a dump, works the db hard
11:35 Oak                  yes
11:34 rangi                or if the disk dies, your still out
11:34 Oak                  to add time also
11:34 rangi                still need a script to copy it off
11:34 Oak                  how about I modify the /usr/sbin/koha-run-backups: these lines -- tardump="$dirname/$name/$name-$date.tar.gz"
11:34 rangi                and/or running replication
11:33 rangi                but if you are doing that much cataloguing, you should have the disk raided
11:33 rangi                yep
11:33 rangi                you'd need to wrap it with a script that copied the backup somewhere, also, mysqldump works the db
11:33 Oak                  :) hm. what if i do work all day (cataloging) and at 11:50pm the hard disk dies; suppose, then whole days' work will be lost.
11:32 rangi                because it will just overwrite itself
11:31 rangi                as it is yes
11:31 jcamins              Yes.
11:31 Oak                  will it be crazy to put the backup command in cron.hourly?
11:30 rangi                jcamins: yep i should be asleep, will be soon
11:29 Oak                  hmm
11:29 Oak                  i also found it in /usr/sbin/koha-run-backups
11:28 Oak                  ah cool... okay good.
11:28 jcamins_away         Oak: that's how many days worth of backups to keep in /var/spool/koha
11:28 jcamins_away         rangi: you're up late.
11:26 Oak                  what does the --days 2 switch means?
11:26 Oak                  yes, crap... I was looking at all the long lines
11:25 Oak                  koha-run-backups --days 2 --output /var/spool/koha
11:25 rangi                yep
11:25 rangi                last line
11:25 rangi                :)
11:25 Oak                  in the end
11:25 Oak                  sorry
11:25 Oak                  yes it is there
11:25 Oak                  no no
11:24 Oak                  yes
11:24 rangi                where in cron.daily?
11:24 Oak                  hmm, i don't see "koha-run-backups" command in there... by the way.
11:21 rangi                you'll want to take the command, and write a little bash script around it, to do the ftp/samba stuff then put that in /etc/cron.d/koha-common
11:21 rangi                thats what does the backups
11:20 Oak                  okie dokie
11:20 rangi                look in /etc/cron.daily/koha-common
11:20 Oak                  yes
11:20 rangi                Oak: you are using packages eh?
11:19 Oak                  nothing on wiki on cron?
11:19 Oak                  to a remote location: on FTP plus on local network using samba.
11:19 * Oak                needs to learn how to set up hourly backups of Koha.
11:17 Oak                  hmm
11:16 cait                 back to work tomorrow
11:16 cait                 yes, monday is a holiday here
11:16 Oak                  cait! easter holidays ?
11:16 Oak                  kia ora #koha
08:50 cait                 perhaps
08:47 cait                 we can tell him tomorrow I guess
08:46 rangi                yeah not sure what is up with his computer
08:43 cait                 we should glue eythian to the channel
08:43 cait                 hi slef
08:43 rangi                hiya slef
08:41 slef                 hi all
08:21 huginn`              rangi: The operation succeeded.
08:21 rangi                @later tell paul_p bug 7743 has the fix for the failing test on jenkins
08:12 cait                 aber eigentlich ist es ja auch gar nicht mehr so früh :)
08:11 cait                 bugs schlafen nicht ;)
08:09 adnc                 schon so früh wach
08:09 adnc                 morgen cait
08:09 cait                 hi adnc :)
08:04 adnc                 rangi, hi
08:04 rangi                hi adnc
08:04 Brooke               hey eythian
08:04 adnc                 hi Brooke
08:03 Brooke               hi adnc
07:36 Brooke               not too bad > eh
07:36 Brooke               :)
07:35 rangi                not too bad
07:35 Brooke               i pehea to ra?
07:35 Brooke               :)
07:35 rangi                hi Brooke
07:34 Brooke               o/
07:08 cait                 :)
07:08 rangi                I heard about my suprise party because Kate blabbed about it
07:07 rangi                To blab, to talk a lot usually about something you shouldn't be telling ppl
07:07 cait                 jcamins said scrabble would help my vocabulary.... lots of weird new words
07:06 cait                 I have to look that up :)
07:06 rangi                Yep one good thing, helped my scrabble score
06:31 cait                 were you inspired by mbalmer's blabla? and then 33 points!
06:31 cait                 blab.
06:18 cait                 morning #koha