Time  Nick           Message
23:57 eythian        ah, I see
23:57 rangi          http://www.liblime.com/liblime-and-waldo-announce-that-liblime-academic-koha-48-is-now-in-production-release-and-is-already-in-use-by-dozens-of-liblime-academic-library-customers-?a=1&c=1254
23:57 rangi          and 4.8 in production
23:57 rangi          yes
23:56 eythian        the latest branch in there is 4.2
23:56 eythian        and there is a comment "Backport of 4.4 spine label fixes" for a commit
23:56 eythian        so, the last update to LL was July
23:56 eythian        hmm
23:55 chrisdothall   haha awesome
23:54 wizzyrea       haha
23:54 rangi          hehe
23:54 rangi          http://twitpic.com/7ikyb6
23:49 wizzyrea       that's fair. I'll probably do that after bedtime
23:49 rangi          or something
23:49 rangi          Updated by Blah
23:49 rangi          she wont be able to today, i think its community property you can update, just sign it
23:47 wizzyrea       also there are lots of nice comments on the blog that could use a response
23:46 wizzyrea       but i'm not really comfortable with updating joann's post myself
23:46 wizzyrea       eventually we'll need to update the plea with latest developments and possibly links to the coverage
23:46 rangi          thats a fairly decent summary
23:43 wizzyrea       http://www.itwire.com/business-it-news/open-source/51343-koha-in-fight-to-regain-its-own-trademark
23:42 wizzyrea       i thought so
23:42 eythian        wizzyrea: that's really interesting
23:42 aarkerio       thanks!
23:42 aarkerio       git branch --track 3.4.x origin/3.4.x
23:37 rangi          git checkout -b 3.4.x origin/3.4.x.
23:37 rangi          so git clone  git://git.koha-community.org/koha.git
23:37 rangi          its just a branch
23:37 rangi          :)
23:37 rangi          not like that
23:33 aarkerio       git clone git://git.koha-community.org/koha-3.4.git
23:33 aarkerio       how can I get koha 3.4? I tried:
23:31 wizzyrea       http://arstechnica.com/science/news/2011/11/over-time-linux-package-dependencies-show-predatorprey-relationship.ars
23:26 eythian        http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2539798&cid=38153566 <-- haha
22:52 wizzyrea       of course we shouldn't have to do that
22:52 wizzyrea       i wonder how much we'd have to pay to get our domain
22:51 rangi          i wonder how much money is needed to be considered equitable by them
22:50 rangi          http://serials.infomotions.com/code4lib/archive/2011/201111/2767.html
22:49 * wizzyrea     wonders about civilization
22:48 wizzyrea       I don't even...
22:47 wizzyrea       i am both.
22:47 chrisdothall   idk if to be impressed or disguted...
22:47 wizzyrea       mhm
22:47 eythian        wizzyrea: ...
22:45 wizzyrea       http://cmdrtaco.net/2011/11/turbaconepicentipede/
22:39 eythian        heh
22:38 wizzyrea       i knew which one you meant. I'm not sure how exactly, but I knew.
22:38 eythian        I meant the blog post that has lots of comments
22:38 eythian        oh, I'm being confusing
22:37 wizzyrea       are there more?
22:36 wizzyrea       *nod*
22:36 eythian        the apparent about-face of attitude from clay in those comments is interesting.
22:36 wizzyrea       anything they do that doesn't involve HLT is against us
22:36 wizzyrea       that's a done, documented deal
22:35 wizzyrea       right, well we've (community) already voted and agreed that HLT is the trustee for the IP assets
22:35 eythian        slef: agreed
22:35 slef           I just had that sinking feeling reading the PR, that we were back in 2010(?)
22:35 wizzyrea       that's what I'm hoping for
22:34 wizzyrea       *nod*
22:34 slef           wizzyrea: actually, other comments say HLT, so maybe it could be great
22:34 wizzyrea       slef: if the press release is a stalling tactic, we hope joann won't fall for it. If it isn't and they transfer the TM to the US foundation instead of HLT, that sucks but they're still the bad guy. If they transfer the TM to HLT, that's pretty great.
22:32 wizzyrea       nice eythian
22:25 slef           how many % of the vote will PTFS try to get this time?
22:24 slef           oh no it's the foundation idea again
22:24 eythian        http://yro.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2539798&cid=38150186 <-- tee hee (if I do say so myself)
22:23 francharb_away good night all!
22:22 wizzyrea       good night magnus_away
22:22 magnuse        good night #koha!
22:22 * magnuse      feels optimistic about the outcome of the tm debacle too now...
22:19 rangi          yay for solving it
22:19 magnuse        it sure would ;-)
22:19 rangi          ahh yeah that would do it
22:19 rangi          :)
22:19 magnuse        community++
22:19 magnuse        YES fixed it - was a missing "Koha to MARC Mapping" for items.itemnumber. feels like i should have found that way earlier. thanks to everyone who tried to help
22:18 ibeardslee     to me, it seems that there is some evolution (in a very short time) of PTFS' stance
22:16 wizzyrea       yea saw that one. Weasely.
22:16 eythian        http://yro.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2539798&cid=38149840
22:16 wizzyrea       nope
22:15 rangi          wizzyrea: yeah well we didnt really expect ptfs/liblime meant it eh?
22:15 wizzyrea       nah, i'm not
22:15 ibeardslee     you'd be surprised (or maybe not) the number of 'open geeks' that go for the macbooks/iphones etc
22:14 wizzyrea       *shrug* his loss.
22:14 * wizzyrea     notes "twitter for iPhone" realizes he's probably not so keen on the idea of "open"
22:13 wizzyrea       wow that's snarktastic.
22:12 rangi          https://twitter.com/#!/obelos/status/139460851756302337
22:11 eythian        heh
22:11 ibeardslee     I think John Key is in cahoots with PTFS/Liblime to take the media attention away from the teapottapes
22:09 eythian        (so, it'll be online in half an hour or so)
22:09 eythian        mtj: as in, the real radio right now?
22:07 mtj            wow, Koha story on NZ nat radio again... O_o
21:58 maximep        snow tire would have been useful. oh well.
21:58 huginn         maximep: The current temperature in Montreal, Quebec is -1.0�C (4:00 PM EST on November 23, 2011). Conditions: Light Snow. Humidity: 80%. Dew Point: -4.0�C. Windchill: -6.0�C. Pressure: 29.99 in 1016 hPa (Rising).
21:58 maximep        @wunder yul
21:57 magnuse        huh? doesn't feel like it at the moment
21:57 huginn         magnuse: The current temperature in Bodo, Norway is 9.0�C (10:20 PM CET on November 23, 2011). Conditions: Scattered Clouds. Humidity: 58%. Dew Point: 1.0�C. Pressure: 29.24 in 990 hPa (Falling).
21:57 magnuse        @wunder boo
21:55 cait           night all :)
21:55 francharb_away always on strike over here... ;^)
21:55 francharb_away ;)
21:55 francharb_away if i can catch a train, i'm happy...
21:54 cait           heh
21:54 rangi          and ppl were muttering
21:54 rangi          yes it was leaving the station
21:53 cait           sure you got that right?
21:53 cait           30 seconds?
21:53 rangi          if one gets here within 10 mins late im happy ;)
21:53 rangi          in zurich
21:53 rangi          i remember ppl complaining a train was 30 seconds late
21:52 cait           heh
21:52 rangi          oh they are even more precise !!!
21:52 cait           I assume the time of the reading is correct
21:52 rangi          not laissez faire :-)
21:52 cait           the weather station is in switzerland
21:52 rangi          i suspect being german they are being efficient and doing 15 min readings ;-)
21:52 francharb_away :)
21:52 francharb_away ahhhhhhhhh
21:52 rangi          not the current time
21:51 rangi          francharb_away: its the time the reading was taken
21:51 francharb_away weird
21:50 francharb_away lyon 10:30pm -> konstanz 10:45pm...
21:50 huginn         rangi: The current temperature in Wellington, New Zealand is 11.0�C (10:00 AM NZDT on November 24, 2011). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 88%. Dew Point: 9.0�C. Pressure: 29.74 in 1007 hPa (Rising).
21:50 rangi          @wunder wellington nz
21:50 francharb_away how is it possible to be 15 min ahead from us?
21:50 wizzyrea       oh hey it's nice out there.
21:50 huginn         wizzyrea: The current temperature in Channel 6 Downtown, Lawrence, Kansas is 15.4�C (3:47 PM CST on November 23, 2011). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 58%. Dew Point: 7.0�C. Pressure: 30.15 in 1020.9 hPa (Steady).
21:50 wizzyrea       @wunder lawrence, ks
21:49 huginn         cait: The current temperature in Taegerwilen, Taegerwilen, Germany is 1.2�C (10:45 PM CET on November 23, 2011). Conditions: Overcast. Humidity: 95%. Dew Point: 1.0�C. Windchill: 1.0�C. Pressure: 30.50 in 1032.7 hPa (Steady).
21:49 cait           @wunder Konstanz
21:48 huginn         francharb_away: The current temperature in Lyon, France is 3.0�C (10:30 PM CET on November 23, 2011). Conditions: Overcast. Humidity: 100%. Dew Point: 3.0�C. Pressure: 30.39 in 1029 hPa (Rising).
21:48 francharb_away @wunder lyon france
21:43 wizzyrea       http://screencast.com/t/aT5u2F9dh
21:43 rangi          pretty amazing
21:42 wizzyrea       http://screencast.com/t/UkNqKbAVZiN
21:41 wizzyrea       wow seriously I think most every major burg in nz is reflected in our stats from yesterday.
21:39 wizzyrea       in the 50ish visitor range
21:39 huginn         ebegin: The current temperature in Montreal, Quebec is -1.0�C (4:00 PM EST on November 23, 2011). Conditions: Light Snow. Humidity: 80%. Dew Point: -4.0�C. Windchill: -6.0�C. Pressure: 29.99 in 1016 hPa (Rising).
21:39 ebegin         @wunder montreal canada
21:39 wizzyrea       and lots of little nz towns :D
21:38 wizzyrea       168 from sydney, 155 melbourne,
21:38 wizzyrea       290 from chch
21:38 wizzyrea       864 from wellington
21:38 wizzyrea       1057 reported from auckland
21:38 rangi          slashdot is a pale shadow of what it used to be
21:37 wizzyrea       that's a rather pitiful slashdot. :P
21:37 wizzyrea       (slashdot time)
21:37 wizzyrea       1400 was max hour, 6pm our time
21:36 rangi          wow
21:35 wizzyrea       14k page views
21:35 cait           wow
21:35 wizzyrea       7186 unique visitors to kc.org yesterday
21:34 rangi          heh
21:34 wizzyrea       I'd always change the desktop to pictures of kittens and leave them a note: I changed the desktop to a different pussy, hope you don't mind.
21:33 chrisdothall   rangi: fanastic
21:33 wizzyrea       so I'd have to work on these computers
21:33 wizzyrea       when I worked in desktop support for students at my uni, sometimes we'd get guys bringing in their computer with pictures that were... how to say... inappropriate
21:32 rangi          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0n8obOY_j8
21:32 ibeardslee     I just give people a "My little Ponies" desktop wallpaper
21:32 rangi          the original
21:32 rangi          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vq36Y-IN6fE
21:32 wizzyrea       lolol
21:31 rangi          to everyone in the company
21:31 rangi          "Nekk Minnit"
21:31 rangi          "I walked away from my computer"
21:31 wizzyrea       lol
21:31 rangi          just got an email
21:31 rangi          funny things happen
21:31 rangi          if you walk away from your computer here, and dont lock it
21:31 rangi          lol
21:30 * wizzyrea     just had squash casserole
21:30 rangi          hehe
21:30 cait           now I start getting hungry again
21:30 wizzyrea       stuffing crust especially.
21:29 wizzyrea       *nod*
21:29 rangi          that sounds good
21:24 wizzyrea       stuffing crust, with cranberry sauce, then mashed potatoes, gravy, and turkey
21:24 wizzyrea       I think sekjal was telling me of his mythical "thanksgiving pizza"
21:23 trea           good luck getting that thing cooked in the middle :P
21:23 wizzyrea       mouse
21:23 rangi          hehe
21:23 rangi          i forgot squirrel
21:23 wizzyrea       rat
21:23 rangi          squirrel
21:23 rangi          blue whale, elephant, cow, pig, goose duck chicken
21:23 wizzyrea       oh I see what you did there
21:23 trea           i c wut u did thar
21:23 rangi          i already went past elephant
21:22 rangi          bluewhaelecopigooducken
21:22 trea           hehe
21:22 magnuse        it's fastfood!
21:22 trea           turboduck sounds confusing
21:21 wizzyrea       zoom!
21:21 * wizzyrea     marvels
21:21 magnuse        or just a turboduck
21:21 wizzyrea       elephant?
21:21 wizzyrea       it might be a bit of a challenge to fit a duck into a goose. How about a turgooducken
21:21 rangi          my work here is done
21:20 rangi          i think ive taken it to its extreme now
21:20 wizzyrea       I think we overcooked it.
21:20 wizzyrea       I tried to make a goose.
21:20 rangi          goose duck chicken
21:20 rangi          bluewhaelecopigooducken
21:20 * wizzyrea     still wants to know what a goo-ducken is
21:20 rangi          elecopigooducken
21:19 wizzyrea       how about a nice sushi boat.
21:19 rangi          or copogooducken
21:19 nengard        not a fan of any of those either
21:19 rangi          :)
21:19 rangi          or gooducken
21:19 rangi          nengard: you can just have ducken
21:18 magnuse        gah, now i can't even seem to turn query logging on in mysql...
21:14 nengard        just saying
21:14 nengard        rangi, thanksgiving isn't the best holiday if you're not a fan of turkey ....
21:04 wizzyrea       ;)
21:04 wizzyrea       "with heat, idiot"
21:03 wizzyrea       when I'm not wondering hth you cook such a thing.
21:03 rangi          hehe
21:03 wizzyrea       I laugh every time I walk by them
21:03 wizzyrea       we have those in the freezer section of our grocery store
21:03 chrisdothall   yeah I just found it.
21:03 rangi          lol
21:03 chrisdothall   omg..
21:02 rangi          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turducken
21:02 chrisdothall   christmas, etc, are far too commercialised :(
21:02 chrisdothall   heh turducken?
21:01 rangi          just food
21:01 rangi          no presents
21:01 rangi          thanksgiving is in my opinion the best holiday
21:01 chris_n        yum, yum!
21:00 rangi          and a turducken
21:00 rangi          have some candied yams for me
21:00 * chris_n      heads out for Thanksgiving
20:58 wahanui        thanks cait :)
20:58 cait           wahanui botsnack cookie
20:57 * wizzyrea     pats wahanui
20:57 rangi          http://lists.katipo.co.nz/pipermail/koha/2011-November/031334.html
20:57 wahanui        wizzyrea: I forgot this
20:57 wizzyrea       forget this
20:56 wahanui        and this is the most crowded syspref tab
20:56 rangi          oh and this
20:56 wizzyrea       hmm, more koha on NZ radio
20:55 nengard        what'd i miss?
20:55 nengard        which is a good thing
20:55 nengard        back from PT - my legs feel like jello :)
20:55 nengard        all
20:55 nengard        hiya al
20:55 rangi          sup nengard
20:55 * cait         waves at nengard
20:50 rangi          im sure when she sees the developments should could get lawyers to draft the promise so ptfs/liblime can hand the application over
20:48 rangi          i think in meetings in wellington
20:48 rangi          she is not online or in levin today
20:48 rangi          i dont know/think so
20:47 * wizzyrea     assumes so
20:47 wizzyrea       rangi: does joann know of the new developments?
20:46 rangi          there is no need to wait 3 months
20:46 * chris_n      too
20:46 wizzyrea       *nod*
20:46 rangi          but I really really hope they do sign the app over
20:46 * chris_n      remembers the many "meetings" w/ptfs during the previous dispute
20:46 rangi          its business as usual
20:46 rangi          well i think until the application is signed over
20:46 wizzyrea       I'd like to be cautiously optimistic
20:46 wizzyrea       agreed.
20:46 chris_n        here's wishing that's not a delay tactic
20:45 wizzyrea       there is some hint in that original exemplar of stupid blog post that PTFS is at least considering signing the TM over to HLT
20:45 wizzyrea       the newest thing from rangi on the list is interesting too
20:44 chris_n        nice publicity
20:42 ibeardslee     http://nzoss.org.nz/content/koha-community-opposes-ptfs-trademark
20:36 rangi          oleonard++
20:36 rangi          heh
20:35 oleonard       Happy Thanksgiving to US'ers, Happy four-day-weekend without US'ers everyone else!
20:27 rangi          so as not to clash with ALA which is in late june
20:27 liw            ack
20:27 rangi          early june i think was the last i heard
20:26 liw            hey, rangi
20:26 liw            oh, ok
20:26 rangi          hey its liw! ;)
20:26 cait           sometime june
20:26 cait           liw: I think we don't have the dates yet
20:26 magnuse        that would be slef, but i don't think they are set yet
20:25 liw            can someone give me the dates for Kohacon 2012?
20:19 kathryn        Kia ora koutou!
20:15 chris_n        howdy kathryn
20:14 cait           hi kathryn :)
20:13 magnuse        kia ora kathryn
20:01 magnuse        http://www.tetakere.org.nz/
20:01 magnuse        hehe
20:00 * oleonard     wonders if te takere is some kind of exotic liquor.
20:00 magnuse        i'd be happy to see my dosh go towards te takere, if it's not needed elsewhere
19:53 huginn         moodaepo: Karma for "ptfs" has been increased 8 times and decreased 15 times for a total karma of -7.
19:53 moodaepo       @karma ptfs
19:53 huginn         moodaepo: Karma for "biblibre" has been increased 50 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 50.
19:53 moodaepo       @karma biblibre
19:53 moodaepo       biblibre++
19:52 chris_n        signing over both would be a very inexpensive way to buy back a lot of good will.... whatever of that is left to buy back
19:52 moodaepo       chris_n: Exactly and the NZ market is not as big as the one in the States
19:51 moodaepo       Well since it is the 'Thanksgiving weekend' in the US and supposedly the season of giving is upon us I wouldn't want a refund : )
19:51 chris_n        if they signed over the nz trademark, what would stop them from following up with the us one
19:51 chris_n        ouch
19:50 wizzyrea       or that
19:50 oleonard       Maybe we could pay the ransom on the US trademark?
19:50 wizzyrea       we could buy back our domain :P
19:49 rangi          i think HLT would have suggest some ideas or something, im sure there is useful things that could be done for the project, of course it can be refunded also if needed
19:49 cait           back
19:49 rangi          moodaepo: hehe yeah
19:48 magnuse        np, aarkerio ;-)
19:48 moodaepo       [off] 'If' they sign over the application OR drop their application and let HLT's proceed can the community use the legal fees raised for say the next Koha conference? (Or buy a yacht which travels across seas for conferences to be held on? : )
19:47 aarkerio       perfect ! thanks a lot pal!
19:45 magnuse        it's what koha uses to handle marc ;-)
19:45 magnuse        and it's friends MARC::Field and MARC::Record
19:45 aarkerio       mmm, cool!
19:45 magnuse        MARC::File
19:45 magnuse        oops
19:45 aarkerio       I want to write a wiki page in Koha site about how Import journal articles step by step
19:44 magnuse        if you use File::MARC et al that will take care of boundries between records etc
19:44 aarkerio       and also XML->MARC
19:44 magnuse        yay for perl
19:44 aarkerio       in order to convert BIBTEX -> MARC
19:43 aarkerio       http://search.cpan.org/~gerhard/BibTeX-Parser-0.63/lib/BibTeX/Parser.pm
19:43 aarkerio       magnuse, I will made a little script using :
19:42 chris_n        wow, go jransom
19:42 magnuse        aarkerio: will you be doing programming? find a MARC module for your language - it's the only sane thing to do
19:41 aarkerio       or 001 tag?
19:41 aarkerio       every empty line ?
19:41 aarkerio       and how Koha knows a new marc record starts in a file?
19:41 magnuse        rangi++
19:41 aarkerio       http://lib2.dss.go.th/elib/marc21/computer.html
19:41 aarkerio       magnuse, thanks!  Can I take this as a MARC example:
19:40 huginn         New commit(s) needsignoff: [Bug 7259] Show a count of items pending approval on staff client home and tools pages <http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7259>
19:40 rangi          id be happy if this application was signed over, one issue at a time :)
19:40 rangi          oleonard: thats easily combated
19:39 moodaepo       What the hell is a "open development ILS application" or "open development application"
19:38 oleonard       And next we dither about under what conditions PTFS can peddle closed-source forks of Koha in NZ?
19:38 magnuse        guten abend cait
19:37 magnuse        someone please correct me if i'm wrong
19:37 magnuse        (not marcxml)
19:37 rangi          https://twitter.com/#!/ranginui/status/139426668455542785
19:37 magnuse        i think the "stage for import" tool only does iso3709?
19:36 magnuse        aarkerio: it would have to be marc to go into koha
19:36 aarkerio       in what format should I pick to prepare the import?
19:35 mtj            jwagner: any comment jane ?
19:35 aarkerio       I have some articles in bibTex format and other in XML,
19:35 rangi          http://diligentroom.wordpress.com/2011/11/22/the-exemplar-of-stupid-koha-vs-liblime-trademark/#comment-1762
19:35 magnuse        yay, that does sound a lot better
19:34 mtj            so, clays the sole public spokesperson for PTFS/liblime on this hot topic ...?
19:34 aarkerio       hi!  the best format to import Journal Articles in Koha would be MarcXML?
19:33 rangi          yes
19:33 oleonard       His comment certainly differs from the press release
19:33 rangi          oh this is better if it is true
19:33 rangi          http://diligentroom.wordpress.com/2011/11/22/the-exemplar-of-stupid-koha-vs-liblime-trademark/#comment-1761
19:31 wizzyrea       mtj: sure (re: your email)
19:27 rangi          http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/91940/global-backers-support-library-in-koha-trademark-battle
19:27 magnuse        it's weird that the logs mention </collection> - that's nowhere to be seen...
19:27 wizzyrea       ty mtj
19:27 mtj            http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Forming_a_Koha_Foundation#United_States
19:26 magnuse        <record
19:26 magnuse        <?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?>
19:26 magnuse        </record>
19:26 magnuse        except this, which i guess is normal:
19:26 wizzyrea       mtj where did you find that quote re: the foundation
19:26 magnuse        hm, looks fine as far as i can see
19:24 rangi          http://podcast.radionz.co.nz/mnr/mnr-20111124-0753-small_library_gets_global_backers_in_trademark_battle-00.ogg
19:23 magnuse        nope, doing that now
19:23 rangi          see if they look ok
19:23 rangi          go look at the actual marcxml files
19:23 rangi          did you use -k
19:23 magnuse        still no items in the result list
19:22 wizzyrea       some people's kids.
19:22 wizzyrea       christ.
19:22 wizzyrea       patron search - is there a way to get an exact string?
19:21 * jcamins_away heads off to a meeting.
19:21 rangi          and see if it looks ok
19:21 rangi          and then you can eyeball the exported stuff
19:21 magnuse        ah yes, -x!
19:21 rangi          -x to do xml -k to keep
19:21 jcamins_away   magnuse: redo the translation step, too.
19:20 magnuse        good, it's not just me then ;-)
19:20 rangi          try a -x -k
19:20 rangi          weird
19:20 magnuse        rangi: yup 3.4.5 - got other dev installs running off the same code without problems
19:20 jcamins_away   Thanks!
19:20 rangi          done
19:20 jcamins_away   Okay, a message is awaiting your approval. :)
19:20 rangi          2 secs
19:20 pastebot       "magnuse" at 84.202.196.154 pasted "500 error" (10 lines) at http://paste.koha-community.org/129
19:20 rangi          i can
19:19 jcamins_away   Who moderates the koha@lists.katipo.co.nz list?
19:19 magnuse        there's an error in the logs, just a sec
19:19 rangi          and you are definitely running 3.4.x or greater eh?
19:18 magnuse        if i'm on the normal tab and do Edit > Edit Items, no items are shown and i get "add item" instead
19:18 rangi          hmm
19:18 magnuse        i have done -b -r -v
19:18 wizzyrea       urf.
19:18 magnuse        when i click on items tab on the left, details are shown, when i click on [Edit item], details are shown. when i try to save i get a 500 error
19:18 wizzyrea       indexing magnuse?
19:17 rangi          cya fabio_t
19:17 magnuse        hm, a little bit of progress. exporting and importing got rid of 952 in marcxml (but they are still in items table. yay! when i search in the staff client i get "no items" on everything. when i click on a title and get to normal view, items are shown.
19:17 fabio_t        see you #koha
19:15 chris_n        for being away, thd-away sure is here a lot ;-)
19:13 wizzyrea       *with the advice and consent of the Koha community*
19:13 wizzyrea       "The Horowhenua Library Trust, with the advice and consent of the Koha community, has established a committee"
19:09 rangi          they could just transfer their application to HLT, with hlt making the same undertaking, done
19:08 oleonard       Oh the latter is what I was thinking you liked to. The former I hadn't been looking at.
19:07 wahanui        also that is probably a giant undertaking
19:07 wizzyrea       also that
19:07 wizzyrea       http://koha-community.org/about/koha-project-organization/horowhenua-library-trust-koha-committee-rules/
19:07 wizzyrea       because of this
19:07 wizzyrea       though the committee will probably have to convene soon
19:07 oleonard       Not an easy page to parse if you're coming at it from this controversy
19:06 wizzyrea       but i'm not sure what to update it *to*
19:06 wizzyrea       that could probably use an update
19:06 wizzyrea       http://koha-community.org/about/koha-project-organization/
19:06 wizzyrea       well the rules are there
19:05 jcamins_away   kf++
19:05 magnuse        kf++
19:05 oleonard       was there an announcement on our site about HLT being voted to hold Koha assets?
19:05 * wizzyrea     mixes up the sangria with extra lime
19:04 ibeardslee     wizzyrea: meatballs taken directly from ptfs/liblime?
19:04 * wizzyrea     rents the bouncy house
19:04 kf             lol
19:04 * wizzyrea     books the pony too
19:04 * wizzyrea     books the clown
19:04 kf             dinner time almost over - bye all!
19:04 * wizzyrea     books the band
19:04 kf             hmm meatballs
19:04 * wizzyrea     rents the ballroom
19:04 * wizzyrea     starts inflating balloons
19:03 * wizzyrea     prepares the meatballs
19:03 * wizzyrea     gets out the streamers
19:03 wizzyrea       what, you want a party too?
19:03 kf             heh :)
19:03 * wizzyrea     throws confetti for kf
19:03 chris_n        mediaplayer refuses to do that
19:03 kf             DONE!
19:02 chris_n        they use MMS for their live stream
19:02 chris_n        ouch
19:02 mtj            bah, wizz bet me to it ;p
19:02 mtj            http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/morningreport
19:01 mtj            morning report url here, somewhere....
19:00 ibeardslee     so ahh what intellectual property would they have to donate?
19:00 wizzyrea       oh it's probably the next one to be posted
19:00 rangi          ok my stop bbiab
19:00 rangi          probably but ud have to look :)
18:59 chris_n        no real-time streaming heh?
18:59 rangi          its morning report
18:59 wizzyrea       ^^
18:59 rangi          it will go as a ogg later
18:59 mtj            no link yet, from me...
18:59 chris_n        do they stream audio?
18:59 wizzyrea       or maybe it's in the 9 to noon
18:59 mtj            'Aroha Te Pareake Mead is the global Chair of the IUCN Commission on Environment, Economics and Social Policy and a Senior Lecturer in Maori Business, Victoria Management School, VUW.'
18:59 rangi          he's prolly listening to the actual radio
18:59 wizzyrea       http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/morningreport but... I don't know which section it's in
18:58 chris_n        I'll say
18:58 chris_n        heh
18:58 wahanui        well, link is a bit confusing
18:58 chris_n        link?
18:58 mtj            and law expert from vic-uni ;)
18:57 rangi          oh cool
18:57 mtj            ooh and don.c getting interviewed too
18:56 rangi          dang im on the bus
18:56 trea           link mtj?
18:56 mtj            on nat-radio radio now...
18:54 mtj            classic ptfs/liblime
18:54 mtj            'LibLime, by virtue of its donation of intellectual assets to the Koha Software Foundation and its standing as a major contributor would expect permanent representation on its board of directors. Initially, LibLime would request 40 percent of the positions in the board of directors, which would be reduced to 20 percent once the organization becomes financially self-supporting or after 24 months, whichever happens first.'
18:54 rangi          someone other than hlt could respond saying that
18:54 wizzyrea       so really the only choice.
18:54 wizzyrea       well they're the elected holding entity for the community
18:53 rangi          im not worrying about it, the non profit I want to hold it is hlt
18:52 mtj            this is funny....
18:52 rangi          yep
18:52 wizzyrea       here also: http://koha-community.org/about/koha-project-organization/horowhenua-library-trust-koha-committee-rules/
18:52 chris_n        heya thd-away
18:51 wizzyrea       i.e. "look, we 'caved' and it's not good enough"
18:51 rangi          yeah, thats not gonna fly, you dont do stuff behind ppls back, then when u get caught go, oh u caught us, we'll give it to someone else
18:50 rangi          heh
18:49 wizzyrea       well and an attempt to make us look "ungrateful"
18:49 rangi          its something to placate their customers
18:48 wizzyrea       http://koha-community.org/hlt-koha-committee-report-on-discussions-with-ptfs/
18:48 rangi          im not sure its worth worrying/thinking about
18:48 kf             almost done
18:48 kf             wizzyrea: thx :)
18:48 oleonard       Ah: http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Forming_a_Koha_Foundation#United_States
18:47 rangi          was on the wiki/email
18:47 oleonard       Anyone have a reference for the PTFS/controlling interest issue with the foundation?
18:47 wizzyrea       yep
18:47 rangi          and say hlt hold community property
18:47 rangi          did the community already vote
18:46 wizzyrea       imo
18:46 wizzyrea       it's still objectionable
18:46 wizzyrea       yea no, go ahead with the objections
18:46 rangi          its a tactic to try to stall objections
18:46 wizzyrea       that is a better plan
18:45 rangi          well they could just not register it and let hlt register it with the same promise
18:45 mtj            http://web.archive.org/web/20090209054335/http://koha.org/about-koha/news/nr1233245950.html
18:45 mtj            that stupid letter that asked for people to support his 'open-letter' to ptfs
18:43 mtj            yeah, i want that stupid letter Joshua mailed to everyone off-list, about PTFS pubished
18:43 * wizzyrea     sends kf extra tea to fuel her efforts
18:43 kf             216
18:42 wizzyrea       might as well get all the dirty laundry out?
18:42 rangi          changes nothing, im sure objections will still proceed
18:42 wizzyrea       well, we have a stage atm
18:42 * jcamins      bets the answer is "yes."
18:42 * wizzyrea     wonders if that's the foundation that they registered.
18:42 rangi          yes
18:42 rangi          notice they dont say hlt
18:42 chris_n        remembering, of course, that ptfs wants to hold controlling interest in said non-profit foundation
18:42 mtj            ... that is not HLT
18:42 mtj            'PTFS/LibLime is prepared to transfer the trademark to a non-profit Koha Foundation...
18:41 wizzyrea       *nod*
18:40 oleonard       It's still all promises.
18:40 rangi          so that means nothing has changed
18:40 rangi          yes
18:39 wizzyrea       they'll have to to transfer it
18:39 rangi          so that means they still plan to register
18:39 wizzyrea       !!!!
18:38 wizzyrea       !
18:38 oleonard       They've got a funny way of encouraging direct dialog
18:38 oleonard       he trademark that serves the best interests of the libraries who use Koha.
18:38 oleonard       PTFS/LibLime is prepared to transfer the trademark to a non-profit Koha Foundation with the provision that the Foundation hold the trademark in trust and not enforce it against any individual, organization, or company who chooses to promote services around Koha in New Zealand. PTFS/LibLime encourages a direct dialog with Koha stakeholders to determine an equitable solution for the disposition of t
18:38 oleonard       https://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=10150377460456996
18:38 wizzyrea       link anybody?
18:38 mtj            i heard rach's interview on nad-radio last nite - she was very succinct
18:36 jcamins        Apostrophes in plurals that don't already end in -ses are a pet peeve of mine.
18:36 rangi          not sure but had more reporters asking last night
18:35 jcamins        mtj: chrises ;)
18:35 mtj            more Koha stuff on national-radio NZ today?
18:35 chris_n        heya mtj
18:34 * mtj          flicks on the radio
18:34 mtj            um, no
18:34 rangi          mtj: listening to nat radio?
18:34 rangi          now on the bus
18:34 mtj            hi chris's's
18:33 * chris_n      hands rangi a poncho
18:32 rangi          hello from the wet bus stop
18:26 kf             I think
18:26 kf             words
18:23 magnuse        i'm guessing those are untranslated strings, or words?
18:22 kf             407 - getting there
18:19 magnuse        tee hee
18:18 kf             *cry*
18:18 kf             i- Submersible remote-sensing device
18:18 wizzyrea       that's "category LOC"
18:18 kf             heh
18:18 kf             952$c
18:18 wizzyrea       she typed faster than me ;)
18:17 wizzyrea       ^^
18:17 kf             LOC auth. val.
18:17 trea           where do i find/edit shelving locations in the staff interface?
18:13 oleonard       Ah, and the function for counting pending suggestions already takes branch into account
18:12 kf             chris_n: only translating I fear... MARC realted things
18:11 wizzyrea       *nod* perfect
18:11 oleonard       I guess based on the logged-in user's home branch?
18:11 wizzyrea       suggestions definitely have a branch
18:10 * oleonard     checks suggestions
18:10 chris_n        ie SLAR?
18:10 chris_n        kf: thinking of adding a new tool to koha?
18:10 wizzyrea       *nod* cool
18:10 oleonard       Comments and tags are not recorded with branch information as far as I know
18:09 wizzyrea       let me rephrase - numbers are for the logged in branch? or systemwide
18:09 chris_n        googleing "kaha trademark" is getting interesting
18:09 wizzyrea       or branch specific?
18:09 wizzyrea       numbers are per library?
18:09 wizzyrea       having the other stuff is cool too of course, but that is REALLY helpful
18:08 wizzyrea       oleonard++
18:08 wizzyrea       i LOVE that
18:08 wizzyrea       !!!!
18:07 oleonard       This would avoid the dashboard question altogether: http://screencast.com/t/PYObAMwHz
18:04 kf             568
18:03 kf             heh right
18:03 magnuse        jcamins: thanks for trying ;-)
18:03 magnuse        but then again, you never know ;-)
18:03 kf             I am quite sure ourl ibraries will never use that...
18:02 magnuse        kf: is that something you are meant to create marc records for?
18:02 kf             it's for the fernerkundungsbilder :P
18:02 jcamins        Sidelooking airborne radar? Who catalogs radar?
18:01 jcamins        !!
18:01 jcamins        I'd ask gmcharlt.
18:01 kf             ga- Sidelooking airborne radar (SLAR)
18:01 jcamins        Hm.
18:01 jcamins        Oh.
18:01 magnuse        nope, regular dev install
18:00 jcamins        Package install, right?
18:00 jcamins        That comes with the packages.
18:00 jcamins        Using the utility.
18:00 magnuse        yeah (is there another way?)
17:59 jcamins        Did you try manually running the script?
17:59 jcamins        That's the reason for the symptoms, but I'm not sure the cause.
17:58 magnuse        all the ones i have checked
17:57 jcamins        Do *all* the records have items still in the marcxml?
17:57 magnuse        i tried setting marcflavor to marc21 before running the script, but no luck
17:57 magnuse        yeah, the almost emprty items show up in the opac
17:56 jcamins        Speculation: the remove_items script doesn't understand NORMARC.
17:56 wizzyrea       maybe gmcharlt has an idea
17:55 magnuse        i tried running remove_items... script again and it completes without errors, but without removing the items
17:55 jcamins        magnuse: does it show up on the opac?
17:54 magnuse        i thought maybe that was a template thing, but other installs runing off the same codebase does not have this problem
17:54 magnuse        the itemnumber is missing
17:53 magnuse        when i'm on /cgi-bin/koha/cataloguing/additem.pl?biblionumber=222 the link to edit an item looks like this: /cgi-bin/koha/cataloguing/additem.pl?op=edititem&biblionumber=222&itemnumber=#edititem
17:53 kf             705..
17:51 magnuse        nope, the table looks good
17:51 wizzyrea       in the wrong fields?
17:51 wizzyrea       is the data offset at all?
17:51 wizzyrea       changed*
17:51 magnuse        but the only info is itemtype, status and last seen
17:51 wizzyrea       are you on the 3.4 revision that chanted the lost status?
17:50 magnuse        it does show up here: /cgi-bin/koha/catalogue/detail.pl?biblionumber=222
17:50 wizzyrea       oh!
17:50 magnuse        like barcode
17:50 magnuse        well, they get into the database, but loose a lot of info
17:50 wizzyrea       the items do or do not get into the database?
17:50 magnuse        it doesn't show up here: /cgi-bin/koha/cataloguing/additem.pl?biblionumber=222
17:49 magnuse        when i add a new item, nothing happens, the number of items displayed does not change at all
17:48 magnuse        jcamins: nope, no fancy stuff
17:48 wizzyrea       ^^ is what I was asking
17:48 magnuse        rangi: sad & cool
17:48 jcamins        magnuse: used jQuery to remove a column or a textbox or something?
17:48 wizzyrea       !
17:48 rangi          i think koha is gonna be on radio again this morning
17:48 magnuse        the marcxml still has the items in it - that might be because the remove_items... script failed when i upgraded
17:48 wizzyrea       jquery I mean
17:48 wahanui        it has been said that javascript is required for interactions with clicks
17:48 wizzyrea       javascript?
17:47 * rangi        wanders off again
17:47 kf             :(
17:47 magnuse        it's a dev install on a 3.4.5 codebase, shared with other installs that are not misbehaving
17:47 magnuse        i can't save or edit items
17:46 magnuse        on the other hand i do have a problem that i have spent all day on and still can't make head or tail of...
17:45 kf             785!
17:45 magnuse        hm, i don't think normarc has that - too bad
17:45 jcamins        kf: heh. I like that one. :)
17:44 kf             one of my favorites: e- Manned spacecraft
17:44 slef           [off] http://g.co/maps/885dk such a tiny building they have.
17:44 wizzyrea       lol
17:43 wahanui        I know. That's why I said it.
17:43 kf             very true
17:43 magnuse        smoe of those choices reads like museum of forgotten technologies...
17:43 kf             makes for a lot of searching around too
17:43 kf             they are alphabetical
17:43 kf             subfield e is not really close
17:43 jcamins        Yay! You're getting close!
17:42 kf             e- Magnetic audio tape on reel
17:42 kf             still working on the translation
17:42 kf             soon
17:42 kf             :)
17:41 Oak            kf, time to go home.
17:39 slef           yow... opencorporates doesn't see much on US co's - http://opencorporates.com/companies/us_de/3744399
17:38 rangi          which says something to me
17:38 rangi          clay is the only dev who didnt resign
17:38 rangi          in fact
17:38 Barrc          kf: thanks - I will try that, no doubt I will mess something else up though!
17:37 Barrc          We'll will be expaning it, hopefully
17:37 magnuse        rangi++
17:37 Barrc          We left the suggestions open for a while and decided the best place to start was a really (really, really) simple start.
17:37 rangi          mtj and russel too
17:37 rangi          resigned when it was clear they were going the wrong way and wouldnt listen
17:37 kf             Barrc: git commit --amend :)
17:36 slef           rangi: hopefully that's factually accurate
17:36 wizzyrea       oh no.
17:36 Barrc          I have left the most important script out of the patch so I will need to re-do it (Git will be the death of me!)
17:36 rangi          april 2007 to march 2008
17:36 slef           https://diligentroom.wordpress.com/2011/11/22/the-exemplar-of-stupid-koha-vs-liblime-trademark/#comment-1760
17:36 kf             morning :)
17:36 kf             wah
17:36 rangi          i did
17:36 slef           I didn't just dream that?
17:36 kf             hi fabio_t :)
17:36 slef           rangi did work for kados-era liblime didn't he?
17:36 Barrc          Just regarind the Dashboard patch
17:35 huginn         slef: rangi was last seen in #koha 7 hours, 51 minutes, and 4 seconds ago: * rangi goes to sleep
17:35 wahanui        hi, fabio_t
17:35 fabio_t        hi there
17:35 slef           @seen rangi
17:35 slef           oh bum
17:35 Barrc          Evening all
17:35 magnuse        hiya fabio_t
17:34 fabio_t        good evening :)
17:32 magnuse        kf: yup
17:32 mib_87cyjt     wizzyrea: I'll see if Bar is around, he was working onit
17:32 wahanui        german is at 100% - but the strings are missing from the files
17:32 kf             german?
17:32 kf             oh yum
17:30 * magnus_away  shares some "Niederegger marzipan brot" with the rest of #koha
17:30 jcamins        Cookies, too. ;)
17:29 jcamins        Once it's fully baked, I'll send it.
17:29 * wizzyrea     has the syspref on, doesn't see it.
17:29 * jcamins      has an idea kicking around.
17:29 jcamins        :)
17:29 wizzyrea       bye :)
17:29 paul_p         time to leave NOW !
17:29 paul_p         mmm... jcamins I see the problem, and you're right. Maybe we must handle version syspref for pre 3.8 only, and another way for later...
17:28 * oleonard     should have looked into this earlier; dead simple stuff.
17:28 wizzyrea       +1 oleonard
17:28 oleonard       http://screencast.com/t/AxewTrBFxUTy
17:28 jcamins        I'll try to remember when I'm on the train.
17:27 paul_p         (I must leave, drop a mail to raise your objection pls)
17:27 paul_p         ;-)
17:27 jcamins        There's a problem when we reach 3.6.7.
17:27 jcamins        Wait, no, I'll give a +0.5.
17:26 jcamins        paul_p: I will give a +1 to your proposal.
17:26 mib_87cyjt     so the bug suggests too
17:25 mib_87cyjt     seemingly
17:24 jcamins        The dashboard uses an XML file?
17:23 mib_87cyjt     perl script to populate the xml file, that is
17:22 mib_87cyjt     and you need to run the xml script to populate it
17:22 wizzyrea       where would I be without you super smart people. ;)
17:22 mib_87cyjt     welcome
17:22 wizzyrea       :) ty
17:22 wizzyrea       OH
17:22 mib_87cyjt     to turn it on
17:22 mib_87cyjt     syspref?
17:22 wizzyrea       right - i applied it and I don't see anything different
17:21 oleonard       That's the dashboard patch proposed in the RFC
17:21 * wizzyrea     must be missing something
17:19 oleonard       http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/attachment.cgi?id=5249
17:19 oleonard       I find it kind of meh because I don't see how the information is relevant for day-to-day operations.
17:18 wizzyrea       which is what I was really ooo ing about
17:18 wizzyrea       but I will look at that dashboard patch
17:18 wizzyrea       well that was not what I emant to send
17:18 wizzyrea       http://yro.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2539798&cid=38143786 oooo
17:17 huginn         New commit(s) needsignoff: [Bug 6828] Add Admin Dashboard for staff users. <http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=6828>
17:17 jcamins        Granted, the traveling salesman problem is NP-Complete, but surely for a simple case, where the most efficient solution isn't required, it's been solved.
17:16 jcamins        It seems to me there should be some sort of library that handles dependency solving.
17:12 * oleonard     missed that
17:12 oleonard       Ah, but a patch was submitted last week
17:10 oleonard       But that concept of a dashboard is pretty different. http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Staff_Dashboard_RFC
17:10 magnus_away    or words to that effect
17:10 magnus_away    "i love the sound of deadlines as they swoosh past"
17:10 wizzyrea       heh
17:09 oleonard       "expected for/deadline: 2011-09-22"
17:08 kf             oleonard: collecting ideas for the dashboard
17:07 kf             oleonard: there is a page on the wiki
17:07 magnus_away    yay
17:07 oleonard       Dashboard items: unapproved tags, unapproved comments, pending suggestions
17:06 magnus_away    heh, just got a @later from huginn "Sent 14 weeks, 2 days, 11 hours, and 21 minutes ago"...
17:06 * kf           still translates the 007 plugin
17:05 kf             good comment from oleonard
17:04 wizzyrea       https://etechlib.wordpress.com/2011/11/23/liblime-versus-koha-what-is-the-libraryland-opposite-of-open-source/
17:02 jcamins        Has anyone else noticed that diacritics in Voyager OPACs are consistently broken since the last upgrade.
17:00 jcamins        :)
17:00 huginn         jcamins: Quote #123: "rangi: #thingsihavelearnt if there is a mad scheme a library somewhere will be doing it ... except madder" (added by wizzyrea at 09:20 PM, March 30, 2011)
17:00 jcamins        @quote get 123
17:00 wizzyrea       NEKLS has a quote 123 going full speed.
16:59 wizzyrea       hmm looks like there needs to be a better way of handling lost
16:58 wizzyrea       :)
16:57 jcamins        Oh, good news. It's the Thanksgiving _Day_ Parade, not the Thanksgiving _Eve_ Parade.
16:57 wizzyrea       that would be great for that treatment
16:57 wizzyrea       purchase suggestions would be another one
16:57 wizzyrea       *nod* that was my next question :)
16:57 oleonard       gotta figure out how to add the option to the staff client home page
16:57 wizzyrea       oleonard++
16:57 magnus_away    oleonard++
16:56 wizzyrea       i likes it
16:56 wizzyrea       that is super swank
16:56 jcamins        Ah. Nice!
16:56 wizzyrea       on a dashoard type thinger
16:56 oleonard       jcamins: A number highlighting the count of unapproved comments
16:56 wizzyrea       comments in the staff client!
16:56 wizzyrea       ooooo
16:56 wizzyrea       really ought to check the analytics for k-c.org
16:56 jcamins        oleonard: what am I looking at?
16:56 jcamins        Ewwww.
16:56 oleonard       http://screencast.com/t/rY7jUhs6JSX
16:56 jcamins        Oh my... will I be downtown during the parade?
16:55 wizzyrea       uhno
16:55 jcamins        Still impressive, but I was imagining a spotlight during the Thanksgiving parade. :)
16:55 wizzyrea       thumbs up though, the server's doing just fine ;)
16:55 oleonard       Are we on Keith Olbermann yet?
16:55 wizzyrea       no, on nz tv
16:55 jcamins        wizzyrea: on US TV, too?
16:54 * wizzyrea     is a bit gobsmacked to see k-c.org on TV
16:54 wizzyrea       from like, 15s to 60s
16:54 wizzyrea       increased the script timeout
16:54 jcamins        Yeah, but wouldn't it be nice if you didn't have to take a nap while waiting for it to load? ;)
16:54 oleonard       What hack wizzyrea?
16:53 wizzyrea       but that's great
16:53 wizzyrea       well we whacked around it with a firefox hack.
16:53 jcamins        Or, at least, more usable.
16:53 wizzyrea       noice!
16:53 jcamins        wizzyrea: apparently the datatables thing might make your reading history usable again.
16:53 jcamins        Morning.
16:53 magnus_away    kia ora!
16:52 wizzyrea       mornin
16:39 slef           it varies but I know what you mean
16:38 jcamins        I figure most of my clientele prefers to do things with paper anyway, so an attractive shopping cart isn't very high on the to-do list.
16:38 slef           (I've a niftier purchase page but bleah, not ready for primetime yet.)
16:38 jcamins        :)
16:38 jcamins        http://www.cpbibliography.com/contact/
16:37 jcamins        Nifty!
16:37 slef           buy mine here http://www.software.coop/contact/ ... and jcamins at...
16:37 jcamins        I read it the same way you do.
16:37 jcamins        Ah. Thanks.
16:37 slef           jcamins: I thought they were. I was prompting you ;-)
16:37 jcamins        slef: so are mine. :P
16:36 slef           my hours are for sale ;-)
16:36 slef           maybe I've misunderstood
16:36 jcamins        I'll give it a try if I ever get a spare hour.
16:36 slef           read the above bug link
16:35 jcamins        Ah.
16:35 mib_87cyjt     jcamins: me too!
16:35 slef           jcamins: that's how I understand it.  It's needing sign off.
16:35 * jcamins      missed that.
16:35 jcamins        slef: really? Awesome!
16:34 slef           although I see that it looks like zebraqueue daemon is ready to appear in 3.7 after some discussion on koha-devel finishes (why no link in the bug paul_p?)
16:34 jcamins        mib_87cyjt: yeah, that bothers me, too (I'm a cataloger), but I like my servers staying up even better. ;)
16:33 mib_87cyjt     Yeah, it's going to be met with some groans from the cataloguers as they loved the zebraqueue updating straight away!
16:33 huginn         04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=5166 enhancement, PATCH-Sent, ---, tomascohen, ASSIGNED , Reintroduce a zebraqueue daemon, make several rebuild_zebra.pl functions a lib
16:33 slef           mib_87cyjt: consider sponsoring bug 5166 if you'd like zebraqueue daemon back.
16:33 jcamins        But I only have low-use catalogs.
16:32 jcamins        I usually do 5 minutes.
16:32 jcamins        You're welcome.
16:32 mib_87cyjt     excellent, I will try this out - thanks
16:32 mib_87cyjt     rebuild_zebra is already there but only every 10 mins....
16:31 jcamins        Then you'll be good to go.
16:31 jcamins        And put rebuild_zebra in the crontab.
16:31 mib_87cyjt     Cool, so disable zebraqueue and reindex and we should be good?
16:31 jcamins        Just trying to make sure we're thorough in our advice. :)
16:31 jcamins        mib_87cyjt: that's right. If you did that, then the problem is just the cron job.
16:30 slef           that last one is it
16:30 mib_87cyjt     OK. The removeitems..... just has a run switch, that's all I did - is that correct?
16:30 huginn         slef: 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=5166 enhancement, PATCH-Sent, ---, tomascohen, ASSIGNED , Reintroduce a zebraqueue daemon, make several rebuild_zebra.pl functions a lib
16:30 huginn         slef: 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=6094 normal, PATCH-Sent, ---, m.de.rooy, ASSIGNED , Fixing ModAuthority problems
16:30 huginn         slef: 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=6590 enhancement, PATCH-Sent, ---, juan.sieira, ASSIGNED , Removing hyphens from isbn and issn when cataloging a biblio
16:30 huginn         slef: 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=6435 major, P5 - low, ---, gmcharlt, NEW , False "no items" in search results [intranet]
16:30 slef           @query zebraqueue daemon
16:30 jcamins        mib_87cyjt: not at present, no.
16:30 slef           mib_87cyjt: there's a project to make a new zebraqueue daemon but it's not finished in 3.6 AIUI.
16:30 mib_87cyjt     oh, that's going to be difficult for cataloguing 100s of new bibs - is there a work around?
16:29 jcamins        Yes.
16:29 mib_87cyjt     cron  = x minutes
16:29 jcamins        mib_87cyjt: did you follow the instructions to run removeitemsfrombiblioitems or whatever it is?
16:29 mib_87cyjt     OK. So, do I need to wait x minutes for new Auths to appear when creating a bib?
16:29 chris_n        paul_p: i'd like to see a working example where the same patch works for both branches running two different systems before I really comment on that option
16:29 kf             paul_p: because we need to tell the new system still which things should not be applied then because they were in older versions already
16:29 jcamins        slef: good call.
16:29 jcamins        No.
16:29 mib_87cyjt     Can't I use that in 3.6?
16:29 jcamins        zebraqueue daemon is fundamentally broken.
16:29 jcamins        You can't use both. You can only use one.
16:29 slef           items-in-marc even
16:29 kf             paul_p: taht makes sense, but we should check the different situations we can get into
16:29 mib_87cyjt     zebraqueue updates authorities immediately
16:28 slef           jcamins: any problem with the marc-in-items change?
16:28 mib_87cyjt     I was/am using both
16:28 jcamins        If you take a look in INSTALL.debian, you'll see how to do that.
16:28 jcamins        Yeah, the problem is that you were using zebraqueue daemon. You need to disable that, and set up the cron job using rebuild_zebra.
16:28 paul_p         jcamins & kf & chris_n = idea suggested by joubu = preference("version") is unmodified until 3.8 official release. Thus, the 3.6 updatedatabase will continue to work fine. The new updatesystem can be completly disconnected from this syspref, so we will get the best of the 2 worlds !
16:27 mib_87cyjt     it was on 3.00x - to be honest I don't remember the exact version - maybe 2 years old
16:27 jcamins        Ah-ha. What did you upgrade from? 3.0.something?
16:27 mib_87cyjt     sorry - upgraded it
16:27 slef           kf: I'll ask the nz chatters when they wake.
16:27 jcamins        Okay.
16:27 mib_87cyjt     OK, I understand now. I downloaded the latest stable release and manuall installed it
16:26 jcamins        Using git?
16:26 jcamins        Install it by downloading the tarball?
16:26 jcamins        Did you use packages?
16:26 jcamins        mib_87cyjt: you have Koha running on a server. You must have put it on the server somehow.
16:26 mib_87cyjt     Sorry, I don't understand - what do you mean, how did I install?
16:25 jcamins        mib_87cyjt: yes, you.
16:25 mib_87cyjt     it fixed the problem with bibs but it still causes problems with any newly edited bibs or items checked in
16:25 mib_87cyjt     Yeah, full bib reindex - completed fine
16:25 mib_87cyjt     jcamins:
16:25 kf             mib_87cyjt: have you reindexed?
16:25 mib_87cyjt     me?
16:25 jcamins        How did you install Koha?
16:24 kf             very good questions from marcel on the list
16:24 jcamins        mib_87cyjt: it sounds like rebuild_zebra isn't running.
16:24 mib_87cyjt     however, any items now checked in or bibs edited results in the same
16:24 mib_87cyjt     I ran the script and it resolved it for any items that had been changed
16:24 mib_87cyjt     yep!
16:24 mib_87cyjt     and
16:24 mib_87cyjt     Yep
16:24 kf             and have you been here before? :)
16:23 kf             since an update?
16:23 mib_87cyjt     has anyone seen this on 3.6?
16:23 mib_87cyjt     Edited or checked in items show as either still checked out or it zero-ises the items on the bib
16:14 * Oak          waves
16:13 jcamins        paul_p: I withdraw my objection to using the versioning syspref with the new system. chris_n has explained to me how it could work.
16:13 kf             perhaps in nz?
16:12 kf             i haven't seen any leaflets yet :(
16:12 slef           has/could anyone design(ed) a leaflet soliciting donations to HLT for the legal defence of Koha? We've an opportunity to distribute some to librarians but no time to design them (and it's a bit tight to print them)
16:10 chris_n        paul_p: would you be willing to post an announcement to the dev list scheduling such a meeting?
16:09 reiveune       bye
16:09 jcamins        Agreed.
16:08 chris_n        it would be good to have a called meeting for just this subject to include as many devs as possible
16:08 jcamins        I agree with that, provided it does not use the existing versioning syspref. If it uses the existing versioning syspref, that'll cause problems with the 3.6->3.8 conversion.
16:08 kf             after thanksgiving
16:08 kf             to discuss this?
16:08 kf             so have another meeting perhaps?
16:08 kf             heh
16:07 chris_n        but I reserve the right to change my opinion... ;-)
16:07 chris_n        at this point, I think the new db code should be throughly tested, debugged, and go live immediately
16:06 jcamins        ;)
16:06 jcamins        At least, I think chris_n and I agree.
16:06 jcamins        paul_p: that's what chris_n and I have been arguing for, more-or-less.
16:05 * chris_n      will try to take time to exercise the code and see if his understanding clears up
16:05 paul_p         see comment 5 for test plan
16:05 jcamins        paul_p: second.
16:05 paul_p         chris_n, yep
16:05 paul_p         jcamins, for which proposition ?
16:05 chris_n        those apply over master?
16:05 huginn         04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7167 enhancement, PATCH-Sent, ---, paul.poulain, ASSIGNED , updatedatabase improvements
16:05 paul_p         bug 7167
16:05 jcamins        paul_p: +1
16:05 paul_p         chris_n, just submitting the patches on but 7161
16:04 chris_n        paul_p: do you have a working branch with this new db update code available for test?
16:04 paul_p         i've another idea = completly disconnect the new system from the previous numbering. That's how it was planned before. I'll ask jonathan about this idea
16:03 paul_p         workaround idea: have 2 "version" sysprefs, one for the old system, one for the new one
16:03 jcamins        nengard: it's still confusing, sorry.
16:03 chris_n        I'm against it in practice, but not necessarily in principle at this point
16:02 nengard        I have to admit I was following that proposal for a bit then it got confusing
16:02 chris_n        paul_p: I'd like to see discussion from some others on this prior to formulating my own final opinion
16:02 nengard        oh!
16:02 paul_p         nengard, ;-) we were speaking of the proposal for new updatedatabase system, that cause a problem for ppl running master if we apply it as it's implemented for now !
16:02 jcamins        Apparently my jokes are predictable?
16:01 nengard        eww
16:01 jcamins        :D
16:01 chris_n        jcamins: turkey pizza?
16:01 jcamins        Turkey pizza!
16:01 paul_p         turkey pizza maybe ?
16:01 nengard        wasn't keeping up
16:01 nengard        what do you need a bywater person for?
16:01 jcamins        chris_n: speak for yourself!
16:01 chris_n        :-)
16:01 chris_n        only turkey
16:01 chris_n        no pizza on thanksgiving
16:01 chris_n        no wahanui
16:01 chris_n        kf: thanksgiving day
16:01 wahanui        well, tomorrow is pizza friday! or the day after today.
16:01 kf             chris_n:  what is tomorrow?
16:01 paul_p         (and someone from bywater is a must-have, as bywater uses master !)
16:00 chris_n        it is entirely possible that it is simply a communication issue ;-)
16:00 * jcamins      thinks tomorrow isn't a good day for USians.
16:00 paul_p         chris_n, no, but it still must be tested ;-)
16:00 * chris_n      agrees this needs discussion by a larger audience of devs
16:00 chris_n        paul_p: is the new code so unstable that you fear problems with it in production?
16:00 kf             perhaps set a time
15:59 paul_p         kf++
15:59 jcamins        Very untimely, since lots of people don't use .0 releases.
15:59 kf             so everyone has some time to think about it?
15:59 kf             perhaps we should resume the discussion tomorrowß
15:59 paul_p         (tries to find why)
15:59 chris_n        so if we make it too hard, the release dies an early, and possibly untimely death
15:59 paul_p         I can't argue why, but I feel there will be a problem with chris_n suggestion
15:59 * chris_n      urges all to remember that releases are only maintained as long as there are commits applicable to them
15:58 jcamins        What about bugfixes for 3.10/3.8/3.6?
15:57 jcamins        So what you're proposing is: All bugfixes are implemented using the existing numbered updatedatabase scheme, so that they can be put in 3.6. They are also added to 3.8 in the same way. All features are implemented using the new, hash-based updatedatabase scheme. Those cannot be backported to 3.8.
15:57 chris_n        paul_p: exactly
15:57 chris_n        I really don't anticipate many issues with a new db update system that has been throughly tested prior to committing to master
15:57 paul_p         chris_n, nope, because how will you manage ENH inclusion in 3.8 ? old method ?
15:56 kf             or not... but somethign that works for all situations that can appear
15:56 kf             so perhaps we can find another way
15:56 chris_n        and <your-favorite-term>
15:56 kf             and you are worried to backport, because it might be dangerous utnil it's better tested
15:56 chris_n        and work
15:56 chris_n        that will minimize confusion
15:56 kf             I think chris_n is worried about having 2 methods
15:56 chris_n        paul_p: I think if we don't back port the new method, we wait to drop it in immediately after the feature freeze of 3.7
15:55 paul_p         kf, right
15:55 kf             or we will get into all kind of trouble (imho)
15:55 kf             we have to keep them in sync
15:54 paul_p         kf, good point ! (very good point in fact...)
15:54 kf             which people do
15:54 kf             paul_p: you assume noone installs master
15:54 paul_p         yep.
15:54 chris_n        are we going to maintain two db update systems in 3.7?
15:54 * chris_n      is confused now
15:54 chris_n        not 3.6.x
15:54 paul_p         kf, what kind of "bug" ? if it's a bugfix, then it will be fixed with the old updatedatabase system
15:54 chris_n        devs will be fixing for 3.7.x
15:53 chris_n        thus, double work
15:53 chris_n        the bug will be in 3.6.x && 3.7.x
15:53 chris_n        is exactly the issue
15:53 kf             not only me
15:53 chris_n        what kf said
15:53 kf             I thik we all got very confused
15:53 * chris_n      too
15:53 kf             and how do we solve the bug in 3.7?
15:53 * paul_p       feel there's some misunderstanding between us
15:52 paul_p         chris_n, why double work ? there would be just a "old method" updatedatabase
15:52 chris_n        those will be lost unless everyone takes time to do the double work
15:52 chris_n        paul_p: what about bugfixes which require db updates?
15:51 chris_n        this happened with 3.2.x nearly as soon as the switch to TT took place
15:51 paul_p         chris_n, why ? they would have to do only 1 method
15:51 chris_n        and 3.6.x looses some needed fixes
15:51 paul_p         if a patch is an ENH, then it will be for 3.8 => it MUST be "new method"
15:51 chris_n        right, which will result in people not taking time to do that
15:51 paul_p         chris_n, NO = if a patch has to go into 3.6.x => it MUST be "old method".
15:50 chris_n        introducing two db update methods will only make it twice as much a problem, imho
15:50 chris_n        I already have this problem
15:49 chris_n        many fixes which require db updates will not make it into 3.6.x simply because folks do not take time to do the work twice
15:49 * kf           goes silent out of confusion
15:49 paul_p         for developers, that could be a little bit more tricky. But we're hackers, isn't it ?
15:49 chris_n        it needs to be for devs too
15:49 paul_p         chris_n, for users, that will be the case
15:49 * chris_n      sees a deadlock looming
15:48 chris_n        make the move at the last moment prior to releasing 3.8.x
15:48 paul_p         chris_n, yikes ! would require a LOT of testings + change of behaviour in the middle of a stable version : i think i'm strongly against this idea to backport !
15:48 chris_n        or
15:48 chris_n        so there should be little problem doing so
15:48 chris_n        the two codebases are not that divergent atm
15:48 chris_n        paul_p: port the new code back to 3.6.x
15:47 chris_n        and at present is not persuaded to support such a move
15:47 paul_p         chris_n, how would you do to have just 1 ?
15:47 jcamins        I think.
15:47 * jcamins      either, but at least now I understand what paul_p is saying.
15:47 * chris_n      still sees no reason to maintain two different systems
15:46 jcamins        I see.
15:46 jcamins        Ohhh.
15:46 paul_p         jcamins, not either = if you write in 3.8 release notes : "execute installer/data/mysql/updatedatabase 1st, then head to admin > update database", that will do the job !
15:46 jcamins        How do they get into 3.8, then, if the updatedatabase is for 3.6?
15:46 chris_n        so why maintain two different tracks?
15:45 chris_n        paul_p: so if the 3.6.x updatedatabase.pl has a routine to switch over to the new update system, then things will go fine during multi-version updates
15:45 paul_p         jcamins, not at all.
15:45 jcamins        paul_p: but then bugfixes won't go in 3.8?
15:45 paul_p         if your code is an ENH, use 3.8 new system
15:45 jcamins        I thought you were saying that 3.6 will require a different set of code for updatedatabase than will master.
15:45 paul_p         if your code is a bugfix, and should be applied on 3.6, use "3.6 updatedatabase" system
15:44 jcamins        paul_p: okay, I'm still confused then.
15:44 jcamins        kf: probably by some sort of hash.
15:44 paul_p         jcamins, but you'll just have to write code once !!!
15:44 jcamins        paul_p: actually, I don't even have time for that.
15:44 paul_p         chris_n, sequential calls = right, as we did for 2.2-> 3.0 for example
15:44 kf             so I have the file applied in 3.8.x and 4.0.x will have the file too, but know it's the same?
15:44 jcamins        paul_p: because I only have time to write code once.
15:44 kf             jcamins: checking by name?
15:44 paul_p         jcamins, why ? yes it will. and bugfixes with an updatedatabase will be made on 3.6 updatedatabase. nothing changed
15:44 jcamins        kf: it has a list of possible updates and a list of updates which have been applied.
15:43 kf             which updates to apply?
15:43 kf             ?
15:43 kf             know
15:43 chris_n        in reality, multi-version upgrades should do sequential calls to the respective version's updatedatabase.pl
15:43 kf             but hwo will the system now?
15:43 kf             no
15:43 jcamins        paul_p: but, if we don't backport the system to 3.6, 3.6 won't get bugfixes.
15:43 paul_p         kf, hopefully, the updatedatabase system is not changed everyday !!!
15:43 kf             it will happen constantly
15:43 mib_87cyjt     Edited or checked in items show as either still checked out or it zero-ises the items on the bib
15:43 kf             I think this is all the problems we get by delinearizing...
15:43 kf             won't we have that problem again? moving from 3.8.3 to 4.0?
15:42 paul_p         kf, right, and with this proposal, we don't have this problem
15:42 jcamins        paul_p: why can't the new updatedatabase call the old one (or the old one upgrade itself to the new one)?
15:42 mib_87cyjt     I was on earlier about a strange problem with 3.6
15:42 kf             what happens later with the new system?
15:42 kf             chris_n: I think you are right - having to write patches for 2 systems is hard, and moving from one to the other will be too
15:42 paul_p         jcamins, why ? it's much much more complex to backport the new system to 3.6 ! (and much more risky !)
15:42 mib_87cyjt     Hey all
15:42 chris_n        it does not happen that way very often.. oleonard excepted
15:42 jcamins        paul_p: that seems like an added complication.
15:42 chris_n        that will probably work as well as the current need of devs writing two patches for 3.4.x and 3.6.x
15:41 paul_p         - someone upgrading from 3.4 to 3.8 will just have to run updatedatabase (3.6) THEN updatedatabase (3.8)
15:41 kf             can't the new system check for the version? and not ask to do those that are marked to be in 3.6?
15:41 paul_p         - patch that introduce an updatedb that is for 3.8 will be in the 3.8 (new) updatedatabase
15:41 paul_p         - patches that introduce an updatedb, that is for 3.6 will be in the 3.6 updatedatabase
15:40 kf             chris_n: sounds good to me
15:40 chris_n        well, most of the time ;-)
15:40 jcamins        chris_n: agreed.
15:40 chris_n        so then you just go on living like you normally would and life is good
15:40 paul_p         chris_n & jcamins & kf, I think i'm not clear, but that's the easiest way. I'll try to be clear:
15:40 chris_n        the current updatedatabase.pl could contain an update which pushes current installs over to the new system
15:39 chris_n        as I said, I see no real reason not to move 3.6.x along that path
15:39 jcamins        kf: no, not too bad... 3.6.1.whatever would run updatedatabase30to36.
15:38 chris_n        both for devs and the RMaint
15:38 kf             when you come from that version, do this... when you come from this... do soemthing else
15:38 chris_n        paul_p: moving 3.6.x to the proposed new updatedatabase will relieve a lot of work
15:38 jcamins        So that new features only need one implementation?
15:38 kf             lots of explanations needed
15:38 kf             paul_p: that sounds complicated to me - for the libraries
15:38 jcamins        paul_p: so with the two, new things will be in upgradedatabase only, and old things will be in upgradedatabase30to36 only?
15:38 chris_n        what a time to be kiked by bip
15:38 paul_p         chris_n, I don't understand your last email.
15:37 paul_p         jcamins, right, that's why, now i'm proposing just to have 2 updatedatabase, as we had when upgrading 2.2 to 3.0
15:37 paul_p         ( jcamins right for "everything to be ... implemented twice". At least it was. With the idea of having updatedatabase30to36 then updatedatabase (new one), that's ok)
15:37 jcamins        paul_p: it seems to me that having two schemes just raises the barrier for entry.
15:36 jcamins        paul_p: why?
15:36 jcamins        kf: the new way of managing updatedatabase seems much preferable to me, but not having two different schemes.
15:36 paul_p         chris_n, I don't understand your last email.
15:36 paul_p         jcamins, right.
15:36 jcamins        chris_n: that's how I read it, too, but it seems a lot more complicated.
15:36 kf             which I am not sure is a good idea at all
15:36 kf             it seems we only make it easier to have local database customizatons
15:35 kf             I am not sure at all what we gain with the new process :(
15:35 chris_n        I'm wondering what real objection there could be in moving 3.6.x to the proposed new update system
15:35 kf             perhaps chris_n's solution will be a lot less trouble
15:35 * chris_n      reads it that way
15:34 jcamins        paul_p: your proposal is that everything to be backported to 3.6.x has to be implemented twice?
15:34 huginn         New commit(s) needsignoff: [Bug 7167] updatedatabase improvements <http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7167>
15:33 jcamins        paul_p: I'm confused about the updatedatabase thing.
15:32 kf             thx :)
15:32 * jcamins      has never tried that feature.
15:32 jcamins        Right.
15:32 kf             so you can answer directly
15:32 kf             ah
15:31 jcamins        The messages goes to the librarian, with the patron's address in the from: field.
15:31 kf             or the answer address?
15:31 kf             the mail goes to the library I thought?
15:31 jcamins        kf: changes the from address when patrons request a change to their record.
15:29 kf             someone remembers what this was about?
15:29 paul_p         To say the truth... I PREFER to be paid after january 2003... for taxes reasons. In fact, I planned to ask you to wait until january to pay if I won the RFP... (NO PROBLEM WITH IT though. I find funny to read 8 years old emails...)
15:29 kf             * Allow patron update script (on OPAC) to send email using the       from address of the patron
15:29 paul_p         mmm... very private things on the diary : Would you be willing to wait until January to receive payment?
15:29 kf             writing some release notes in german
15:29 kf             hm
15:29 jcamins        And the dispute made it to the front page of /r/opensource and slashdot, apparently.
15:29 nengard        http://www.web2learning.net/archives/4910
15:29 oleonard       nengard++
15:29 * nengard      loves zotero :)
15:29 oleonard       Yeah, she's been hard at work
15:28 jcamins        oleonard: nengard has a nice post summarizing some of the articles on the trademark dispute.
15:28 oleonard       ?
15:27 * jcamins      sees the news.
15:26 jcamins        Wow.
15:18 kf             probably, but still hope we have copies somewhere
15:18 oleonard       ...although most of them are probably only of historical interest
15:17 kf             heh
15:17 * oleonard     sees a lot of GPL'ed documents on the old kohadocs.org that got erased by PTFS's abandonment of the site
15:15 jcamins        (i.e. no one winced when my nick went from jcamins_away to jcamins;)
15:14 jcamins        Long enough ago that when I reported it, I suspect no one knew who I was.
15:13 * jcamins      reported this waaaaaaaayyy back.
15:13 jcamins        I think there's another bug about it, from a while ago.
15:12 nengard        :)
15:12 nengard        and i did say it was long standing :) just didn't search for a report like i should have
15:12 * jcamins      stops talking.
15:12 jcamins        Oh, it's been marked as a duplicate.
15:11 wizzyrea       hee
15:11 huginn         04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7256 major, P5 - low, ---, kyle.m.hall, RESOLVED DUPLICATE, Circulation Log Wrong
15:11 jcamins        nengard: bug 7256 is long-standing.
15:09 oleonard       A little prior art for PTFS
15:08 oleonard       http://www.myacpl.org/library/koha/koha-diary
15:08 oleonard       my_former_boss++
15:08 * jcamins      dies of heat prostration.
15:07 oleonard       It came with an explicit GPL license :)
15:07 oleonard       I'm resurrecting it on my library's site
15:07 oleonard       I had my own copy of what I set out to find there
15:06 nengard        oleonard i think that gmcharlt had a backup of that on his server ?
15:01 * oleonard     forgot that the old kohadocs.org got swallowed up and digested by PTFS too
14:30 chris_n        paul_p: I responded to your dev list post
14:17 * oleonard     was never a Slashdot reader even in its heyday
14:14 oleonard       I'm also surprised at how many commenters say "Blergh, I don't understand this article, can someone explain?"
14:13 magnuse        sounds like a good choice ;-)
14:12 magnuse        hehe
14:11 oleonard       Wow, if I ever want Slashdot's interest I'll be sure to misspell something in the submission.
13:48 magnuse        kia ora!
13:44 nengard        hiya kf
13:44 kf             :)
13:44 kf             hi nengard
13:44 kf             hi oleonard
13:42 nengard        morning oleonard
13:40 oleonard       Hi #koha
13:09 huginn         New commit(s) needsignoff: [Bug 7254] Show pending orders from baskets with closedate > 180 days <http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7254>
12:22 kmkale         hah
12:21 kf             although I should not help you doing that
12:21 * huginn       reloads and spins the chambers.
12:21 kmkale         @roulette
12:21 huginn         *SPIN* Are you feeling lucky?
12:21 kmkale         @roulette spin
12:21 huginn         kmkale: *click*
12:21 kmkale         @roulette
12:21 huginn         *SPIN* Are you feeling lucky?
12:21 kmkale         @roulette spin
12:21 huginn         kmkale: *click*
12:21 kmkale         @roulette
12:21 kmkale         aahh
12:21 kf             you wer emissing an e
12:21 kf             kmkale: spelling isseu :)
12:21 kmkale         humm. Poor huggin. Needs some ammo
12:20 huginn         kmkale: I suck
12:20 kmkale         @roulett
12:20 huginn         kmkale: I suck
12:20 kmkale         @roulett spin
12:20 huginn         kmkale: I suck
12:20 kmkale         @roulett spin
12:20 huginn         kf: (roulette [spin]) -- Fires the revolver. If the bullet was in the chamber, you're dead. Tell me to spin the chambers and I will.
12:20 kf             @roulette :)
12:20 huginn         kmkale: I suck
12:20 kmkale         @roulett
12:19 kf             I am looking for the pref that controls if a serials shows you the items or the subscription tab first
12:19 huginn         kmkale: The current temperature in Mumbai, India is 32.0�C (5:10 PM IST on November 23, 2011). Conditions: Smoke. Humidity: 27%. Dew Point: 11.0�C. Pressure: 29.77 in 1008 hPa (Steady).
12:19 kmkale         @weather thane
12:19 kf             hm
12:19 huginn         kmkale: Quote #110: "chris: im rm, not god" (added by kf at 10:20 AM, December 08, 2010)
12:19 kmkale         @quote random
12:15 kmkale         hi kf :)
12:15 kf             :)
12:15 huginn         kf: Quote #166: "jcamins: this is IRC. There's a several decade long tradition of lurking." (added by wizzyrea at 03:06 PM, November 17, 2011)
12:15 kf             @quote random
12:13 huginn         kmkale: Quote #3: "< bignose-work> the only constant in climate over the next several decades will be that the climate doesn't match what you just got used to." (added by chris at 01:55 AM, June 12, 2009)
12:13 kmkale         @quote random
12:03 mib_xjcvw2     Me too! I will let you know..
12:02 kf             hope it works
12:02 kf             no problem :)
12:02 mib_xjcvw2     Oh.....thanks, I will check it out - sorry
12:02 kf             with 3.4 koha removed the items information from the marcxml blobs in the database, only keeping them in the items table now
12:01 kf             it's in the release notes for version 3.4
12:01 kf             you have to run a sscript
12:01 mib_xjcvw2     maybe 3.05 or 3.06
12:01 kf             ok
12:01 mib_xjcvw2     version was old....
12:01 mib_xjcvw2     yes, we'te using zebra
12:01 kf             are you using zebra?
12:01 kf             from which version did you update?
11:59 mib_xjcvw2     has anyone come across this?
11:59 mib_xjcvw2     also, if a bib is edited, all items dissappear!
11:59 mib_xjcvw2     and the item status isn't updating when an item is checked in
11:58 mib_xjcvw2     I have a site just upgraded to 3.6
11:58 mib_xjcvw2     Morning all
10:33 kf             hm
10:19 magnuse        yup :-(
10:19 kf             productive system?
10:18 kf             hm
10:15 magnuse        yeah, almost looks like it, but i can't really believe that either... it *is*the most plausible explanation, though...
10:14 kf             forgot to run the script?
10:10 magnuse        now if only i could understand why i have biblioitems.marcxml with 952s in them in *one* of my 3.4.5 installs...
10:08 magnuse        yay for koha in fiji
10:08 Oak            later guys
10:08 Oak            class time
10:00 Smita          Thanks.Will try it tommorrow, so that i can get my test case Ronnie Ballard be able to put hold on Harry Potter books. i am taking it to demo and set up koha at Nadi Library , Fiji. next week
09:58 magnuse        Smita: that sounds like a good plan to me
09:56 AmitG          hmm
09:56 mtj            we stayed around vagator, mostly - was really relaxing, after the madness of mumbai :p
09:54 mtj            rode scooters all over the place!
09:54 mtj            AmitG:  we didnt get to kerala :( goa was too nice - so we stayed in goa, the whole time after kohacon
09:54 Smita          Going back cir rules, have I inderstood it corretlt , that  i need to delete the random ones i have created and start from scratch. i need to  create a default one and replicate it for all branches will that work /
09:53 AmitG          mtj: can you share the link :D
09:53 mtj            i'm pretty keen to see Jo on TV....
09:52 AmitG          mtj: how is your Goa and Kerala trip
09:52 AmitG          aah! :D
09:52 mtj            hi amit - back in nz now :)
09:51 AmitG          heya mtj
09:51 mtj            nice positive comments from maori trademark lawyer Lynell Huria, too
09:49 Smita          It has created an awarness about Koha in common man in NZ, whcih is good thing, NZ is good in protesting
09:48 Smita          They interviewed Joann on national Tv, here in NZ, everyone in Nz is up in arms
09:47 mtj            was nice to hear Rach being interviewed (in the kitchen doing dishes?)
09:45 * mtj          just listened to it now
09:45 mtj            http://podcast.radionz.co.nz/ckpt/ckpt-20111123-1856-us_company_denies_hijacking_trademark_on_nz_software-00.ogg
09:45 kf             good night rangi
09:45 magnuse        sleep tight rangi
09:44 * rangi        goes to sleep
09:43 magnuse        np Oak
09:39 Oak            thank you magnuse :)
09:34 Oak            no problem at all kf
09:34 kf             some of your manual is covered there
09:34 kf             Oak: I am so sorry! wanted to look what is all on the wiki before I write you back
09:34 Oak            :) no worries
09:33 kf             Oak: which reminds me I have not answered your mail :(
09:33 magnuse        http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/Bug-enhancement-patch_Workflow
09:33 magnuse        'patch signer'
09:33 kf             not sure we have a real role name for it
09:33 kf             i think it would fall under bug wrangler perhaps?
09:33 kf             um
09:32 Oak            kf, what's the title for the person who signs off bugs?
09:29 rangi          Smita: also have you seen http://manual.koha-community.org/3.4/en/patscirc.html#circfinerules
09:29 magnuse        good call!
09:29 rangi          but i think ppl did well keeping it on topic
09:28 rangi          yeah, it was very trolly
09:28 * paul_p       has decided to stop feeding the troll though...
09:27 magnuse        paul_p++ for some excellent replies on that now famous blogpost
09:27 rangi          a nice video of how to configure them
09:27 rangi          this might help
09:27 rangi          http://bywatersolutions.com/2011/07/20/setting-circ-fine-rules-in-koha-3-4/
09:26 Smita          Hi I am a newbe to Koha. have just installed 3.4. have totally confused my self with setting up cir rules as a result cannot place hold, can anyone help me please
09:19 paul_p         lol !
09:19 * rangi        would just like to assure paul_p there is no conspiracy to give you the ball and not let you play, except in the innagrual kohacon rugby match in scotland :)
09:18 rangi          ahhh
09:18 AmitG          heya pual
09:18 paul_p         rangi, yes, your wb was the 1st thing I saw
09:16 * rangi        wonders if paul missed his joke?
09:16 kf             wb paul
09:15 paul_p         hello back (vpn connection...)
09:15 fredericd      thanks. If it works with others 3M SC, I will examine this specific device configuration
09:15 rangi          wb paul_p
09:15 kf             fredericd: he thinks there might be a way to configure it in the software of the self check -but we are not sure
09:14 kf             fredericd: talked to Uli - no new ideas, but he thinks it could be the line endings
09:14 rangi          but ill keep an eye out now :)
09:14 rangi          we have it running with a 3m machine for waitaki libraries, no issues yet
09:13 rangi          hmm
09:12 fredericd      autoflush
09:12 fredericd      Yes, or the autflush
09:11 kf             fredericd: it might be the line endings
09:11 kf             fredericd: we also have 3m in one of our libraries... a bit worried about updating now
09:10 fredericd      So I suppose that the recent modification of SIP server transport layer has broke few self checks support...
09:10 kf             fredericd: werid, perhaps something in the configuration settings?
09:10 fredericd      kf: No, but I had confirmation that it works with some Self Check and it doesn't with others...
09:08 magnuse        ;-)
09:08 magnuse        ooh, both jo and joann?
09:05 kf             hi AmitG
09:05 AmitG          :D
09:05 AmitG          heya kf
09:04 kf             heh :)
09:04 magnuse        hehe
09:04 rangi          rugby_analogies++
09:04 * rangi        would jsut like to assure paul_p there is no conspiracy to give you the ball and not let you play
09:01 kf             hi paul_p and hdl
09:00 rangi          and hiya hdl and fredericd
09:00 joann          heya paul
09:00 rangi          heya paul_p
08:59 magnuse        kia ora paul_p
08:59 joann          have to give up on loading the tvnz show and watch it tomorrow
08:52 kf             fredericd: were you able to solve your sip problem?
08:49 fredericd      joann: nice to see you! (on tv)
08:47 magnuse        hehe
08:44 kf             oh
08:43 joann          we are hardly speaking to him at the moment - and he is all pink faced and studiously ignoring us
08:42 ibeardslee     heh
08:42 joann          that Child of mine is downloading some game updates using steam, and it consumes 100% of our bandwidth for a week
08:41 joann          id really like to see the tv1 story but cant get it toload at all
08:41 ibeardslee     yes well done
08:41 joann          :)
08:39 kf             :)
08:39 magnuse        and we loves ya!
08:39 Oak            true
08:39 joann          yeah but guys are all lovcely :)
08:39 kf             what they said
08:38 magnuse        i think so too!
08:38 joann          thank you
08:37 rangi          i think you did well
08:37 kf             you have to trust us .)
08:37 kf             seeing yourself is never nice somehow
08:36 magnuse        sure, that's to be expected... :-/
08:36 joann          and how its been cut and sliced and diced
08:36 joann          i do cringe a bit about what i said
08:35 magnuse        "maybe it's just because i'm a kiwi" ;-)
08:34 kf             :)
08:33 magnuse        the last one works too - i just had to find the little "video" button
08:31 kf             magnuse: it takes a little while to start
08:31 rangi          may or may not work outside of nz
08:31 rangi          tv3
08:31 rangi          http://www.3news.co.nz/Rural-Kiwi-library-takes-US-corporate-to-task/tabid/423/articleID/233737/Default.aspx
08:31 kf             yep, can play it
08:31 magnuse        nice to hear joann's voice again - sad circumstances...
08:31 rangi          looking for a tv3 one
08:31 rangi          for tvnx
08:31 rangi          works
08:31 rangi          that first one
08:30 kf             rangi found a link that was working for me
08:30 joann          how did cait view it?
08:30 magnuse        rangi: thanks, i heard two radio spots already
08:30 joann          ok
08:30 magnuse        joann: nope, i get "server not found"
08:30 rangi          radio nz
08:29 rangi          http://podcast.radionz.co.nz/ckpt/ckpt-20111123-1856-us_company_denies_hijacking_trademark_on_nz_software-00.ogg
08:29 rangi          tvnz
08:29 rangi          http://tvnz.co.nz/national-news/horowhenua-library-battles-corporate-giant-video-4563575
08:29 joann          can you access tvondemand.co.nz
08:28 magnuse        hehe
08:28 kf             bookmarked on my laptop at home
08:28 magnuse        ah, of course
08:28 kf             I don't have the link, but it should be in the logs
08:27 magnuse        is it still available? or only streamed?
08:27 kf             do you have an estimate of how high the costs are goign to be?
08:27 joann          saw tv3 story though
08:27 kf             :)
08:27 joann          I havnt seen tv1 yet
08:27 joann          oh thank you :)
08:27 joann          at about $9k which is phenomenal
08:27 kf             I saw you on tv - you were great :)
08:26 kf             you have been busy!
08:26 kf             hi joann
08:26 magnuse        how's the defense fund coming along?
08:26 joann          really should write an update blog post but really tired
08:25 joann          heya Katrin
08:25 kf             hi again #koha
08:24 joann          see the email sent to LL copied to the comments on the koha-community blog?
08:24 joann          yup
08:22 rangi          :)
08:22 rangi          oh you made it
08:22 joann          oh yeah
08:22 magnuse        interesting times, eh? ;-)
08:21 joann          kia ora Magnus
08:21 magnuse        kia ora joann
08:20 magnuse        bonjour!
08:18 francharb      morning!
08:08 julian_m       hi rangi, hi all
08:00 magnuse        gory details are here: http://www.yr.no/place/Norway/Nordland/Bod%C3%B8/Bod%C3%B8/statistics.html :-)
07:59 rangi          wow
07:59 magnuse        the average temp for the last 30 days has been 7.4C - that's 5.4C above the average for this period!
07:57 rangi          hi julian_m
07:57 magnuse        nope, it's rather exceptional
07:56 rangi          that doesnt sound bad at all for winter
07:54 magnuse        nice
07:54 huginn         magnuse: The current temperature in Bodo, Norway is 9.0�C (8:20 AM CET on November 23, 2011). Conditions: Scattered Clouds. Humidity: 66%. Dew Point: 3.0�C. Pressure: 29.65 in 1004 hPa (Falling).
07:54 magnuse        @wunder boo
07:50 cait           lots of grey days recently
07:50 cait           which probably means we will have fog again all day
07:50 cait           it's still grey outside
07:50 cait           yeah, but still a lot nicer :)
07:47 rangi          was very windy again today
07:47 huginn         rangi: The current temperature in Wellington, New Zealand is 17.0�C (8:00 PM NZDT on November 23, 2011). Conditions: Scattered Clouds. Humidity: 77%. Dew Point: 13.0�C. Pressure: 29.62 in 1003 hPa (Steady).
07:47 rangi          @wunder wellington nz
07:47 huginn         cait: The current temperature in Taegerwilen, Taegerwilen, Germany is 1.6�C (8:45 AM CET on November 23, 2011). Conditions: Overcast. Humidity: 97%. Dew Point: 1.0�C. Windchill: 2.0�C. Pressure: 30.32 in 1026.6 hPa (Rising).
07:47 cait           @wunder Konstanz
07:38 rangi          :)
07:38 sijobl         the women of petone RLC are even bigger, but :-)
07:38 sijobl         well yes
07:37 rangi          petone rugby union on the other hand .. is pretty big :)
07:37 sijobl         heaps of staff, I should say
07:36 sijobl         it's clearly not on the same scale as petone rugby league club
07:36 reiveune       hello
07:33 rangi          hehe yeah, kalamazoo
07:33 * sijobl       loves that koha.com is still albout some provincial hockey team
07:27 rangi          :)
07:25 sijobl         news at ten, open source project bickers over trademarks
07:25 sijobl         otherwise it's a fairly dull story
07:24 sijobl         appropriated, even
07:24 sijobl         with more maori culture getting apprpriate overseas, so on, and so forth
07:24 sijobl         not having listened to any of the reports, or read any of what the media was saying, I assumed it would be a good story to join the dots to have a dig about trade agreements being negotiated in secret
07:22 rangi          hmmmm, not that i know of
07:22 sijobl         is anybody using it in a anti trade agreements angle yet?
07:18 rangi          jo was on tv1 and tv3
07:18 rangi          probably following up
07:18 rangi          ahh
07:18 sijobl         sounds like she's on morning report tomorrow
07:18 sijobl         chris: R was quizzed by natrad again this evening
07:16 cait           hi alex_a :)
07:16 rangi          hello alex_a
07:16 alex_a         hello #koha
07:14 cait           might have scared them away
07:12 magnuse        looks like that newspaper stopped using #koha on twitter?
07:09 rangi          morning Guillaume1
06:58 rangi          http://podcast.radionz.co.nz/ckpt/ckpt-20111123-1856-us_company_denies_hijacking_trademark_on_nz_software-00.ogg
06:58 magnuse        Oak
06:55 Oak            magnuse
06:55 magnuse        cait: suggest a date and we'll nail it :-)
06:48 rangi          according to twitter
06:48 rangi          hmm it was apparently on tvone too
06:47 cait           hm.
06:47 huginn         cait: You know the answer better than I.
06:47 cait           @eightball thursday
06:46 huginn         cait: Of course.
06:46 cait           @eightball wednesday
06:46 cait           so
06:46 cait           heh
06:46 magnuse        yay
06:46 magnuse        i'd like to try something that's not a friday
06:46 cait           or alternate perhaps
06:46 cait           not friday
06:46 magnuse        any suggestions?
06:46 cait           I think we talked about having it on another day
06:46 magnuse        pre-xmas gbsd... ;-)
06:45 magnuse        no date for gbsd, but we can always set one
06:45 * magnuse      was back yesterday
06:45 rangi          its always a good time to squash bugs
06:45 magnuse        cait++
06:45 rangi          heh
06:44 cait           this sentence looks wrong...
06:44 cait           all this TM talk makes me want to squash some bugs
06:44 huginn         New commit(s) needsignoff: [Bug 7197] ES translation of the Debian readme <http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7197>
06:44 cait           magnuse: do we have a date for gbsd?
06:43 cait           back from your travels? :)
06:43 magnuse        hiya cait rangi ibeardslee and #koha
06:41 ibeardslee     some radio station was after some comment from NZOSS
06:41 cait           morning magnuse
06:41 cait           wow
06:40 rangi          plus both tv1 and tv3 interviewed
06:40 rangi          including one from sydney
06:40 rangi          yeah, i think 8 radio stations now
06:39 ibeardslee     Just saw a segment on TV3 plus .. this has legs!
06:31 indradg        morning #koha
06:29 rangi          back
05:58 cait           funny to hear nz english again :)
05:58 eythian        yeah, far too late
05:57 cait           but too late now :(
05:57 cait           eythian: can see the live stream
05:54 rangi          back later
05:53 rangi          right gotta put kids to bed
05:40 eythian        but, that's more likely to be restricted to NZ (I don't know for sure)
05:40 rangi          yeah
05:40 eythian        I think it'll probably go up some time after 7pm or so.
05:39 kmkale         hey any non-live link?
05:38 eythian        yeah, not a bad segment
05:38 rangi          hmm i think i just missed it on tv1
05:38 rangi          schweet
05:37 rangi          wow, long item
05:37 rangi          yup
05:37 eythian        jransom is on TV :)
05:36 eythian        ah here we go
05:36 eythian        streaming must be delayed a minute or so
05:36 rangi          you must have a slight delay
05:36 rangi          yeah after that
05:36 eythian        I'm seeing sharemarket stuff
05:36 rangi          on now
05:33 eythian        yeah
05:33 rangi          still christchurch stuff
05:33 rangi          cool
05:32 eythian        http://www.3news.co.nz/VideoBrowseAll/3NewsLiveStream/tabid/387/Default.aspx <-- this might do it
05:31 rangi          hmm i think maybe only after
05:30 * eythian      wonders if tv3 streams
05:30 rangi          tv3 is sposta be showing the TM thing after the ads
05:30 rangi          if you are near a tv
05:11 cait           hello mr Oak :)
05:11 Oak            hello miss cait :)
04:49 eythian        hrm
04:49 wahanui        i haven't a clue, eythian
04:49 eythian        wahanui: what is the saddest thing?
04:49 wahanui        OK, eythian.
04:49 eythian        wahanui: \what \is \the saddest thing is <reply>U+26C4 ⛄ SNOWMAN WITHOUT SNOW
04:48 eythian        hi kmkale
04:48 * eythian      gives up
04:48 kmkale         hi eythian
04:48 wahanui        no idea, eythian
04:48 eythian        wahanui: what \is the saddest thing is <reply>U+26C4 ⛄ SNOWMAN WITHOUT SNOW
04:48 wahanui        i haven't a clue, eythian
04:48 eythian        wahanui: what is the saddest thing is <reply>U+26C4 ⛄ SNOWMAN WITHOUT SNOW
04:48 wahanui        wish i knew, eythian
04:48 eythian        wahanui: what is the saddest thing?
04:37 rangi          and .ogg too
04:37 * Brooke       nods.
04:37 rangi          they record everything thats the good thing
04:37 Brooke         rest up
04:36 jransom        o im going home
04:36 Brooke         archiving this stuff properly is a task I welcome, though.
04:36 * Brooke       crosses her fingers.
04:36 rangi          its a long show, so could be on anytime
04:36 rangi          im wondering if they will play rachels interview on there
04:35 rangi          oh
04:35 jransom        NewstalkZB
04:34 jransom        no was just foing an interview on radio talk something
04:33 kmkale         hi jransom, rangi & Oak :)
04:26 rangi          listening ng to checkpoint?
04:25 Oak            hey jransom :)
04:24 jransom        hey friends
04:23 * Brooke       laughs.
04:22 wahanui        jransom is gonna *smek* someone.
04:22 rangi          hey jransom
04:21 Brooke         0/
04:13 Brooke         http://www.amazon.com/Defense-Technology-56895-Stream-Pepper/product-reviews/B0058EOAUE/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1
04:07 * Oak          heart Brooke
04:04 Oak            :-)
04:04 * Brooke       hugs Oak.
04:04 Brooke         hey hey
04:04 Oak            Hello Brooke
04:04 * Oak          waves
03:56 kmkale         Namaste Brooke :)
03:56 kmkale         Namaskaar #koha
03:56 Brooke         namaste kmkale.
03:49 Brooke         howdy
03:49 AmitG          heya Brooke :D
03:47 Brooke         0/
03:37 Irma           AmitG :-)
03:36 AmitG          Irma: I am fine How r u?
03:36 rangi          bbl
03:36 rangi          my bus stop
03:36 Irma           Hi AmitG I have just a few minutes ... how are you?
03:35 AmitG          Irma around?
03:35 stevenmirabito Oh god, that's sick. And sad. Koha's much nicer than the piece of crap that my school uses (*cough* Mandarin *cough*)
03:35 rangi          hiya AmitG
03:34 AmitG          heya chris
03:32 wahanui        :)
03:32 rangi          wahanui: botsnack
03:32 rangi          has a post that explains it :)
03:31 wahanui        i heard koha-community.org was actually updated and right
03:31 rangi          koha-community.org
03:31 rangi          ahhh
03:31 stevenmirabito Obviously I'm out of the loop
03:30 rangi          true
03:30 chrisdothall   hehe
03:29 rangi          especially in the context of the last few days
03:29 rangi          excellent thats great to hear
03:29 stevenmirabito Well, not everyone needs it - it's really just useful for those who need to use the offline circulation tool
03:29 rangi          bugs.koha-community.org
03:28 stevenmirabito I actually found LibLime Koha first, but moved here after I learned the history of the project. So far, I'm very happy. :)
03:28 rangi          to get that job added to the koha-common cron jobs
03:28 rangi          u might wanna file an ehancement request
03:28 stevenmirabito Yep - it's a whole lot easier than doing all of the config manually
03:27 rangi          sweet u use the packages?
03:27 stevenmirabito Thanks for your help rangi!
03:27 stevenmirabito And is installed on Debian @ /usr/share/koha/bin/cronjobs/create_koc_db.pl
03:26 * rangi        is happy to be wrong
03:25 rangi          ah cool :)
03:25 stevenmirabito Success! It does come bundled in the Koha release in ./misc/cronjobs/
03:25 rangi          it was developed by kyle hall so if google u should find it
03:24 rangi          right im pretty sure its not there, ie its not part of core koha
03:23 stevenmirabito That's where I'm looking now
03:22 rangi          in case it is there
03:22 rangi          you could also look in git.koha-community.org
03:21 rangi          try google for kylemhall koha offline circ
03:21 rangi          im on my phone so can't look easily
03:21 rangi          hmm I think that comes separate to koha
03:20 stevenmirabito It creates the SQLite DB for the Offline Circulation Tool
03:19 stevenmirabito Does anyone know where I might find create_koc_db.pl?
03:19 rangi          hi stevenmirabito
03:19 stevenmirabito Hi all!
03:17 eythian        guess I shouldn't bike then
03:17 rangi          but watch out at the intersections
03:17 rangi          nope
03:14 chrisdothall   still raining?
03:12 rangi          man its windy out here
02:58 rangi          wind
02:57 eythian        is that a quake or the wind?
02:50 rangi          http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/91830/lawyer-labels-overseas-trademark-of-'koha'-offensive
02:50 rangi          kiwi_chap: a bunch of law firms have offered help to HLT from what ive heard, so I think things are moving in the right direction
02:49 kiwi_chap      has the library considered contacting http://www.eff.org ? not exactly there stuff but they would be able to point the library in the right direction I am sure regarding the open source corporate hijacking issue
00:23 mtj            http://slashdot.org/
00:23 mtj            oooh Koha trademark on slashdot, zOmg!