Time  Nick        Message
01:56 * wasabi    rebuilds a scis-disked win2003 sever at AFW, today :/
01:56 chris       eeewww
01:57 wasabi      its a 2-year-old nightmare, thats finally happened...
01:58 wasabi      mobo died in the weekend, no external backups, etc
01:59 chris       classy
02:00 wasabi      im now getting the friendly windows-popup reminder, that my new server is about to disable itself in 3 days time
02:01 chris       you shoulda just put linux on there theres that theme that looks like windows... and with sambafs .. theyd never know ;-)
02:03 wasabi      they also run a few win32 apps on it too, so its a bit trickier
02:04 chris       wine :)
02:04 chris       srsly though, you dont want to get trapped doing windows support, down that road lies madness
02:05 richard     it sure does. especially when you don't even do linuz support
02:05 * richard   is learning a lot about windows
02:05 richard     and it isn't healthy
02:05 chris       hehe
02:08 wasabi      im a nice guy, and they are in a pickle... thats as far as my windows anything goes
02:21 * chris_n`` agrees with chris's assessment of win32 support
02:22 chris       :)
02:25 * chris_n   had the nightmare of a *nix box's li-ion battery go bad and the time got reset to 8 years ago....
02:25 chris_n     and then the nightly backups ran
02:26 chris_n     so now one tape out of 12 is stamped with a date eight years previous to the rest :-P
02:26 chris       heh
02:51 wizzyrea_   that's a terrible nightmare :P
02:51 wasabi      hows this for a fail....
02:51 wasabi      the server has 2 identilcal disks, mirrored..
02:53 wasabi      at some stage the mirroring of the 2nd disk got stopped, and then used as a data-dump
02:53 wasabi      its the data-dump, that has all the important files on....
02:54 wizzyrea_   !
02:55 wasabi      if i *fix* the 2nd disk, by re-sync-ing the mirror, i risk blowing away whats currently on it?
02:56 wasabi      ie: all the important files
02:56 robin       that's not a risk, that's certain
02:57 wasabi      yeah, i cant currently 'see' the D; drive...
02:57 robin       maybe the disk has failed hard?
02:58 wasabi      but the disk is detected, etc..
02:58 wizzyrea_   yea, it may be time for a freezer treatment
02:58 robin       yeah, there's many different failure modes for harddrives.
02:58 robin       I had a 250GB that started reporting as 8MB
02:59 wizzyrea_   I had a totally dead one a few years ago that had a PHD student's only copy of their dissertation on it
02:59 wasabi      nope, it partically boots of the 2nd disk, but then BSODs
03:00 robin       wizzyrea_: I think that if they only have one copy, they deserve to re-write it.
03:00 robin       wasabi: _many_ failure modes :)
03:00 wizzyrea_   ended up getting their stuff back by putting the drive in a ziplock bag, sucking all the air out, freezing it overnight, then pulling the dissertation off in the 10 minutes the drive worked before it died for good
03:01 robin       yeah, that's a common emergency treatment.
03:01 robin       In my case, I swapped the controller board with one from a matching good drive.
03:01 wasabi      im gonna have to usb-mount a linux , then  ntfs-mount the 2nd disk to salvage...
03:01 wizzyrea_   ooh, that's a good trick
03:01 robin       only worked because it was electrical rather than hardware failure.
03:02 wizzyrea_   people often underestimate the common nature of electrical failure
03:02 robin       But my backup disks had fallen over (literally) two days previous, so I had no backups any more - needed to recover it.
03:02 wasabi      then attempt the mirror re-sync
03:07 wasabi      and i think ive just accidentally kicked-off a re-sync... :/
03:08 robin       oops
03:12 Amit        heya chris, brendan
03:13 brendan     heya amit
03:18 chris       hi amit
05:03 hdl         hi
05:35 kf          good morning #koha
05:37 hdl         hi kf
05:38 kf          hi hdl
07:17 kf          morning magnus
07:17 magnus      Guten Morgen, kf
07:22 slef        owen: what did you want? :-)
07:26 magnus      slef: probably a bit early/late for owen?
07:27 slef        magnus: well, it's the soonest I'm here since he asked :-)
07:27 magnus      :-)
07:36 ghi         koha can use ldap authentication and  in my organization ICT department uses ldap and i tried to configure in koha-conf.xml,but when i go to patrons, it says there is no result and the error log also didn't display any error!
07:41 chris       Evening
07:45 magnus      evening, chris
07:52 kf          hi chris
07:52 kf          ghi: sorry, I have no experience with ldap. probably better try the mailing lists, bigger audience there
07:54 kf          chris: saw your exchange with galen in the logs - is acq upgrade the only blocker for release right now?
07:54 ghi         kf: thank you
07:58 slef        ghi: check your system preferences, then check the ldap server logs to see if it disagreed with koha, but there's too many possibilities.
07:58 slef        oops
07:59 slef        too slow :-/
07:59 slef        biab
07:59 * magnus    goes to read the log
08:32 chris       kf: yes
08:32 chris       kf: i updated the bug with some more info about how i worked around it for hlt
08:33 kf          yep, read it
08:34 kf          i saw that u used a file for export and import - can this work for the web installer too?
08:36 slef        @wunder weston-super-mare
08:36 munin       slef: The current temperature in Weston-Super-Mare, United Kingdom is 14.1�C (9:45 AM BST on August 24, 2010). Conditions: Light Rain Showers. Humidity: 89%. Dew Point: 12.0�C. Pressure: 29.73 in 1006.7 hPa (Steady).
08:36 slef        Light???  Would someone mind telling the world to obey the reports?
08:36 kf          @wunder Konstanz
08:36 munin       kf: The current temperature in Taegerwilen, Taegerwilen, Germany is 21.4�C (10:46 AM CEST on August 24, 2010). Conditions: Light Rain Showers. Humidity: 84%. Dew Point: 19.0�C. Pressure: 29.82 in 1009.7 hPa (Steady).
08:37 kf          warmer here, but we share the rain showers
08:37 slef        The rain showers here would be more accurately described as "hammering" or "torrential"
08:38 kf          ok, it's better here
08:38 kf          but still annoying, we have a lot of rain this year
08:38 chris       kf: not easily
08:39 kf          chris: ok
08:40 chris       but it might help galen figure out a way round
08:43 paul_p      hi chris & kf & slef & magnus & al
08:43 kf          hi paul_p
08:44 magnus      hi paul_p
08:44 magnus      @wunder bodo
08:44 munin       magnus: The current temperature in Bodo, Norway is 14.0�C (10:20 AM CEST on August 24, 2010). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 63%. Dew Point: 7.0�C. Pressure: 29.53 in 1000 hPa (Steady).
08:44 magnus      not a cloud in sight here...
08:45 kf          :)
08:45 kf          ok, meeting, bbl
08:45 chris       hi paul_p
08:46 slef        magnus: mine are heading your way :P
08:46 magnus      slef: you can keep them if you want
08:47 magnus      slef: looks like we will steer clear, fingers crossed: http://www.yr.no/place/Norway/Nordland/Bod%C3%B8/L%C3%B8psmarka/long.html
09:07 chris       slef: did you want to send a bio and/or a photo for http://www.kohacon10.org.nz/2010/program/bio.html ?
09:12 slef        chris: didn't I already do that?
09:13 chris       not that i got
09:13 slef        I thought it was Kristina who emailed me.  I'll resend and cc you.
09:13 chris       ahh i emailed first, i think she sent reminders out
09:13 chris       cool thanks
09:59 wajasu      i think i found out why my git clone was hanging.  i changed my MTU from 576 and now I get 10x the network bandwidth. Sheesh. And the git clone works and is fast.
10:02 chris       heh yeah that'd do it
10:26 chris       hdl++
10:31 chris       slef: http://www.kohacon10.org.nz/2010/program/bio.html#mj
10:36 slef        chris: Thanks.  Any chance of </p><p> before "His key" and <a href="http://www.software.coop/">software.coop</a> ?
10:37 chris       yup
10:37 chris       2 secs
10:37 slef        ta
10:37 magnus      chris: am i right in thinking that hdl's patch is a partial fix for the acq blocker?
10:38 chris       yup
10:40 magnus      cool!
10:40 chris       slef: hows that?
10:42 slef        chris: link great, break ok - no space between paragraphs on that page?
10:43 slef        eww, it's all <br />s - rather you than me and don't let Stuart Yeates find out ;-)
10:43 magnus      "Open Library & Koha Sitting In A Tree"? sounds intriguing...
10:44 chris       i changed it to <p>
10:44 slef        hehe
10:44 slef        cool, thanks
10:45 chris       magnus: yeah that should be a good presentation, we are working on some thigns to show off
10:46 chris       the road trip gets into wellington on the 24th right?
10:46 slef        There are all these "open <somethign>" projects but few seem to have "HOWTO use this in your other open library software" guides.
10:47 slef        chris: I forget where to find out :) let me check
10:47 chris       yeah open library are pretty good about that, and getting better
10:47 slef        I think it gets in on the Monday
10:48 chris       http://openlibrary.org/developers/api
10:48 slef        or maybe it's the Sunday
10:48 chris       hmm, the monday is the first day of conference, so i hope sunday :)
10:48 slef        damn, this isn't clear... and S has the itinerary with her
10:48 chris       magnus: you are doing the roadtrip too eh?
10:49 slef        Well, the road trip refers to "2 nights accommodation"
10:49 slef        figure it out from that :)
10:49 chris       :)
10:49 magnus      yup, we get to Wellington sunday, as far as i can tell
10:49 chris       sweet
10:50 magnus      i think that is one night in auckland, and one on the road
10:50 chris       yeah that makes sense
10:50 magnus      http://koha-community.org/kohacon2010-roadtrip/
10:51 chris       http://revealingerrors.com/bucklame
10:51 chris       so if you hear people talking about bucklame .. they mean auckland :)
10:52 magnus      nice to know
10:52 chris       or dorkland
10:52 magnus      ;-)
10:53 magnus      any names for wellington? ;
10:53 chris       not really, not that i know of
10:53 chris       apart from windy wellington
10:54 magnus      perhaps because you live in wellington and people don't use the funny names to your face? ;-)
10:54 chris       hehe could be
10:54 chris       im sure that wouldnt stop the dorklanders :)
10:55 chris       ill have to ask at work tomorrow
10:58 * magnus    goes in search of some much needed lunch
11:47 indradg     hi #koha
11:55 paul_p      any sysop around ? chris / chris_n, gmcharlt, kf_mtg wizzyrea  ?
11:56 kf_mtg      here
11:56 paul_p      hdl can't reach us, he get a :  Closing Link: biblibre-breteuil.pck.nerim.net (Too many host connections (local))
11:56 kf          came back from lunch 5 minutes ago
11:56 paul_p      so mtg means lunch for you ? I like your meetings, feel free to invite me any time :D
11:57 kf          it started with a meeting that was so long, it was too late for cafeteria
11:58 kf          paul_p; I am not sure what I can do
11:58 kf          chris: still around?
11:59 paul_p      strange... everyone except me has left the channel, and hdl still can't connect :(
11:59 kf          :(
12:01 kf          paul_p: I tried google on the error message, but not sure where the problem is, perhaps it's a problem with biblibre-breteuil.pck.nerim.net?
12:02 paul_p      kf, I don't think so because i'm 1m far from hdl
12:11 gmcharlt    paul_p: si would be a better bet - can he reach any channel on irc.katipo.co.nz ?
12:13 collum      tr@v@n40
12:14 kf          hi gmcharlt :)
12:15 paul_p      'morning gmcharlt
12:17 collum      oops - time to change that password :)
12:19 magnus      collum: we won't tell anyone... ;-)
12:19 collum      Thanks.  I changed it anyway.
12:23 laurenthd   hi
12:24 kf          hi hdl
12:24 kf          have you found the problem?
12:24 laurenthd   which one ?
12:24 kf          not being able to login to #koha
12:25 hdl         using mibbit to connect
12:25 hdl         looks like the irc server is refusing me access
12:26 hdl         because we are quite a number of folks using the same ip
12:31 hilongo     Hello #koha  :)
12:34 slef        hdl: can you switch to ipv6 and get more IPs? ;-)
12:34 slef        (does this server support ipv6?)
12:35 slef        hdl: alternative, use ssh -L 6667:irc.katipo.co.nz:6667 someserver.biblibre.com and connect to localhost as IRC server, bouncing off of a biblibre server IP ;-)
12:35 slef        not perfect but OK
12:43 hilongo     A quick question about fines ...
12:43 hilongo     I am trying 3.2 and have set up circ rules to use days suspension and not maney fines
12:44 hilongo     *but* after I run fines.pl ... nothing gets into the fines account of the users with overdue books  :(
12:46 hilongo     I put the Koha_DEBUG to 1 and I've found that the insertions fail because a duplicated entry '1'
12:48 hilongo     anyone who's working with fine days?
12:48 hdl         hilongo : I have
12:49 hilongo     hello hdl :)
12:50 hilongo     I am testing 3.2 but I can't get fine days to work
12:52 hdl         we have done work on that on our master branch.
12:52 hdl         But I have to rebase on 3.2
12:53 hilongo     I see...
12:54 hilongo     so ... how does it work? ... you run fines.pl nightly and the days amount gets in the patron's account?
12:55 hdl         No, it is juste updating debarred as a date
12:55 hdl         and using that date to check whether it is over or still active
12:55 hilongo     aah .. I see
12:57 hilongo     but I thought debarred was a yes/no flag
12:57 hdl         you can test that on git.biblibre.com:koha_biblibre.git
12:57 hdl         hilongo : we changed the yes/no flag to be a date
12:59 hilongo     great .. that sounds good for us :)
12:59 hilongo     any idea about when / if these changes will get into 3.2??
13:00 jcamins     Good morning.
13:00 hilongo     Good morning jcamins
13:00 hdl         I have to work on rebase.
13:02 hilongo     ok hdl ... I wish you very good luck with that  :)
13:06 jwagner     @later tell reva Sorry I had to leave in a hurry last night. I tested your situation on a current head server, and it also does not read the 852 i to build the item call number.  As I suggested last night, this would seem to be a Koha bug and not related to the version being run on our demo site.  You should probably open a bugzilla report on the problem.
13:06 munin       jwagner: The operation succeeded.
13:33 jcamins     jwagner: Thanks for the jQuery snippet a few weeks ago. I was able to figure out how to add a custom bookplate on opac-details using jQuery yesterday. :)
13:42 jwagner     jcamins, you're welcome
13:47 jcamins     Testing Amazon covers is really hard with a collection full of weird books that Amazon doesn't sell.
13:54 kf          jcamind: I ended up importing some records where I knew there was a cover
13:55 jcamins     That would have made sense. I tried searching for only books from 2000 or later, and just paging through the results until I found something.
13:55 jcamins     It turns out the covers are working fine.
13:55 jcamins     :)
13:57 jcamins     And I used brendan's CSS snippet to put in a bookplate instead of "cover not found."
14:02 jcamins     Our logo is a bit bold, but I think it probably looks better than "No cover image available."
14:03 wizzyrea    link or it didn't happen ;)
14:03 jcamins     http://donum.numismatics.org/cgi-bin/koha/opac-search.pl?do=Search&limit-yr=2000-&limit=mc-itemtype:BK&sort_by=relevance
14:03 jcamins     wizzyrea: I have eagerly been awaiting someone asking that.
14:03 wizzyrea    oh that's very nice
14:04 wizzyrea    that bookplate covers up the amazon image not found?
14:04 jcamins     Right.
14:04 wizzyrea    just to be sure, you may want to make super double sure that doing that is ok under amazon's terms of service. I can't imagine that it's not, but corporations are weird.
14:05 wizzyrea    but it looks fabulous
14:05 wizzyrea    :)
14:05 wizzyrea    :D
14:05 jcamins     Hm, yeah, I guess we should probably check.
14:05 wizzyrea    wish I had a logo that looked that awesome as a bookplate.
14:06 jcamins     It looks like Koha provides the "no cover image available" text, so I don't think we're obscuring anything provided by Amazon.
14:06 wizzyrea    cool beans
14:06 wizzyrea    but that really does look faboo
14:07 jcamins     Thanks.
14:07 jwagner     It does look very nice indeed
14:08 sekjal      wizzyrea: you could maybe get some generic bound-book cover (in maroon or blue or green or whatever), and then adjust the "no image found" text to look like a title printed on that cover
14:08 wizzyrea    Ooh. That is a good idea
14:08 sekjal      perhaps in some kind of gold-leaf like color and weight
14:08 wizzyrea    hehe I can see you've thought a lot about that
14:10 sekjal      it would be even better if we could use the title instead of 'no image found', but that would involve more than just CSS
14:10 sekjal      and could be problematic for long titles
14:10 wizzyrea    yea
14:10 kf          jcamins: it took a long time to load the book plate for me
14:11 jcamins     kf: Yeah, that's on our regular web server.
14:11 briceSanc   hi koha
14:12 briceSanc   do you know how can i log the response of a SQL import in a koha script ?
14:16 libtek      Good morning.  I was wondering if anyone here is running Koha for their library independantly without 3rd party support.  In other words, is anyone here doing their own support?
14:17 jcamins     libtek: we did it briefly.
14:17 jcamins     Suffice it to say, we love working with ByWater.
14:18 sekjal      jcamins: thanks, we love working with you, too.
14:18 wajasu      looking into how to customize the OPAC details biblio display for an academic library so that various MARC xxx fields are shown.  It looks like each new field needs to be "made available" for the HTML::Template, as well as the template updated accordingly.
14:18 briceSanc   hi sekjal !
14:19 sekjal      hi briceSanc
14:19 jcamins     wajasu: we found working with the XSLT much easier.
14:20 libtek      jcamins: what prompted you to move to 3rd party support?
14:21 jcamins     (answering off-channel)
14:22 wajasu      i could go there. i looked into it.  (i.e. removed trailing slash in titles).  Is the whole MARCXML record present and we just pick what we would like to show.
14:22 wajasu      i keep wanting to write procedural code and have to think XSLT.
14:24 jcamins     wajasu: yeah, it requires some adjustments, but you have everything available, and customization is easier.
14:25 wajasu      does the theme support allow me to grab an existing XSLT, copying it to a new "templatedirectory" and it will override the default XSLT, still using all the other stuff as is.
14:25 briceSanc   what do you thnk about an extension manager in Koha (like TYPO3)?
14:26 jcamins     wajasu: I don't think so, but that's an awesome idea.
14:28 sekjal      alright, #koha, got a meeting; be back in a bit
14:28 wizzyrea    i love the idea of extensions in koha
14:29 briceSanc   it could be a good feature for Koha 3.6
14:29 wajasu      yeah.  then I can build koha as a distribution package, then my customization would be an optional dependency to install.
14:30 wajasu      did you all use an XSLT editor? if so, which one?
14:31 jcamins     wajasu: vim. ;)
14:31 wajasu      thats what i use.
14:33 jcamins     What tags do you need to add to the OPAC?
14:35 wajasu      i need to add 10+ marc fields to my biblio details that are "missing" as my librarian cries.   let me find an email request I got.
14:40 wajasu      my librarian wants:  http://pastebin.com/VFFCAd8k
14:42 jcamins     Oh, so it's not that they're missing, it's that they want a different format.
14:43 jcamins     (the first "they" being tags, the second librarians)
14:44 wajasu      yeah. i wondered if the whole markxml record from the DB is the input to the XSLT stylesheet, and i would be working against that.  Or would I need to inject in perl code other XML from database fields.
14:45 jcamins     The XSLT works with the entire MARCXML record.
14:46 jcamins     Possibly excepting the items... perhaps someone else knows that for sure?
14:46 wajasu      ok. thats what i wanted to confirm.  and the XSLT outputs HTML and CSS is used for presentation.
14:49 wajasu      lets say i spent time doing such a thing, which I assume is a common request, I'd like to have a clean way to configure and override the existing perl/XSLT files without touching the original in the distribution.
14:51 jcamins     I don't know how to do that, but I would *love* to have that ability.
14:51 wajasu      so when updates/release show up, the override "may" work.  that way i can manage customizations in the OS package manager.
14:52 wajasu      but then I would want to be able to configure the available views "Normal, MARC, ... Academic", with Academic being my default for my library.
14:54 jwagner     wajasu, I've been wanting to have local XSLT stylesheets for a while.  BibLibre was working on something that was supposed to allow for it.
14:55 wajasu      i guess i'll try extending the latest XSLT now, and if I'm successful, I'll look into how to make it pluggable. maybe some more logic in how the template is selected.
14:55 wajasu      i wanted to learn what the idea of a "theme" is, and what it can do for me.
14:57 wajasu      if i can add a "custommade" theme that has a different JPG/GIF, then can I also add a different XSLTtemplate.
15:13 aarkerio    hi! buenos d�as,  in what menu is the option to add my first book?
15:13 aarkerio    Cataloging ?
15:23 wajasu      yes. cataloguing.  you add a biblio ( search via z3950 server ), and add an item(i.e. book) for that biblio.
15:28 aarkerio    I don't understand,  why I am searching?
15:31 jcamins     jwagner: I just saw your SFX patch.
15:32 jwagner     Yes, we finally got mail working on my dev server & I got around to resending it.
15:32 jwagner     Now if I could get time to work on some of the _other_ patches on my list....
15:33 jcamins     Heh. I have a couple of patches for MARC21 COiNS support that I need to resubmit, but one could build on your patch to support fine-grained link resolving with COiNS.
15:34 jcamins     (once I submit those patches, which is prolblematic because they predate my understanding how to use git properly)
15:41 * wizzyrea  wonders if anyone has ever written a book titled "using git properly"
15:42 * jcamins   nominates wizzyrea for writing that book
15:42 wizzyrea    noooo
15:42 wizzyrea    no no no no no
15:42 wizzyrea    that would be a mistake of epic proportions
15:42 * jcamins   looks very sad, like the cat in Shrek
15:43 wizzyrea    now Chris...
15:43 wizzyrea    or gmcharlt...
15:43 wizzyrea    those guys might be able to write it
15:43 gmcharlt    with lots of help - ideally Linus would right it, then have an editor to translate to remove the "Git-qua-Linus" aspects of the text
15:45 jcamins     I could probably write "how not to use git."
15:45 wizzyrea    ^^ me too
15:45 wizzyrea    though I'm getting better I think
15:45 jcamins     It could be shelved in the geek humor section.
15:46 jcamins     "Can you believe he did THAT?!? HAhahahahaha!"
15:57 jcamins     Oh wow! You can resize text boxes in the Add MARC window.
16:32 Braedon     jcamins: actually, due to Koha? or are you using the firefox beta?
16:33 Braedon     o, wait. apparently 30 minutes has past since you sent the message i was replying to... damn you empathy with your random quits
16:34 Braedon     sorry
16:34 jcamins     Oh. I don't know.
16:34 jcamins     I'm on Chrome.
16:34 Braedon     ahh, ok
16:34 jcamins     I guess that might be it.
16:35 jcamins     Well, whatever the reason, resizing text boxes is really cool.
16:35 Braedon     I use the firefox dailys, and a while ago i was like wow, gmail implemented resizing text boxes, awesome.
16:35 Braedon     took me a day to realise it was firefox doing it, not some javascript magic
16:35 Braedon     and yes, yes it is :P
16:35 wizzyrea    i love that in chrome
16:36 wizzyrea    has made my epic jquery sojourns of late bearable
16:36 jcamins     See, one of you should have taken credit for it. I wouldn't have known. ;)
16:40 wizzyrea    oh yea that was me >.>
16:40 wizzyrea    j/k
16:40 wizzyrea    totally not
16:44 Braedon     on a totally unrelated and offtopic note, anyone here happen to be a referencing wizard?
16:44 Braedon     I really need to reference this: http://www.scribd.com/doc/5507536/Sustainable-Software-Engineering But it doesn't seem to be published anywhere.
16:44 Braedon     Of course that would normally mean that i shouldn't and wouldn't reference it, but as i am writing a paper set 15 years in the future(don't ask), relevant resources are extremely hard to come by.
16:45 jcamins     Braedon: you're probably on the right kind of channel.
16:45 Braedon     i hope so. I am looking kinda doomed at the moment :P
16:46 slef        any kohacon10 organisers awake? I'm confused again :-(
16:47 Braedon     there seems to be a almost complete lack of reference-able information on sustainable software development. it is very frustraiting. I have found 1 book, with no electronic copy, and that paper, which is written by a student and not published.
16:47 Braedon     slef: it is 5am in New Zealand if that helps
16:47 slef        Why does Braedon need to reference "1 Rule to a Flat Stomach: Obey"?  Or is scribd broken for me again? ;-)
16:48 Braedon     haha, i'm going to go with broken
16:48 Braedon     either that or my sleep deprivation is really getting to me
16:49 jcamins     The link worked for me.
16:49 slef        Braedon: http://www.oss-watch.ac.uk/resources/researchinfrastructure-sustainability.xml
16:49 slef        jcamins: I think scribd gets upset if it gets told it can't have scripts and cookies.
16:50 slef        Braedon: I don't know if that's any help.
16:50 jcamins     Braedon: reference it as an unpublished manuscript, if you can't find anything else to use instead.
16:50 collum      Braedon: worked for me in explorer, not FF, or chrome.
16:52 Braedon     slef: thanks for the link - may be able to get something out of it
17:01 collum      Braedon: http://www.yale.edu/bass/writing/sources/kinds/miscellaneous/unpublished.html
17:03 Braedon     hmm, ok. thanks collum
17:04 hdl         collum: if you can test the patch I sent today, i would be gratefull.
17:08 collum      hdl:  Are you getting me and collin mixed up again? :)
17:08 hdl         omg...
17:08 hdl         I think so.
17:09 hdl         sorry, end of a day
17:09 collum      np. I wasn't as confused this time.
17:41 tcohen      hi, if anyone has seen my recent patches
17:41 tcohen      i'm willing to discuss them
17:41 tcohen      whenever you want!
17:42 sekjal      tcohen: regardless of the outcome of cronjob vs. daemon, I appreciate having access to the various functions.  I think what you've done opens up more options for us
18:34 cfouts      tcohen: the way we handle servicing both real-time and on-request updates is to use Dan Berstein's daemontools package to trigger and accept index update requests
18:34 cfouts      requires no modifications to rebuild_zebra.pl
18:35 cfouts      can have a time-based trigger spawned by cron, then also have whatever other tools trigger a rebuild based on whatever criteria
18:59 chris       http://www.airnewzealand.com/airfares-and-deals
18:59 chris       quick!!
19:00 slef        Dan Bernstein's tools generally should be avoided IMO. qmail is a pain that shouldn't be repeated.
19:00 slef        chris: too late, already booked
19:00 slef        looked at internal flight prices today.  Ouch.
19:00 wizzyrea    aww, that's a good deal. Oh well
19:00 * wizzyrea  is totally booked for the trip, save the car, which may be optional anyway
19:00 slef        whose dollars are they in?
19:00 chris       gotta be us
19:02 chris       the problem i can see with the daemontools is it has the overhead of starting perl, making db connection, etc each time, which is a significant performance hit
19:02 slef        Not that much better for UK than I got, actually. :-)
19:03 chris       sweet slef :)
19:03 chris       flights from where?
19:03 slef        chris: speaking of bookings, Oct 28 seems to be double-booked on www.kohacon10.org.nz
19:03 cfouts      chris: that hasn't been my experience. that part is actually pretty low overhead, particularly when a human is staring at a web browser waiting for it to happen.
19:03 slef        chris: London-Auckland
19:04 chris       slef: i meant the internal ones :)
19:04 slef        chris: oic. Wellington - something on the south island
19:04 slef        biab, sorry, dinner calls
19:04 chris       cfouts: its gotta be higher overhead than a long running process :)
19:04 chris       slef: anywhere except christchurch will be expensive
19:05 chris       i do quite like the inotify idea tho
19:05 jcamins     chris: Argh! And I had finally made peace with not going!
19:05 chris       lol
19:05 wizzyrea    it's not too late!
19:05 chris       i do what i can!
19:06 chris       jcamins: http://thelibrary.co.nz/ <-- is one of our sponsors now
19:07 chris       k bbiab
19:08 cfouts      slef: I used to service 40k customer email boxes with qmail. it worked quite nicely, actually.
19:10 chris       cfouts: im guessing slef was talking about licensing
19:10 cfouts      chris: sure, but it's a matter of degree. I'm sure there's *some* degree of overhead saved, but when you're comparing the expense of that to writing and maintaining yet-another-daemon-which-listens-to-remote-commands, I'm not sure how well it measures
19:10 jcamins     ::sigh:: I really still can't afford it.
19:10 jcamins     Well, I'll think about it wistfully for a few days.
19:11 wizzyrea    jcamins: the exchange rate is pretty good atm >.>
19:13 jcamins     Figures that my conference in LA is Nov. 18-21.
19:27 briceSanc   i've a problem, i want to index 100K auths in zebra, but i have the error :Adjust the limits in your zebra.cfg
19:28 briceSanc   i don't find the zebra.cfg file but i found zebra-authorities.cfg
19:28 jcamins     Yes, that's the file you need to edit.
19:29 jcamins     change where it says :4G to :16G
19:29 wizzyrea    ^^
19:29 wizzyrea    what he said
19:29 jcamins     (it's at the end of two lines, I don't remember which two)
19:29 briceSanc   i already change 4G to 7G
19:29 jcamins     Okay, change 7G to 16G
19:29 briceSanc   ok
19:29 jcamins     Or 20G.
19:29 briceSanc   i try
19:30 wizzyrea    I have 340k, and I use 16g
19:30 wizzyrea    (for my test server)
19:30 jcamins     It must be nice, to be at a library which has subscriptions to authority data.
19:32 briceSanc   Do i need to change memMax:50M ?
19:32 jcamins     wizzyrea: ?
19:32 jcamins     I don't think we changed that.
19:32 wizzyrea    I don't believe I had to change mine
19:32 * wizzyrea  goes to look
19:32 jcamins     On the other hand, if you have lots of memory on your server, what's the disadvantage?
19:33 wizzyrea    no, I didn't change mine, it's still 50M
19:33 briceSanc   ok
19:33 briceSanc   and i don't change shadow:1G ?
19:33 jcamins     http://www.indexdata.com/zebra/doc/zebra-cfg.html
19:33 jcamins     Change that to the same as the other one.
19:33 jcamins     At least, that's what we did.
19:34 jcamins     I guess I don't know if it's actually necessary.
19:35 briceSanc   ok
19:35 briceSanc   i try this
19:35 briceSanc   thanks for your answers
19:35 briceSanc   see u later!
19:36 jcamins     briceSanc: it looks like indexing will go faster if you increase memMax.
19:36 jcamins     wizzyrea: ^^
19:37 wizzyrea    things normally go better with more memory, just in general
19:37 wizzyrea    but duly noted
19:37 briceSanc   ok
19:37 briceSanc   thanks
19:38 briceSanc   bye (i need to go)
19:38 wizzyrea    bye
19:47 chris       You do need to change the shadow
19:47 chris       Just for the record
19:49 chris       It was probably that causing the error
19:49 chris       Cos 7g was probably enough
19:50 chris       We build the shadow first then replace the live with it
19:50 chris       So if the index fails live still works
19:50 chris       So it was most likely barfing on that
19:50 wizzyrea    chris always a fount of information
19:51 chris       Usually its wrong
19:51 chris       :)
19:51 wizzyrea    pft
19:53 wajasu      from a koha clone, how does one make a release tar  (just tar cvf koha_ver.tar kohaclone/*)  ?
19:54 chris       Nope
19:54 wajasu      my distributions package building script works from a tar (i.e the beta's) and I want to be able to test/install easily.
19:54 chris       there's a script that does it
19:55 chris       When I get to work ill find it
19:55 chris       (On the bus)
19:55 wajasu      i see a line in Makefile.PL  Makefile.PL:    make manifest tardist
19:55 chris       Yeah that's it
19:56 wajasu      perl Makefile.PL manifest tardist   then?
19:56 wajasu      that starts an interactive install [single/dev]
19:57 wajasu      my other option is to clone the lxc container i'm running in, and just do a dev install.
19:58 wizzyrea    is there a proper bug for the (ahem) idiotic add items table?
19:58 wizzyrea    because in my current state, typing "idiotic add items table" doesn't bring back any bugs :P
19:59 chris       run the makefile.pl
19:59 wizzyrea    where idiotic = shows totally pointless marc fields first
19:59 chris       And instead of make install
19:59 wizzyrea    and puts the useful information by the scroll
19:59 chris       make manifest tardist
20:01 sekjal      I'd love to run the command "make manifest TARDIS", and have it work
20:01 chris       Change the framework wiz?
20:01 wizzyrea    hehehehehe sekjal
20:01 * wizzyrea  hears the tardis sound emanating from her computer
20:01 wizzyrea    omg sekjal... what did you DO
20:01 wizzyrea    j/k
20:03 sekjal      it's okay, I just opened the Eye of Harmony
20:03 sekjal      harmony's a good thing, right?
20:04 wajasu      that way I can confirm the latest code has a bug.  (i.e. I'm running 3wks old beta, and XSLT opacdetails doesn't show Series: )  I want to confirm.
20:06 wajasu      nice to see that dom is the default now instead of grs1
20:07 chris       Ur life will be much easier and will make sending patches easier if you run a testing/dev install from a git clone (dev not standard)
20:07 chris       And do packages for production
20:09 wajasu      you are right.  I'll do a dev install.  then just do git pull to update.
20:09 chris       *nod*
20:11 * chris     is lazy
20:14 brendan     @wunder 93117
20:14 munin       brendan: The current temperature in Northwest Goleta, Goleta, California is 24.9�C (1:21 PM PDT on August 24, 2010). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 51%. Dew Point: 14.0�C. Pressure: 29.81 in 1009.4 hPa (Falling).
20:14 chris       @wunder wellington,nz
20:14 munin       chris: The current temperature in Wellington, New Zealand is 6.0�C (8:00 AM NZST on August 25, 2010). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 87%. Dew Point: 4.0�C. Windchill: 4.0�C. Pressure: 30.01 in 1016 hPa (Steady).
20:16 chris       Ok my stop, back after a coffee
20:16 wizzyrea    it's perfect here today
20:16 wizzyrea    @wunder lawrence, ks
20:16 munin       wizzyrea: The current temperature in Channel 6 Downtown, Lawrence, Kansas is 25.4�C (3:27 PM CDT on August 24, 2010). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 59%. Dew Point: 17.0�C. Pressure: 30.08 in 1018.5 hPa (Steady).
20:17 wizzyrea    almost as perfect as california.
20:19 jcamins     @wunder 11105
20:19 munin       jcamins: The current temperature in Astoria, Astoria, New York is 21.3�C (4:25 PM EDT on August 24, 2010). Conditions: Overcast. Humidity: 72%. Dew Point: 16.0�C. Pressure: 29.95 in 1014.1 hPa (Steady).
20:19 richard     hi
20:19 jcamins     Overcast? That's it. Huh. I guess it's nicer out than it looks.
20:27 jcamins     Has the location in item listings always linked back to the library's website?
20:27 jcamins     (on the OPAC)
20:34 chris       back
20:39 jcamins     And it is my cue to leave.
20:39 jcamins     Have a good night, #koha
20:57 chris       hey look its backwards kristina :)
21:08 jo          just been interviewed for NZ herald about koha
21:08 chris       oh yeah?
21:08 brendan     hey jo - that's cool
21:08 chris       cool
21:08 jo          and been accused of being communist!
21:08 chris       by the reporter?
21:09 jo          for asking how can we as a country NOT use open source - like the albany high open source model for our schools
21:09 jo          and koha in our public libraries
21:09 brendan     heh - oh boy
21:10 chris       did you say, so plumbers are communists? waiters? barstaff?
21:10 jo          i think he was laughing
21:10 chris       free software is a service industry, nothing communist about it, is my standard response
21:10 jo          bloody hope he was
21:11 anitsirk    chris: yes. it is. :-) quite easy to remember
21:11 jo          anyways ....
21:11 chris       we'll see :)
21:11 jo          yep.
21:11 chris       jo: when did we go live .. may ?
21:11 jo          at least it will get koha on the national pages
21:12 jo          27 may we did the deed
21:12 chris       ta
21:12 jo          went live on 28
21:14 chris       hey russ
21:14 chris       jo: did they say when it might be published?
21:16 chobbs      Tried this question yesterday, didn't get an answer before I needed to log off, so I'll try again: The docs say "TIP: Marking an item Lost via the edit item page will automatically put a fine on the patron's record for the replacement cost of the item". That's not happening on our system (3.00.05). Any ideas?
21:18 chris       chobbs: its been fixed for 3.2.0
21:18 chobbs      Sweet :-)
21:20 chobbs      How painful an upgrade will it be? We've done our conversio this summer, and I'm doing training on Thursday for the librarians in our system. I'd almost rather pull the trigger now than have to re-train on anything in a few weeks...
21:20 * chobbs    understands that 3.2.0 is basically done, short of an acquisitions problem?
21:23 chris       thats right
21:29 chris       id wait for the rc i think
21:29 chobbs      Hmm. This is where running vmware comes in handy. Tonight I'll snapshot my koha box, install the latest, and see what it's like, then revert to snapshot if I need to.
21:29 chobbs      Any idea on rc release date?
21:47 jo          Chris:no they didn't. they interviewed Rachel as well. she might know
22:29 jo          Question: what 'events' trigger the last seen date to update? Presume it is check in?, check out?, edit item? and therefore batch moficication of items?
22:30 jo          does anyone know - virtual chocolate fish to the people with answers :)
22:36 chobbs      jo: you can add import to the list - just converted our library and last seen for everything was set to the import date :-)
22:38 jo          cool - thanks Chobbs. (flings a chocolate fish across the etherspace)
22:39 chobbs      Man, summer finally arrived in northern California...
22:39 chobbs      @wunder 94568
22:39 munin       chobbs: The current temperature in Country Club Elementary School, San Ramon, California is 41.2�C (3:49 PM PDT on August 24, 2010). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 16%. Dew Point: 10.0�C. Pressure: 29.72 in 1006.3 hPa (Falling).  Heat advisory in effect until 8 PM PDT Wednesday... 
22:40 robin       they should get some aircon for that school
22:41 jo          41 degrees ... good lord thats hot
22:41 brendan     wow
22:41 brendan     @wunder 93117
22:41 munin       brendan: The current temperature in Northwest Goleta, Goleta, California is 23.9�C (3:51 PM PDT on August 24, 2010). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 54%. Dew Point: 14.0�C. Pressure: 29.79 in 1008.7 hPa (Falling).
22:41 robin       more pleasant:
22:41 robin       @wunder wellington, nz
22:41 chobbs      much!
22:41 munin       robin: The current temperature in Wellington, New Zealand is 8.0�C (10:00 AM NZST on August 25, 2010). Conditions: Partly Cloudy. Humidity: 87%. Dew Point: 6.0�C. Windchill: 6.0�C. Pressure: 30.01 in 1016 hPa (Steady).
22:42 jo          @wunder @levin, nz
22:42 chobbs      high is supposed to drop 35 deg F over the next 4 days though...
22:42 munin       jo: Error: No such location could be found.
22:42 robin       jo: too many @'s
22:42 jo          so, wunder, are you saying Levin doesn't exist lol
22:42 robin       @wunder levin, nz
22:42 munin       robin: The current temperature in LEVIN, Levin, New Zealand is 13.5�C (10:52 AM NZST on August 25, 2010). Conditions: Partly Cloudy. Humidity: 74%. Dew Point: 9.0�C. Pressure: 29.99 in 1015.5 hPa (Steady).
22:43 jo          tahnsk robin