Time  Nick            Message
00:04 richard         bob are you about?
00:04 richard         ack, wrong #
00:05 chris_n         gmcharlt++
00:09 moodaepo        @wunder 56001
00:09 munin           moodaepo: The current temperature in South on Monks, Mankato, Minnesota is -12.7�C (6:05 PM CST on February 02, 2010). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 84%. Dew Point: -14.0�C. Windchill: -18.0�C. Pressure: 30.12 in 1019.9 hPa (Rising).
00:11 brendan         @wunder 93117
00:11 munin           brendan: The current temperature in Northwest Goleta, Goleta, California is 14.8�C (4:07 PM PST on February 02, 2010). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 72%. Dew Point: 10.0�C. Pressure: 29.79 in 1008.7 hPa (Steady).
00:11 nod             http://lwn.net/Articles/370157/
00:15 chris_n         nice website!
00:15 chris_n         wizzyrea++
00:16 joetho          yeah, she'll probably lock us out in a few months.
00:16 joetho          @karma wizzyrea
00:16 munin           joetho: Karma for "wizzyrea" has been increased 53 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 53.
00:41 chris_n         wb jdavidb
00:41 jdavidb         ty, chris_n.
00:47 pianohackr|work apt-get -b source needs a "I am not a paranoid basement-dweller, please disable the 30 minute long test suite" flag
00:52 chris           back
00:52 chris           gmcharlt: yes should be fine
00:52 gmcharlt        cool, 'cause I did it half an hour ago ;)
00:53 chris           hehe
00:53 chris           sweet
00:56 CGI155          hello
00:56 mao             how are you
01:04 chris_n         lol pianohackr|work
01:04 chris_n         apt-get --install_NOW! -b source
01:05 jdavidb         apt-get --I_know_what_Im_doing_here -b source
01:06 chris           http://koha-community.org/support/paid-support/
01:06 chris           katipo are back !!
01:07 pianohackr|work All I really want is the latest graphviz with collision avoidance on edges
01:07 pianohackr|work Why in god's name am I building ocaml from source?
01:07 slef            needs updates... ideally being a click-sortable table like I think thd suggested but I don't know any plugin for that OTTOMH
01:08 richard         yay
01:08 richard         thanks chris
01:08 slef            wizzyrea: can you update Turo Technology LLP to software.coop please?  We completed that transition a while ago.
01:08 chris           i can
01:08 chris           email me whatever text you want and ill change it right now
01:08 pianohackr|work an easy-to-see field like "Geographical Area" would be nice
01:08 slef            oh, can we have logins again?
01:08 chris           we sure can
01:08 chris           you'll need to ask wizzy for that
01:08 chris           but i can make changes in the meantime
01:08 chris           is that the only bit you want changed?
01:08 slef            chris@bigballofwax?
01:09 chris           yessir
01:21 braedon         chris: Steven will write something up for the support page, and get back to you, thanks.
01:22 chris           cool
01:23 slef            http://www.kryogenix.org/code/browser/sorttable/
01:25 slef            http://tobias.baethge.com/wordpress-plugins/wp-table-reloaded-english/ is a more involved method
01:26 slef            main thing we'd need to decide is what columns to list
01:27 chris           *nod*
01:28 chris           way i figure it, pure alphabetical is 100 times better than what we used to have, and we can just keep improving it
01:28 chris           at least i can add kyle and zeno now
01:29 slef            come near the end of the alphabet and see if you still agree ;-)
01:29 slef            but the previous list discussion was right: sortable is The Right Way
01:29 * gmcharlt      awaits the Aaaardvark Koha Consultancy
01:30 slef            gmcharlt: there used to be a guy in the phone book where I grew up called "Zzitz, Zeke Z"
01:30 * chilts        creates A1 Koha Consulting Limites :)
01:30 chilts          Limited even :D
01:30 gmcharlt        he or his parents didn't know when to stop, evidently ;)
01:30 * slef          starts !!!Koha!!! Co
01:31 chilts          heh
01:33 slef            ok, I'm gone. bbl
01:40 Jo              can anyone suggest a good online set of library icons (a full set for all sorts of different media types etc)
01:43 braedon         hmm, any ideas what could cause the MARC record import tool to duplicate some biblios on import? the staged record manager shows the correct number of biblios, but once imported there are 513 extra biblios in the database. The duplicates seem to have no items attached.
01:52 gmcharlt        3.2 alpha tagged
01:53 chris           w00t
01:55 Jo              for the non-geeks among us, Galen please what does alpha tagged mean?
01:56 gmcharlt        Jo: it basically means that I've drawn a line in the sand - i.e., this point is 3.2 alpha
01:56 Jo              woo hoo!
01:56 Jo              go you
01:56 joetho          clap clap clap clap clap clap!
01:57 Jo              this is quite a big step
01:57 brendan         w00t
01:58 Jo              I'll share a nice story with you: just heard of a computer guy in Palmerston who volantarily installed Koha for a school, and the local librarisn are cataloguing the schools library - after hours as volunteers :)
01:58 chilts          gmcharlt++
01:58 Jo              gmcharlt+++
02:01 Jo              That paid support is so pretty
02:03 Jo              would be cool to be able to view the paid support providers on a googlemap - so geographically
02:05 chris_n         gmcharlt++
02:15 chris           http://stats.workbuffer.org/koha-combined-history/tags.html
02:15 chris           nice range of ppl contributed to 3.2
02:17 Jo              Oh look at that ... that is such a community effort!
02:17 wizzyrea_       :)
02:18 wizzyrea_       back looking at the site if you have more you want to do
02:18 Jo              would you like to correct a date?
02:18 wizzyrea_       though I'd be just as happy playing video games >.>
02:18 wizzyrea_       sure
02:18 wizzyrea_       url?
02:19 Jo              http://koha-community.org/ - the date for the general koha meeting says 2009 - should be 2010
02:19 wizzyrea_       O naught gmcharlt!
02:19 wizzyrea_       naughty~
02:19 wizzyrea_       done :)
02:19 Jo              I am amazed at how quickly you guys have got this thing up and running and gorgeous :)
02:20 gmcharlt        wizzyrea: 9 February 20010 ? are you planning to make me immortal for that?
02:20 wizzyrea_       HA
02:20 wizzyrea_       naughty wizzy!
02:20 Jo              20010 is not actually much of an improvement my ove :)
02:20 gmcharlt        (not that I would complain if you could do it! :) )
02:20 wizzyrea_       there, this time with feeling
02:21 Jo              the other thing was for the staff demop I needed a login and password
02:21 wizzyrea_       Oh, true. I will add that info
02:21 Jo              cool
02:22 Jo              and my only other comment was to include kohacon 2010 somewher .. maybe under events?
02:23 Jo              I did try and register but have not recieved an email. I figured it might not be active yet?
02:24 wizzyrea_       well, there are no SPF records for koha-community.org, so it likely got nuked as spam :(
02:25 wizzyrea_       yes, I was going to add that as well. Kinda hoping chris would write the article ;) but I know he's super busy
02:25 wizzyrea_       mine took a good 10-ish minutes to come through when I was testing
02:26 Jo              can't you just steal his work while hes not looking?
02:27 wizzyrea_       HEE. I like how you think
02:28 wizzyrea_       <lazy> can somebody hit me with the kohacon10 url?</lazy
02:28 wizzyrea_       >
02:28 chris           http://kohacon.appspot.com/
02:30 wizzyrea_       ty kindly
02:30 chris_n         fwiw, my registration email got nuked by gmail anti-spam
02:31 chris           yeah check the spam folder
02:33 Jo              ok
02:33 wizzyrea_       yea, not surprising :(
02:33 wizzyrea_       the controls on the DNS for domainz are kind of sparse
02:34 wizzyrea_       and I hesitate to host the DNS @ NEKLS since we'll be changing our ISP in the next few months
02:34 wizzyrea_       and not sure how slaving is going to work :/
02:34 wizzyrea_       with the new ISP
02:34 wizzyrea_       so if someone wants to volunteer to host the DNS, that would be cool
02:35 wizzyrea_       helpful for me, def, b/c then we could have wildcards and subdomain blogs
02:35 wizzyrea_       since koha-community.org is running wpmu
02:36 chris           ah jo went with domainz not freeparking?
02:38 wizzyrea_       ya
02:39 Jo              yep
02:40 Jo              we had an account with them already and didn'twant stuff all over the place
02:42 chris           fair enough
02:44 wizzyrea_       maybe the people who host the dns for kete.co.nz would be willing to host koha-community.org DNS as well?
02:44 wizzyrea_       says she who is totally ignorant of anything and everything surrounding kete and/or who does what in NZ
02:44 wizzyrea_       :P
02:45 wizzyrea_       gmcharlt love that you put the release notes on the site
02:45 wizzyrea_       what a relief to finally have a place to put that stuff, eh
02:45 gmcharlt        wizzyrea_: Kete, HLT, Kete, HLT - why do I think there's a connection :P
02:45 chris           it feels like 2004 again
02:46 wizzyrea_       i hope that's a good thing :P
02:46 chris           yep
02:46 wizzyrea_       I think we should be sure to tag/categorize as granularly as possible
02:46 wizzyrea_       since we can
02:47 chris           yup
02:51 Jo              I don't understand the question but I don't see why not
02:51 Jo              Chris?
02:52 chris           its not me
02:52 Jo              dns stuff - who would know?
02:52 Jo              simon?
02:52 chris           yeah katipo host the dns for kete.net.nz
02:52 Jo              I am blissfully unaware of the detail of loads of stuff i am involved in :)
02:52 Jo              Richard: are you about still?
02:53 richard         hi jo
02:53 Jo              can you read back a second or 2 and asnwer the question about hosting the dns
02:53 Jo              can we do it?
02:53 Jo              (we as in you :)
02:54 wizzyrea_       no particular epic hurry, fwiw. It's working in the capacity we need it to now. :)
02:55 richard         i don't see why not. where is the record now?
02:56 wizzyrea_       it's in the domainz default config
02:56 IrmaCalyx       G'day all
02:56 wizzyrea_       just doing forwarding
02:56 IrmaCalyx       what an exciting day today !!!
02:57 IrmaCalyx       So much good news
02:57 Jo              hi Irma
02:57 IrmaCalyx       hi Jo  terrific progress today
02:59 IrmaCalyx       i sent a tweet with new website
02:59 wizzyrea_       I'm actually quite pleased with how it is turning out.
03:00 chris           yeah its looking good
03:00 IrmaCalyx       I like to ask about the possibility to include in 3.2 Australian English spelling
03:00 IrmaCalyx       is there time for that?
03:00 chris           if you are fast
03:00 chris           you can base it on either the NZ or the GB one
03:00 IrmaCalyx       catalogue is one term
03:00 chris           yeah thats all fixed in the NZ and GB ones
03:01 IrmaCalyx       P.O. Box?
03:01 chris           that too
03:01 chris           http://translate.koha.org/projects/opac3_1/
03:02 IrmaCalyx       ok...worrying is overrated...I withdraw my question
03:05 gmcharlt        chris: any word on the tlhIngan Hol translation?
03:06 chris           nengards friend never got back to her about it :)
03:06 gmcharlt        drat
03:10 IrmaCalyx       tlhIngan Hol?
03:10 chris           klingon IrmaCalyx
03:10 wizzyrea_       best time conversion website?
03:11 chris           we dont restrict koha to this planet, or even to reality ;-)
03:11 wizzyrea_       hahahaha
03:11 gmcharlt        wizzyrea: wolfram-alpha
03:11 chris           wolfram alpha does a decent job
03:11 gmcharlt        btw, note that I set the time zone for the events calendar to London
03:11 wizzyrea_       fine by me
03:11 gmcharlt        closest to UTC+0 that the events widget offers
03:11 chris           close enough
03:11 chris           yeah
03:12 wizzyrea_       it sure is pretty
03:12 IrmaCalyx       re KohaCon ...I have started writing an invitation and hope to be able to have it translated in all Koha's languages
03:12 wizzyrea_       I can't stop admiring it >.>
03:12 chris           sweet IrmaCalyx
03:12 chris           Jo: you about?
03:13 IrmaCalyx       <wizzyrea_> me too :-)
03:13 chris           heya pianohacker
03:13 pianohacker     hi, chris
03:13 IrmaCalyx       must go back and tackle some of my tasks - cheers.
03:13 pianohacker     I had a nitpick question: does the test suite requirement for alpha->beta include the db-dependent suite?
03:14 pianohacker     cya, IrmaCalyx
03:14 IrmaCalyx       cia all
03:14 * chris         defers to gmcharlt
03:14 pianohacker     Cool
03:14 gmcharlt        pianohacker: the portions that are applicable, yes - if parts are hopelessly out of date, it would be OK to remove them
03:14 pianohacker     Good to know
03:15 pianohacker     Once I get the sysprefs editor in more reasonable shape, might poke at that
03:15 gmcharlt        but normally, of course, a failing DB-depdent test *does* indicate that something had changed, after all ;)
03:17 chris           chris_n: you about?
03:18 chris_n         here
03:18 chris           http://stats.workbuffer.org/koha-combined-history/authors.html#author_of_year
03:18 chris           check it out :)
03:18 chris_n         wow
03:19 gmcharlt        chris_n++
03:19 * chris_n       will have a hard run to hold the pole position
03:19 gmcharlt        now you get to continue your dominating position by fixing all of the blockers for 3.2 ;)
03:19 chris           hehe
03:20 * chris_n       crawls under the table
03:20 pianohacker     chris_n: Feel like updating the translation system to include .pref files?
03:20 chris_n         actually he climbs on top of the table and enjoys his 30 seconds of glory :-)
03:20 pianohacker     I've only been avoiding it for nine months now
03:21 chris_n         pianohacker: I think I'm free between 0100 and 0500 each day....
03:21 pianohacker     Hahahaha, know that feeling
03:25 joetho          tlhIngan Hol ??
03:25 chris           type that in google joetho
03:25 joetho          you weren't kidding either, were you?
03:25 chris           hell no
03:25 joetho          actually lolling here
03:25 chris           swedish chef comes after that
03:25 chris           :)
03:26 chris           i wonder what a king response is?
03:26 chris           need help waiting for king response to my message posted yesterday
03:26 pianohacker     We need a bot that we can poke and will spit out a random username that should respond to a mailing list post nobody's touched
03:26 chris           :)
03:27 joetho          well *I* need a bot to do that
03:27 chris           it can be
03:27 chris           king_response_bot
03:27 wizzyrea_       king probably = kind
03:27 wizzyrea_       kind response
03:27 wizzyrea_       but that's way not as fun
03:27 chris           you are ruining my nonsense
03:28 chris           :)
03:28 wizzyrea_       PBBT
03:31 chris_n         wb brendan
03:31 brendan         heya chris_n
03:32 chris_n         cool, lots of fresh news on the new website
03:33 chris_n         stock demos++
03:34 chris           :)
03:34 * chris_n       feels like a kid in a candy shop ;)
03:35 wizzyrea_       ^.^ i'm glad you like it
03:36 pianohacker     Definitely, I like the feel of this a lot better
03:36 pianohacker     Feels more like a community project
03:38 brendan         gmcharlt are you going to KohaCon10
03:38 gmcharlt        yes
03:38 chris           w00t
03:38 wizzyrea_       if he doesn't go I'll go down to florida and smuggle him in my suitcase
03:39 * chris_n       hits the sack
03:39 chris_n         g'night
03:39 brendan         great
03:39 chris           night
03:39 wizzyrea_       gnite
03:39 gmcharlt        wizzyrea: heh - will no doubt feel that way anyway at the end of the flight
03:39 brendan         night
03:39 gmcharlt        g'night, chris_n
03:40 Amit            hi brendan, chris, chris_n2
03:40 Amit            morning #koha
03:40 brendan         hi amit
03:40 Jo              Chris: here now
03:41 chris           whatcha reckon, would you be up for asking penny if she wants to do our keynote/opening speech?
03:42 Jo              yes indeed. absolutely :)
03:42 Jo              wizzyrea: you still about
03:44 Jo              nw
03:45 wizzyrea_       i am
03:45 wizzyrea_       sup?
03:47 Jo              Its ok - I found what I was looking for (you had it covered). Do you think you might try for some sleep today at all?
03:47 wizzyrea_       :) yea, it's only almost 10pm here
03:47 pianohacker     It's only 9:45 PM there, perfectly reasonable time of day
03:48 Jo              (I was looking for irc under community resources but found it under free support ... of course :)
03:48 Jo              oh thats alright then :)
03:48 wizzyrea_       early for me (though I'm rarely online for koha now. Usually smashing digital avatars with a virtual hammer)
03:48 chris           by 10pm im like this http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=3881405&id=507121749
03:48 wizzyrea_       hehe that's cute
03:49 pianohacker     A baby photo you can show atu 15 years from now without a "DaaaAAAAaaAd"
03:49 Jo              oh thats funny - wa sthat new years eve?
03:49 chris           its was about 2 days ago
03:50 chris           http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=3881399&id=507121749
03:50 chris           (laurel has been putting photos up)
03:50 Jo              I feel a blog post coming on about today; its been an extraordinary thing to watch
03:50 Jo              koha community in action - makes me feel all gooey inside
03:50 Amit            heya pianohacker, Ropuch, Jo
03:50 Jo              hiya Amit
03:51 brendan         that's a cute kid there chris
03:51 Jo              he makes beautiful babies
03:51 Jo              although I'm sure Laurel's good looks have a lot to do with it to?
03:51 chris           id say that was 97% of it
03:52 Jo              I'm pretty sutre that hairy fellow is actually Simon - not Rachel :)
03:52 pianohacker     hi, Amit, Jo, brendan
03:52 chris           yeah simon is too cool for facebook :)
03:52 chris           well actually to privacy savvy probably :)
03:52 Jo              thought it was a privacy thin g ..
03:53 si              too old and crust for this web 2.0 malarky
03:53 si              crusty, even
03:53 chris           heh
03:53 wizzyrea_       malarky!
03:53 wizzyrea_       can I get a humbug?
03:54 chris           si: http://photos.bigballofwax.co.nz/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=72265
03:54 si              although I did enjoy the sleeptalkinman blog somebody directed me at the other day
03:54 chris           thats the photo
03:54 si              http://sleeptalkinman.blogspot.com/
03:54 si              that's very modern
03:54 gmcharlt        bah! no humbug for you! ;)
03:54 si              hey
03:55 * si            guesses that Chris and Si putting the oar into LCA
03:55 si              with me maintaining my anonymity, as per usual
03:56 chris           its actually charlotte and atarau having a yell at each other ;)
03:57 si              heh, could be
03:57 si              "my dad could take your dad"
03:59 chris           hehe
04:00 wizzyrea_       those are way cute children you guys got there
04:00 russ
04:01 si              mines cute
04:01 si              chris's is as ugly as sin
04:01 chris           hehe
04:01 russ            lol
04:01 chris           you should russ's
04:01 chris           see even
04:01 richard         lol
04:01 pianohacker     bbl eggercise
04:02 si              did I see russ's name on the kohacon volunteers list
04:03 si              just like old times
04:03 russ            aye
04:03 chris           yep, he's been roped back in
04:03 si              good man
04:04 Jo              Waves at Si
04:05 si              hola jo
04:05 si              you're a good man too
04:05 si              :-)
04:06 gmcharlt        my god, it's full of NZers! :)
04:06 braedon         surprisingly... :P
04:07 Jo              me: I'm a good Man? Wow - thank you Si. I'm taking it as high praise :)
04:07 Jo              waves at Russ to :)
04:07 chris           ok hometime
04:08 * russ          waves as he heads out the door
04:08 Jo              see you Chris
04:08 Jo              sterling work today folks
04:24 wizzyrea_       for the record: text-transform: uppercase is my mortal enemy. I hate it with the heat of a million suns.
04:24 wizzyrea_       that is all.
04:37 wizzyrea_       ok, going to whack virtual avatars with digital hammers. ttyl :)
05:02 Jo              Good night all. Off home to thebambini
06:02 indradg
06:03 indradg         wizzyrea: did the DNS hosting get sorted out?
06:07 Amit            heya indradg
06:44 Amit            heya nicomo
06:45 nicomo          hi Amit
07:04 pianohacker     good night, all
07:04 Ropuch          Morning #koha
08:17 chris           evening
08:21 kf              good morning :)
08:26 chris           hiya kf
08:27 chris           i had a question did you want BSZ listed here http://koha-community.org/support/paid-support/
08:28 kf              hi chris
08:29 kf              not sure chris - our situation is a bit different from the other companies
08:29 kf              I will have to discuss it
08:29 chris           no problem
08:29 chris           just let me know anytinme
08:29 kf              of couse, thank you for thinking about us
08:30 chris           @later tell magnus do you want libriotech listed, email me what you want and ill put it up
08:30 munin           chris: The operation succeeded.
08:30 kf              koha-community++
08:30 kf              the new site looks great today
08:32 Amit            heya Kf
08:33 kf              hi Amit
08:56 kf              chris: still aroundß
08:56 kf              ?
08:57 chris           sure am
09:56 magnus          chris: thanks, i'll email you when i have figured out the text... ;-)
09:56 chris           cool
10:23 kf              chris ?
11:03 gmcharlt        good morning
11:12 kf              good morning gmcharlt
11:19 magnus          good morning gmcharlt
11:19 magnus          and congrats on the alpha ;-)
12:05 gmcharlt        hdl_laptop: about?
13:21 chris_n         g'morning
13:22 jwagner         *grumble* why does morning has to come so EARLY in the day???
13:22 jwagner         (And I'm working from home -- got to sleep in a bit....)
13:22 jwagner         But good morning anyway.
13:23 gmcharlt        good morning
13:23 imp             moin :)
13:24 * jwagner       wanders off to get some caffeine
13:24 * chris_n       sees his bip proxy has finally gotten up for the day
13:25 owen            Hi all
13:25 chris_n         heya owen
13:27 owen            I hearby nominate wizzyrea to take over Koha.org when it returns to the community's hands. koha-community.org looks fantastic.
13:27 owen            wizzyrea++
13:28 owen            It's a perfect WordPress theme for us
13:28 Colin           Any documentation on how budgets are supposed to work in 3.2? Seem unable to commit against them
13:29 owen            hdl_laptop or paul_p? Could we get a quick lesson on budgets?
13:36 magnus          jwagner: move to europe, then you could have your morning in the middle of the day :-)
13:38 Ropuch          hehe
13:39 jwagner         magnus, but then my mornings would come in the middle of the night!
13:40 magnus          jwagner: nah, it's 2 pm here now - perfect time for a morning if you ask me
13:42 jwagner         I'm sure there's a good argument against that logic.  I'll find it when I wake up :-)
13:45 magnus          ;-)
13:46 nengard         owen - it is perfect - so perfect I chose it for my book (http://opensource.web2learning.net) and now I have to change it :(
13:49 nahuel          owen, !
13:49 nahuel          hi
13:49 nahuel          :)
13:49 owen            Hi nahuel
13:49 nahuel          did you see your last patch on admin/marc_subfield_structure.pl on 3.0.x ?
13:49 nahuel          and my previous patch
13:50 chris_n         gmcharlt: patch resubmitted for opac-reserve.pl
13:50 nengard         Colin - I'm still waiting for some help on that from BibLibre - the budgets documentation :(
13:50 owen            nahuel: ?
13:50 nahuel          héhé
13:50 nahuel          I made a patch :
13:51 nahuel          -            -name     => "mandatory",
13:51 nahuel          +            -name     => "mandatory$i",
13:51 nahuel          and you patched the file as :
13:51 nahuel          -            -name     => "mandatory$i",
13:51 nahuel          +            -name     => "mandatory",
13:51 nahuel          so it doesn't work anymore
13:51 owen            nahuel: I did?
13:52 nahuel          It seem you did :)
13:52 * owen          wonders if he has been sleep-patching
13:52 chris_n         lol :-)
13:52 nahuel          héhé
13:54 owen            I don't have any recollection of making that change!
13:54 owen            You have my apologies for breaking something
13:55 jdavidb         hdl_laptop: ping?
13:56 hdl_laptop      jdavidb: yes
13:57 kf              hdl_laptop: thx for your email, will try at the weekend (or today after dentist...)
13:57 jdavidb         This icu thing is giving me issues;  When I reindexed, I got a bunch of "unknown element transliterate" errors.  Just for kicks, I removed the transliterate elements from the icu.xml file, leaving just the transforms, and it finished, but nothing whatever is searchable.
13:57 jdavidb         I suspect I missed something *real* obvious.
14:00 jdavidb         Ever seen that happen before?
14:00 gmcharlt        chris_n: pushed
14:01 chris_n         gmcharlt: one other question
14:01 chris_n         this commit: http://git.koha.org/cgi-bin/gitweb.cgi?p=Koha;a=commit;h=6bbb5a0889648f07f87258a9fd8dac785831af66
14:01 chris_n         only has part of the patch I submitted
14:01 hdl_laptop      never.
14:02 chris_n         gmcharlt: see http://www.mail-archive.com/koha-patches@lists.koha.org/msg04094.html
14:02 jdavidb         Dern.  The whole thing seems like such a good idea, if I could just make it work!
14:02 hdl_laptop      jdavidb: have you cheched the encoding of your icu chain file ?
14:02 hdl_laptop      It truly IS.
14:04 jdavidb         With the transliterate elements removed, it doesn't have anything controversial in it.  I suspect that the encoding was screwy on some of the transliterate rules, which might have caused the error.  But with them gone...is all easy ascii chars.
14:04 gmcharlt        chris_n: result of a merge of other work on updatedatabase.pl, I expect - 068 has been an utter mare's nest for some reason
14:05 chris_n         so shall I reformat and resubmit?
14:05 chris_n         the syntax is incorrect
14:05 gmcharlt        yes, but please check with hdl_laptop and Colin - we need to stop patch-fighting on that update
14:05 chris_n         will do
14:06 hdl_laptop      chris_n: hands off for me
14:06 jdavidb         the file sizes in zebradb/biblios/register are large, which makes me think it put *something* in there, but just can't get it back out again.
14:07 chris_n         Colin: how about you?
14:08 hdl_laptop      jdavidb: what does zebraidx tells you ?
14:09 Colin           chris_n: Just took a look.. I think some of the add columns are in other upgrades. I'm sure we took some out because it caused a failure and
14:09 jdavidb         When it's doing the reindexing?  Nothing unusual there; looks like any other indexing I've done.
14:09 Colin           the column that should be added wasn't
14:11 hdl_laptop      mmm... maybe you have not reset your base between no icu and use of icu...
14:12 jdavidb         hdl_laptop: When I use yaz-client to search, It shows that it worked fine, but returned no records.
14:13 jdavidb         I made the changes to the default.idx file that are in your patch...is there something else that needs doing?
14:14 chris_n         Colin: ahh, I see... tnx
14:15 Colin           chris_n: I think db update 65 and 68 duplicated some steps
14:17 jdavidb         zebraidx -V returns "Using ICU" at the end of its' output (we're on 2.0.34, Debian Etch, and yaz-icu package is installed.)
14:20 chris_n         Colin: ok, it appears that the confusion on my end was isolated to one topic branch
14:20 chris_n         tnx
14:24 owen            gmcharlt: Can you clarify for me? Is there anything special we should do with our commits for 3.2?
14:24 gmcharlt        owen: no, patch against head, just don't expect enhancements to be applied to HEAD
14:24 gmcharlt        just bugfixes
14:25 owen            Sure
14:25 gmcharlt        once the dust settles in a day or two, chris and I will work out something for handling enh patches destined for 3.4
14:26 owen            "error: Untracked working tree file 'koha-tmpl/intranet-tmpl/prog/img/itemtypeimg/sfdicons/Book.png' would be overwritten by merge. could not detach HEAD"
14:26 owen            Got that when trying to rebase
14:27 gmcharlt        owen: if you had installed a preview of that icon set, remove it first, then try rebasing
14:28 * owen          didn't think he had
14:29 owen            But there they were. Okay.
14:32 hdl_laptop      jdavidb nothing more
14:33 * jdavidb       shrugs.  I'm not seeing any errors in the logs...just not getting any results.  happily returning zero records, every time.
14:35 hdl_laptop      quite strange
14:35 hdl_laptop      what is your icu chain now ?
14:37 jdavidb         <icu_chain locale="en">
14:38 jdavidb         <transform rule="[:Control:] Any-Remove"/>
14:38 jdavidb         <tokenize rule="l"/>
14:38 jdavidb         <transform rule="[[:WhiteSpace:][:Punctuation:]] Remove"/>
14:38 jdavidb         <transform rule="NFD"/>
14:38 jdavidb         <transform rule="[:Nonspacing Mark:] Remove"/>
14:38 jdavidb         <transform rule="NFC"/>
14:38 jdavidb         <display/>
14:38 jdavidb         <casemap rule="l"/>
14:38 jdavidb         </icu_chain>
14:38 jdavidb         itty bitty chain.
14:41 hdl_laptop      looks ok
14:44 jdavidb         I've restarted zebra for this instance, but there are other instances running on the same server.
14:48 hilongo         hello everybody ... :)
14:48 nengard         Is there a way to trick the system into thinking it's an older version so that it will run some db updates that I somehow missed?   I don't want to wipe my db and start over (losing all my content) - but none of the patron card things work cause I missed some db updates apparently - and who knows what else I missed
14:49 kf              you could change your version number setting in sys prefs - but not sure if this is a good idea
14:49 kf              dentist appointment now... bye all!
14:52 nengard         anyone else with a tip I'm missing?
14:52 Colin           nengard: If you know what the missing change is you can get the sql from updatedatabase.pl and apply it directly in mysql
14:53 hdl_laptop      nengard: you can trick that
14:53 nengard         Colin - tried that didn't work ... not sure why
14:53 hdl_laptop      set version in systempreferences to 3.0100000
14:53 nengard         hdl_laptop with the new sys prefs interface is that info still in the db?
14:53 owen            nengard: You'll have to manually go to the old system preferences page
14:54 owen            admin/systempreferences.pl
14:54 nengard         owen i can do it with mysql
14:54 owen            It's still there
14:54 nengard         ah
14:54 nengard         cool
14:54 Colin           nengard: do a backup first
14:55 hdl_laptop      Colin++
14:55 * owen          heads down to the dungeon to talk to our cataloger
14:55 Colin           nothing ever goes wrong on backed up systems
14:56 nengard         bleh - okay everything works - but patron cards still don't
14:56 nengard         so i'm out of ideas here
14:56 nengard         chris_n anything?
14:57 nengard         I did get this error ---
14:57 nengard         http://koha.pastebin.com/m2f69a495
14:57 nengard         looks like 106 is being skipped
14:57 nengard         is that the patron card db updates
15:00 hilongo         I'm having some problems with holds in 3.1.5 looping forever whrn called from staff interface... I saw in the mailing list that request.pl is fixed in git repo ... how can I get a copy of that file without installing git??
15:01 gmcharlt        hilongo: you can go to http://git.koha.org, navigate to the proper file (in the 3.0.x branch), and download it (the blbo link for th efile)
15:02 slef            Colin: I've just spent an hour sifting backups for corrupted files.
15:02 slef            as in, backup copies of them.
15:02 slef            hi all
15:02 slef            I could have done without this today.
15:03 slef            How's it going for anyone else?
15:04 gmcharlt        passable
15:07 chris_n         nengard: om
15:07 * chris_n       is overrun atm :-P
15:07 gmcharlt        wheeee - 3.2-alpha tarball with all translations expanded coming in at 235M
15:08 nengard         chris_n no prob-  just want you to know I still don't know why I can't access it or get the DB to update - and that's why it's not documented ... but then again I still need help learniing how to use it before documenting it anyway :)
15:10 slef            gmcharlt: can we cut it up somehow, or generate translations from Makefile*?
15:10 gmcharlt        slef: yes - I think I'm going to release two tarballs - one with no translations expanded, and the traditional full one
15:10 gmcharlt        but ask people to prefer downloading the former
15:11 slef            make LANG=en:fr:... install # would be pretty cool, but I don't know if we can
15:12 gmcharlt        slef: shouldn't be too hard to do - good thing to try to add for the beta
15:13 * chris_n       's oldest daughter got her mothers engagement ring stuck on her (daughter's) finger... :-P
15:13 jwagner         chris_n, your children do have a problem with their hands/fingers, don't they?  How's your son doing, by the way?
15:14 chris_n         nearly all better... just awaiting the new nail to grow out and all of the feeling to return
15:14 jwagner         That's good.
15:14 chris_n         it all started with pianohacker's finger getting broken
15:14 chris_n         :-)
15:15 jwagner         It's catching???
15:15 chris_n         look out! ;-)
15:15 * jwagner       tucks hands into pockets....
15:16 * chris_n       looks at nengard's paste
15:17 chris_n         nengard: are you running the latest version? ie the alpha?
15:18 nengard         yes
15:19 nengard         and that was me trying to upgrade my db - the paste
15:19 chris_n         hmmm... it appears those version numbers don't jive with the current updatedatabase.pl
15:19 nengard         after running that I still can't access the patron card pages I mentioned yesterday - but then again if version 106 is the patron card db updates - that's why - my install skipped them
15:19 nengard         what???? how is that possible???
15:19 nengard         I fetched this morning
15:20 chris_n         om
15:20 nengard         :(
15:20 chris_n         your ok
15:22 chris_n         ok, it is the USING BTREE issue which hdl_laptop caught and patched
15:22 chris_n         for some reason it appears to still exist in your repo
15:22 nengard         hmmm
15:23 nengard         i feel like i should wipe and start all over again :(
15:23 chris_n         http://git.koha.org/cgi-bin/gitweb.cgi?p=Koha;a=commitdiff;h=2767b6ff1a9324f42f095518ce2c385aeab99c4b
15:23 chris_n         nengard: try this
15:23 chris_n         git checkout master
15:23 slef            LLEK - it's like Koha, but with your sysadmin's fingers broken?
15:23 chris_n         then fetch and rebase the master
15:23 * nengard       laughing at slef
15:24 chris_n         then git checkout -b pcardstest
15:24 chris_n         and try running the installer/data/mysql/patroncards_upgrade.pl script form the cli
15:24 nengard         rebasing now
15:25 nengard         'form the cli'?
15:25 gmcharlt        from the command line
15:25 nengard         ahh :)
15:25 nengard         hehe
15:25 chris_n         sorry :-(
15:25 nengard         no prob
15:25 slef            From Virtual Entity of Relevant Acronyms (Version 1.9, June 2002) [vera]:  CLI       Command Line Interpreter / Interface (OS)
15:26 nengard         chris_n - my system hates me :(  --- error on rebasing: http://koha.pastebin.com/m5f3269a5
15:27 chris_n         ouch
15:28 nengard         see - hates me
15:28 slef            Published Welcome to Koha-Community.org http://www.news.software.coop/welcome-to-koha-community-org/886/
15:29 slef            nengard: manual merge time for you :-/
15:30 gmcharlt        hi folks - munin will be going away for 15-30 minutes while I upgrade my VPS
15:30 schuster        has anyone seen this?  Has anyone developed for the iphone???  http://dclibrarylabs.org/projects/iphone/
15:30 schuster        It is released as creative commons code.
15:31 slef            schuster: we've developed some webapps for iphone but not a koha.  Is that an app or a webapp?
15:31 owen            Must be an app, they link to the App store
15:32 slef            schuster: it's a Noncommercial licence, which is non-FOSS and largely anti-cooperative
15:32 slef            owen: I'm not up with the rules of apps and App store. :)
15:32 hilongo         Bye munin ... see you soon!  :)
15:33 owen            slef: If it's on the App Store, then they must have submitted it to Apple and gotten Apple's approval. That's a big reason for not choosing to go the app route.
15:35 schuster        You can download the DCPL iPhone code which is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-Noncommercial-Share Alike 3.0 United States License, but largely unsupported.
15:36 schuster        slef - iphone app new version 1-30-10
15:39 owen            nengard: Are you trying a manual merge?
15:44 nengard         owen - working with chris_n found the problem and submitting a patch shortly
15:44 nengard         :)
15:45 owen            nengard I've got a question for you when you finish, and I'm sure I'll remember what it is by then.
15:45 nengard         LOL
15:52 nengard         okay - got a question - i have this error: "Can't locate Graphics/Magick.pm"  but I thought I installed that module yesterday - can someone tell me where to get that module? chris_n said I can't do cpan - so I did apt-get install
15:53 wizzyrea        nengard: did you get in ok?
15:53 nengard         yes
15:53 wizzyrea        sweet
15:53 nengard         emailed you to say so :)
15:53 wizzyrea        sorry to hijack your theme lol
15:53 nengard         added the newsletter
15:53 wizzyrea        nengard++
15:54 chris_n         nengard: install libgraphics-magick-perl also
15:55 nengard         chris_n doing now - but also reopened bug since the module isnt' listed as required on the about page
15:55 chris_n         that is the perl interface for the Graphics Magick stuff
15:55 chris_n         k
15:56 nengard         chris_n - still getting a 500 error :(
15:56 chris_n         I probably need to add some lines to the Makefile to alert the installer
15:56 jdavidb         RT @ranginui (chris):  admitted to hospital operating in the morning
15:57 chris_n         ?
15:57 jdavidb         wizzyrea and I both apparently just spotted it on twitter that chris is in the hospital.
15:57 chris_n         nengard: was the last install successful?
15:58 nengard         i sent you the error i got in a PM
15:58 nengard         didn't want to have a big paste here
15:58 chris_n         np... was that before or after the 500 error
15:59 nengard         i got the 500 error before installing and then again after installing
15:59 nengard         jdavidb - oh no!!!! not more info??
15:59 jdavidb         I seem to remember....'sec, nengard.
16:00 owen            chris pointed to this link: http://www.massgeneral.org/children/adolescenthealth/articles/aa_quinsy.aspx
16:00 owen            Which sounds like it's not too serious.
16:01 gmcharlt        here's hoping
16:01 nengard         owen - that's good - except that chris is an adult not an teen....
16:01 nengard         a teen
16:01 jwagner         Any kind of infection requiring surgery is serious :-(  Fingers and toes crossed....
16:01 jdavidb         I seem to recall him saying that his doctor was impressed at how swollen his tonsils were a day or two ago, but I can't find that in the logs.
16:02 gmcharlt        he tweeted that as well
16:03 gmcharlt        http://twitter.com/ranginui/status/8579869999
16:03 jdavidb         gmcharlt++  ; good find!
16:03 nengard         i follow way too many people on twitter - i miss too much coming from my friends :(
16:03 gmcharlt        besides, he doesn't get to run away from being 3.4 RM that easily ;)
16:03 nengard         LOL
16:04 jwagner         gmcharlt, it was the 3.2 alpha release that did it!
16:04 slef            I didn't realise it was chris
16:04 slef            I thought it was his child
16:04 jwagner         He's been sick for a week or so, complaining about a sore throat.
16:05 hilongo         Another question on reserves ... I got it working... but now, if I want to place a hold on a chequed out item Koha tells me that I cannot do that, because there are no copies available ... ??  any idea about this?
16:05 owen            hilongo: do you have circulation rules set up?
16:05 slef            hilongo: can't you place one on "Next Available"?
16:12 owen            Sorry hilongo I'm not sure what to suggest if you've got circulation rules set up already. I don't have an installation of 3.0.5 to test on
16:21 gmcharlt        @quote random
16:21 munin           gmcharlt: Quote #26: "<chris> as an aside C4::Search makes my brain hurt" (added by jdavidb at 05:21 PM, August 22, 2009)
16:21 jdavidb         woot!
16:21 jwagner         munin, welcome back
16:21 munin           jwagner: Error: "welcome" is not a valid command.
16:21 jwagner         Humph
16:21 owen            I blame C4::Search for chris's tonsil troubles
16:21 jwagner         It's searching for them?
16:22 nengard         aren't we all in rare form today :)
16:22 * gmcharlt      starts working on a munin plugin to elicit more harumphs from jwagner and jdavidb
16:22 jdavidb         :D
16:22 * owen          is still giddy from yesterday's excitement
16:22 nengard         hehe
16:22 jwagner         gmcharlt, not necessary, we'll harrumph for any/no reason.
16:23 jwagner         Besides, 6-8 inches of new snow on top what was already there is enough of a reason for harrumphing.
16:23 jwagner         I'm gonna have to go out & shovel a path to the garage soon....
16:23 jdavidb         Having a near-perfect commute, while jwagner is stuck at home, is plenty of reason for me to harrrumph!
16:24 jwagner         Harrumph!
16:24 jwagner         On the other hand, I have a nice soundtrack to the day, which isn't feasible at work.
16:27 jdavidb         hm...soundtrack.  (wish I hadn't left my iPod at home today..)
16:29 sekjal          if I do a full zebra rebuild, does searching in the system go down for that time, or will the old index still be used until the new one is complete?
16:33 jwagner         sekjal, the catalog will not be searchable until the reindex is complete.
16:34 sekjal          jwagner:  thanks!  thought that might be the case.  I guess I'll wait until overnight to run it, then
16:34 schuster        gmcharlt - are sounds in circulation still part of 3.2?
16:35 owen            schuster: Nope
16:35 owen            The never were
16:36 owen            There are some old patches floating around, but nothing was submitted that worked with HEAD
16:36 schuster        well phewey - I thought we were getting audible que's when there was a problem....
16:37 schuster        schuster goes off grumbling to sit in a corner and stew
16:37 owen            All the patches I saw were flawed in some way, partly because audio handling in browsers is so poor
16:37 * owen          has some hope for HTML5
16:37 * jdavidb       hands schuster a box of crackers, to go with his stew.
16:43 nengard         didn't someone get sounds working on their system - thought i read that somewhere
16:44 owen            Yes, and he had a public git repo for the work, but didn't prepare a patch that worked with HEAD I think
16:44 wizzyrea        i know there's stuff on bugzilla about it
16:44 wizzyrea        3.2.1 :)
16:45 wizzyrea        maybe
16:45 wizzyrea        NEKLS is interested in sounds too
16:45 wizzyrea        though, they only work if they actually have a bearing on something actually happening
16:46 owen            wizzyrea: You mean a continuous loud techno soundtrack isn't the sound you were interested in?
16:46 wizzyrea        well, I might be for that... I was thinking of schuster's problem where things appear to get checked in but don't actually get the status changed >.>
16:47 wizzyrea        where if you put the ding in the wrong place, it might be meaningless
16:47 owen            From mhafen: "These patches probably won't apply against the current code base, but I've got a git repo where they are current:  git://development.washk12.org/koha on the WCSD branch."
16:48 schuster        Yes that was what I was thinking of owen - I may get my local guru to look at it to see if we can at least locally apply it after 3.2.
16:54 nengard         head is spinning from the acq budget naming emails!!
16:54 jwagner         What about a new approach?  Spend::Lots::Money??
16:55 nengard         LOL
16:55 nengard         do not add to the confusion!! :)
16:55 jwagner         But then you could have variants for Some, Little, No money!
16:58 cait            :)
16:58 wizzyrea        for god's sake don't fork and have Spend::Obscene::Amounts::Money
16:58 jwagner         How about a fork that says Give::jwagner::Lots::Money?
16:58 nengard         Okay we have Source Budget, Main Budget, Budget Period --- any preferences/complaints/confusions?
16:58 nengard         which one should it be for the top most budget?
16:58 wizzyrea        lol STAY ON TARGET
16:59 * jwagner       thinks that IS my target :-)
16:59 nengard         i tried ... time for a nap :0 hehehe
17:00 owen            nengard: FWIW I prefer Source Budget of those options, but we don't even use acquisitions :P
17:00 nengard         I like Source Budget too - like the source of the money - but the complaint in the email list is it sounds like developereese
17:01 rhcl            wizzy: do (have you) use(d) any particular registrar for domain names you could recommend (over godaddy)?
17:01 nengard         rhc1 why not godaddy?
17:01 owen            I love that nobody knows what this stuff should be called.
17:02 wizzyrea        NEKLS usually goes through directnic
17:02 wizzyrea        but it's mostly historical
17:02 wizzyrea        i actually like the godaddy DNS controls
17:02 wizzyrea        having them host the records is a breeze
17:02 wizzyrea        imo
17:02 rhcl            godaddy = annoyance factor (email, trying to sell hosting services)
17:02 wizzyrea        yea, you do have to fight through a lot of cruft
17:03 wizzyrea        a lot of libraries use network solutions
17:03 wizzyrea        their controls aren't bad either
17:03 * wizzyrea      has poked around in a lot of registrars, thanks to KLOW
17:04 fredericd       hello
17:04 slef            network solutions were a pain to transfer away from last time we tried
17:04 slef            software.coop resells gandi.net who also fund debian and others
17:04 Sharon          SQL question - if want a count of the number of holds on a title, what table and field would that be in?  I should know this, but can't remember.
17:04 slef            bbl
17:05 sekjal          what about "incoming budget" or "incoming funds"?  that indicates that it's top-level, and (I think) sounds more user-centric
17:05 wizzyrea        ooh, I like that
17:06 wizzyrea        Total Moolah
17:06 jwagner         Sharon, reserves?  group by biblio number (join to biblio if you want the title itself)
17:06 wizzyrea        Available Funds?
17:06 wizzyrea        (the word funds looks strange to me today)
17:07 sekjal          so, perhaps the hierarchy could be - (adjective) funds::budgets::allocations ?
17:08 owen            (adjective) funds::budgets::budget lines ?
17:08 nengard         owen i like that
17:08 nengard         that makes logical sense to me - i can see it graphically
17:08 gmcharlt        -1 to allocations, which are more commonly used to describe influxes of money into a fund
17:09 sekjal          ah, good point, gmcharlt
17:09 sekjal          budget lines are good
17:09 gmcharlt        one thing - I'
17:09 gmcharlt        is there anything that actually preventrs one from having more than three levels of funds?
17:10 gmcharlt        if a library wants to do library system budget::branch fund::branch juvenile fund::branch YA graphic novels, for example
17:10 sekjal          my understanding is it's arbitrary.  once you have a root budget, you can subdivide it any way you like
17:10 gmcharlt        maybe just saying budget::fund::fund::fund with the explanation that a fund can have a parent would be sufficient
17:11 nengard         the language i see on the pages now is Root Budget::Budget:: Sub budget -- we need to replace those bits of language - but i do like budget::fund::fund .. .etc
17:14 nengard         so - the question is can i rename sub budget to fund and budget to fund and root budget to budget?
17:14 nengard         are you confused yet?
17:17 gmcharlt        nengard: 'sub budget' isn't a distinct concept as such, so just renaming the links to 'Child Fund' or 'Subsidary Fund' or the like wouldn't affect functionality
17:17 sekjal          I think have just two entities, the budget (which is set by some kind of external funding source like the Board of Trustees) and a fund (which is a chunk of that money that the library sets aside for something specific)
17:17 gmcharlt        so yeah, Root Budget => Budget ; Budget => Fund ; 'Sub-Budget' to language about creating child funds
17:17 gmcharlt        shouldn't break anything
17:18 gmcharlt        and changing the fund list to a tree control or something would make hierarchical arrangements more clear
17:18 gmcharlt        or just adding a parent fund/budget column to acqbudgets
17:19 owen            gmcharlt: There is supposed to be a tree control but it's not working, IIRC
17:19 gmcharlt        ok, so to summarize so far - Budget::Fund (and children Funds to the nth degree)
17:19 gmcharlt        is everybody on #koha cool with that?
17:19 wizzyrea        +1
17:20 wizzyrea        makes sense to me
17:20 nengard         okay  - so i change all occurences of Root Budget or Budget Period to Budget
17:20 nengard         and then all occurences of Budget to Fund
17:20 owen            Bug 4000
17:20 munin           04Bug http://bugs.koha.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=4000 normal, P5, ---, nahuel.angelinetti@biblibre.com, NEW, Budgets table doesn't show tree view for sub-budgets
17:20 nengard         and the one place it read 'sub-budget' i call it 'child fund' ?
17:21 nengard         I do like the idea - just confirming that i understand right
17:21 gmcharlt        +1
17:22 nengard         okay - i will tackle this as soon as i'm learning about the new patron card creator
17:22 nengard         i believe i already have a bug assigned to me for it
17:22 nengard         chris_n giving me a tutorial on how to use the patron card creator so i can document it
17:31 wizzyrea        owen: that theme found me, I didn't find it. I really don't have much to do with the awesomeness of its design (re:koha-community.org)
17:35 nengard         thank you chris_n for helping me with the patron card tool - now you can all benefit from what I learned:  http://wiki.koha.org/doku.php?id=en:documentation:tutorials:patroncardcreator
17:35 nengard         chris_n++
17:35 nengard         wizzyrea - feel free to change it :) hehe so it doesn't look like i'm copying you :)
17:37 wizzyrea        aww, but it's so PRETTY and appropriately koha green!
17:37 wizzyrea        :)
17:41 nengard         i know - what about the one i use on the newsletter site? that's green too :)
17:41 nengard         hehe
17:41 nengard         or i can use that one for my book site :)
17:46 schuster        @later tell chris - we need to talk about ncip and what it would take to complete that for Koha and Evergreen
17:46 munin           schuster: The operation succeeded.
17:51 * jdavidb       is wondering if he's losing his mind.
17:53 jdavidb         Still wrestling with icu indexing;  I stopped Zebra, reindexed, and restarted.  now, author, title searches work, but a general search in opac or staff returns nothing, every time.
17:53 jdavidb         (title searches work the way I'd expect with diacritics, even.  Very cool)
18:10 cait            jdavidb: try to turn off sysprefs
18:11 cait            jdavidb: we had an issue with some of them and icu indexing
18:11 cait            its worth a try :)
18:11 jdavidb         Any particular ones to look at?
18:11 cait            query stemming fuzzy autotruncate
18:11 jdavidb         okay.  I'll take a swing at that.  Thanks, cait.
18:17 cait            perhaps field weighting - I dont remember which combination worked and cant access administration from here
18:18 schuster        nengard - still looking for different opacs?  I just found this one http://dallas.sikhlibrary.org/opac-main.aspx
18:18 nengard         thanks - don't need them now that the newsletter will be on the new koha site
18:19 wizzyrea        nengard: I'm sure we could find a place to do what you were doing
18:19 wizzyrea        on the new site
18:19 wizzyrea        though I guess we don't want to make it too fully featured as yet
18:19 nengard         it's not a big deal - it seemed to be partly controversial
18:20 wizzyrea        I'm for helping you avoid controversy >.>
18:20 chris_n         'book bag' sounds much more relevant than 'cart'
18:21 * chris_n       loves to see how others have customized their opac
18:22 chris_n         and thought nengard's header was a nice addition
18:22 jdavidb         cait:  undoing fuzzy had the biggest impact.  I'm getting results identical to kw=foo   when I just enter foo.  (which is not even *close* to the results that I get on the production instance for just entering "foo".
18:24 jwagner         chris_n, I don't think it's made it into head yet, but I did a patch to create a syspref so sites could rename the Cart to whatever they want.  One of my sites calls it Saved Items.
18:24 chris_n         very nice
18:24 * chris_n       thinks of wal-mart when he sees the word 'cart' ;-)
18:26 jwagner         I just wish it would be as easy to replace the shopping cart image.  I think there are two or three different versions of it; I couldn't track them all down.
18:26 * nengard       trying to keep track of all of the occurences of budget, fund and root budget :)
18:26 cait            jdavidb: so its working better now?
18:26 nengard         might be the most files i've edited for one patch
18:27 jdavidb         cait:  better.  not optimally, but that's progress.  Thanks a bunch!
18:27 cait            jdavidb: no problem, I did not configure our installation for icu, so I m glad what I know helped a bit
18:30 owen            chris_n: It was book bag before, but "Cart" was chosen for 3.0 because it was thought that users would understand the metaphor because of experience with e-commerce sites.
18:31 owen            schuster: that opac example is running 2.x
18:31 * owen          is perplexed by the .aspx extensions, wonders if they did that to match an existing site
18:34 * owen          is looking forward to jwagner's patch so the issue can be moot
18:35 jwagner         I sent it in quite a while back, don't know if it's in the new 3.2 version or not.
18:36 owen            jwagner: Is your patch also attached to a bug report?
18:37 jwagner         Bug 3719
18:37 munin           04Bug http://bugs.koha.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=3719 enhancement, PATCH-Sent, ---, jwagner@ptfs.com, ASSIGNED, Create syspref to allow sites to rename OPAC Cart
18:37 jdavidb         jwagner++ , even though I'm having to install that patch on a bunch of systems...
18:37 jwagner         I did three separate patches, but the third replaced the second.  You helped me with the js files, remember owen?
18:38 * owen          doesn't seem to remember much these days, what with my sleep-patching and all
18:38 gmcharlt        owen: sleep-patching is fine - makes you even more productive
18:38 jwagner         Looks like I didn't attach the patches to the bug report -- want me too?
18:38 jwagner         to even?
18:39 owen            jwagner: You might also want to revise the patch now that the staff client has a cart too
18:39 * owen          thinks it's a great practice to always attach your patch to the bug report
18:39 jwagner         There's a whole bunch of stuff that will need to be updated for the new version.  I'm hoping this one snuck in with all the other stuff so I don't have to do it :-)
18:40 owen            I do see your submission on the patches list but I don't think it made it in
18:41 chris_n         so is the 'b' in borrowers.b_* for "business" and if so, where is the "Alternate Contact" info stored?
18:41 owen            I do notice that your original patch uses the deprecated tag-like TMPL syntax, "<TMPL_VAR NAME>" instead of <!-- TMPL_VAR NAME -->"
18:41 jwagner         I've attached the two patch files to the bug report
18:41 chris_n         and why is there no "Business contact" section on the edit borrowers screen?
18:42 owen            chris_n I think it's "b" as in the main contact info is "a"
18:42 wizzyrea        chris_n: fwiw, NEKLS hides all that stuff in favor or primary/alternate
18:42 wizzyrea        using jquery :P
18:42 owen            wizzyrea: I'd like to see a screenshot of that
18:43 wizzyrea        http://screencast.com/t/OTgzMzk1NTA for example
18:43 * chris_n       thinks the db schema could still use some cleanup
18:44 wizzyrea        instead of home/work/mobile
18:44 owen            I see wizzyrea, thanks
18:44 nengard         I have submitted a follow up patch to bug 3854 -- i hope I got all of the places this needed to be changed.  If not, let me know or feel free to make edits of your own :)
18:44 munin           04Bug http://bugs.koha.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=3854 minor, PATCH-Sent, ---, nengard@gmail.com, ASSIGNED, References to Budget Period should be Root Budget
18:49 jwagner         owen, on the TMPL_VAR NAME calls, is that just in the js sections?
18:50 owen            jwagner: I didn't look through the whole patch, it just caught my eye
18:50 jwagner         I think I was copying some existing syntax, so if that was outdated....
18:51 owen            We switched from <TMPL to <!-- TMPL because of the way the template processor works for translations
18:52 jwagner         gmcharlt, what happens with patches that have already been submitted?  Do they stay in the queue? or need to be resubmitted?
18:52 gmcharlt        they stay in the queue
18:53 jwagner         Let me know if I should clean that one up now, or wait until after it's pushed.
18:54 gmcharlt        well because of the <TMPL thing and the cart-in-staff interface, cleaning it up now would be nice
18:54 jwagner         Hrmm.  The branch I did that on got corrupted. I might just try editing the patch files directly & resending.
18:55 jwagner         That won't account for the staff side though -- that'll have to wait until I get a 3.2 updated system.
18:55 gmcharlt        make that create a new branch, apply the patch to it, make a new commit, squash, then resubmit, and it would work better
18:55 gmcharlt        literally editing the patch is not likely to be swallowed by Git all that well
18:55 * jwagner       is sure jdavidb can manage that :-)
18:56 chris_n         hehe
18:56 * jdavidb       perks, seeing more work land in his lap.
18:56 jwagner         heh heh heh
18:56 * jdavidb       is gonna start charging jwagner when she does that.
18:57 jwagner         Remember our discussion of git commands last week?  When I said I handled the complicated stuff by saying "Daaaavvvvviiiiiiiddddd"?
18:58 jdavidb         mmmm-hmm.  Harrrrumph!
19:00 chobbs          Hello all - anybody have a minute to help me troubleshoot a patron import error? I'm getting "Header row could not be parsed" despite the fact that my header row is an exact match for the example CSV.
19:01 gmcharlt        chobbs: what versin?
19:02 chobbs          gmcharlt:  3.00.05
19:02 Colin           looks like the last batch of fixes before the alpha has broken a few steps in the ordering process
19:06 chobbs          Grrr. Looks like my text editor didn't put proper ends-of-lines on the file. That would explain it...
19:10 chris_n         so it appears that the borrower.b_* fields do not get populated during a patron import
19:10 chobbs          That did it. And curse Mac OS X for not including dos2unix in the shell :)
19:12 * chris_n       finds an incorrect case in his csv template
19:12 chris_n         and remembers having to change the case of the 'B' in his template due to work on LEK which changes it to lower case
19:13 owen            The truth comes out about LEK's enhancements ;)
19:15 chris_n         there's more to be told to that story than there is time atm :-\
19:16 chris_n         it does highlight a bug in or import_borrowers script: fields not imported should generate an error message passed back to the user
19:16 chris_n         silent_fails--
19:21 chobbs          chris_n:  good enough for me right now - importing 13115 patrons right now (but I blanked all the B_fields anyways) ;)
19:23 chris_n         chobbs: great! However leaving one with the impression that their data imported successfully when in reality it did not is a problem
19:24 nengard         gmcharlt weren't downloads going to be on koha-community? just wondering cause the links go to download.koha.org in your recent email
19:24 chris_n         ie. if one of the columns was mistyped in your csv, the script will still tell you it imported 13115 patrons ok
19:24 gmcharlt        nengard: that was only a fallback
19:24 nengard         ah so you have access to dowload.koha.org? good!!
19:25 gmcharlt        nope, but cfouts has been willing to stage the files
19:25 nengard         ah
19:25 nengard         got it
19:25 wizzyrea        cfouts is awesome
19:26 wizzyrea        cfouts++
19:26 owen            cfouts++ also for helping us with our migration even though it was away from his employer
19:27 gmcharlt        cfouts++
19:28 wizzyrea        aaand updated here: http://koha-community.org/download-koha/
19:28 gmcharlt        wizzyrea++
19:29 magnus          gmcharlt: tiny typo in your email: ./install.pll ;-)
19:29 * gmcharlt      submits patch to rename it to install.pll ;)
19:30 * jwagner       thinks gmcharlt will need to patch Perl itself too
19:30 chris_n         cfouts++
19:32 braedon_        wizzyrea: just me being pedantic, but would it be possible to line up "Questions? Comments?" headings with the other text? It's hugging the wall, and keeps bugging me :)
19:33 wizzyrea        yea, probably :)
19:33 wizzyrea        will look at it here in a bit
19:34 wizzyrea        this theme was H1 heavy, which drove me nuts. There's something about the h2 styles that makes it do that
19:34 braedon_        ahh
19:35 wizzyrea        but it bugs me too, you're not alone in that
19:35 wizzyrea        :)
19:35 braedon_        haha, good to know :)
19:43 gmcharlt        counting noses - how many people would be up for a bug-squashing this Saturday on #koha?
19:45 jwagner         gmcharlt, you mean with 3.2?
19:45 nengard         we're expecting a storm here so I'll be snowed in and can probably help in the AM - but I have to see my sister in a play in the PM
19:46 gmcharlt        jwagner: yep, 3.2
19:46 wizzyrea        could probably do some in the middle of the day, testing anyway. Otherwise kiddo's birthday :(
19:46 jwagner         I'm not at that level yet except for one demo site, so I can't be of much help :-(
19:46 owen            gmcharlt: The spirit is willing, but the family will probably prevent
19:46 gmcharlt        would a weekday be better?
19:47 nengard         always
19:47 owen            Yes for me
19:47 wizzyrea        yes for me too
19:47 Colin           sure thing
19:47 wizzyrea        is there pizza?
19:47 wizzyrea        j/k j/k
19:47 wizzyrea        :)
19:47 gmcharlt        wizzyrea: I'll email you all the pizza you can eat
19:48 wizzyrea        yesssss
19:48 wizzyrea        wait...
19:48 wizzyrea        virtual pizza is my favorite.
19:48 wizzyrea        how did you know?
19:48 nengard         heh
19:48 wizzyrea        dangit now I want pizza.
19:49 gmcharlt        ok, I'll propose next Thursday for the bug squash
19:50 nengard         it's on my calendar!
19:50 nengard         I'll be here
19:50 jdavidb         jwagner, I can probably get your test-monster up and breathing before the weekend.
19:52 wizzyrea        anybody have a really good set of test data that they'd share
19:53 wizzyrea        bibs/items/patrons
19:53 * chris_n       has whined for that for a long time
19:53 nengard         wizzyrea i don't know if mine is really good ... but i'll share if no one else has really good data ;)
19:53 chris_n         but with little success
19:53 nengard         and if someon ehas really good data- i'd love it!!!
19:54 owen            wizzyrea can't you steal an export from one of your libraries? Or is for more than internal use?
19:54 chris_n         I'd love to see several size/configurations of test data available to devs
19:54 wizzyrea        owen: the exports are huge, in the 10-12GB range :/
19:54 wizzyrea        not so good for my dev virtualbox
19:55 wizzyrea        which is smallish
19:55 owen            wizzyrea: You can export a range of biblionumbers
19:55 wizzyrea        hmmmm
19:55 hdl_laptop      gmcharlt: wednesday could be good.
19:55 hdl_laptop      for bugsqushing session
19:55 hdl_laptop      (/me reading back logs)
19:55 gmcharlt        ok, Wednesday it is
19:56 hdl_laptop      next thursday i cannot
19:56 nengard         moved on my calendar to weds the 10th
19:56 wizzyrea        mine too
19:56 hdl_laptop      And I would like our team to participate
19:56 gmcharlt        :)
19:57 gmcharlt        did you think I would refuse? ;)
19:57 * jdavidb       will be here, but there's no tellin' what sort of things might interrupt me *participating*
19:59 * jwagner       looks innocent....
20:01 * chris_n       will be there as much as possible too
20:03 magnus          will cheer from the sidelines
20:04 gmcharlt        you_all++
20:04 nengard         wizzyrea -this page is missing the IRC info (address and such) http://koha-community.org/support/free-support/
20:04 wizzyrea        uh, are you sure?
20:04 wizzyrea        IRC (real-time chat)
20:04 wizzyrea        Kohaphiles of all types can be found on our real-time chat IRC channel. Point your favorite IRC client at irc.katipo.co.nz and join #koha or use a web based client like Mibbit.
20:04 wizzyrea        Connect through Mibbit
20:04 nengard         OH BOY!
20:05 nengard         going blind
20:05 wizzyrea        :)
20:05 nengard         thanks & sorry
20:05 wizzyrea        sok
20:05 the_eye_doctor  Hi, is there a nengard here? I'm here for your appointment
20:05 wizzyrea        lol!
20:06 nengard         how the heck was that????
20:06 nengard         or -- who the heck was that?? :)
20:06 nengard         can't type either - can you tell my 8 hour work day is done and i'm totally fried?
20:06 owen            Sorry, couldn't resist. I've never tried mibbit before :)
20:06 nengard         hehe
20:06 wizzyrea        owen: do you like that trick I did?
20:06 wizzyrea        :)
20:07 nengard         k - logging off - i have submitted a couple patches and updated the documentation a bit - tomorrow a lot more documentation updates - as long as I don't find other things to patch :)
20:10 wizzyrea        I like the mibbit widget, it makes connecting easy, and no more CGI-blah blah nonsense :P
20:13 * owen          learns of selection styles from the koha-community.org stylesheet
20:13 owen            http://www.quirksmode.org/css/selection.html
20:13 braedon_        ooo, awesome
20:16 wizzyrea        braedon_: I fixed your questions/comments peeve :)
20:17 wizzyrea        for the record, pianohacker++ for helping with the CSS
20:17 braedon_        wooo!
20:17 wizzyrea        he made some tweaks last night
20:17 braedon_        wizzyrea++
20:17 braedon_        pianohacker++
20:18 braedon_        ahh, beautiful alignment. all is right with the world
20:18 wizzyrea        I was gonna say, owen, if you have suggestions about the site I'm happy to hear them :)
20:18 wizzyrea        I'm feeling a bit stabbity about text-transform: uppercase
20:18 * owen          would agree
20:19 wizzyrea        OH OH then I'll fix it
20:19 wizzyrea        it makes me feel unhappy
20:19 owen            wizzyrea, I'm going to send you an alternative to that koha logo in the green box as soon as I have time. Tomorrow prob'ly
20:20 wizzyrea        okies
20:20 wizzyrea        I
20:20 wizzyrea        am for that
20:25 wizzyrea        owen: I was going to color match it to the header but I just hadn't gotten there
20:25 wizzyrea        but I will wait for your no doubt much more artistic rendering tomorrow
20:28 owen            Am I alone in seeing this kind of thing? http://zivotdesign.com/examples/holds-priority-problem.png
20:28 jwagner         owen, what version?
20:29 owen            3.01.00.061
20:29 pianohacker     hello
20:29 jwagner         roughly the same as our working one then.  We've seen it occasionally, and jdavidb has a script to clean it up.
20:29 jwagner         The holds queue seems to get itself knotted up somehow.
20:30 owen            jwagner: A script that runs nightly? We used to have one that we used when we hosted our own install of 2.x
20:30 jwagner         No, he just runs it when we see a problem.  Check with him tomorrow for details.
20:30 wizzyrea        bah I can't see your screenshot
20:30 wizzyrea        we're really close to your version
20:31 jwagner         The problem is that there are multiple holds all with a priority of 1, right?
20:31 wizzyrea        I don't think we've seen that no
20:31 owen            wizzyrea: Can't see my screenshot? Why?
20:31 wizzyrea        it wouldn't load
20:31 wizzyrea        but I finally got it
20:31 wizzyrea        :)
20:31 wizzyrea        lemme ask and get back to you
20:32 jwagner         It's not always multiples of priority 1, we've seen multiples of priority 14 or whatever.
20:32 owen            Our old script would clean up that kind of thing and undo any changes the staff had made to hold priorities
20:32 jwagner         That sounds similar to what his does, but I don't know specifics.  I think it resets priorities based on the date/timestamp
20:32 owen            Right, exactly.
20:33 wizzyrea        my peeps tell me they haven't seen your problem.. you are indep branches?
20:33 wizzyrea        or no?
20:33 jwagner         The times we've seen it were not very long after a migration, trying to shoehorn alien hold data into Koha tables
20:33 owen            No
20:34 jwagner         Sometimes during normal ops, but rarely
20:34 owen            jwagner: We have just migrated (although it was really more like an upgrade, no_vendor_lockin++ )
20:34 wizzyrea        ohh, probably has something to do with your move maybe?
20:35 jwagner         Possibly, although our migrations were from other systems entirely (Dynix, Horizon, etc.).  I'd think Koha-to-Koha would be a lot cleaner.
20:35 owen            Could be, I thought it happened infrequently but persistently
20:35 jwagner         I don't know that he's ever figured out what causes it.
20:36 gmcharlt        random question - does anybody know who answers info@koha.org
20:37 * owen          is going to guess "Nobody" :P
20:37 wizzyrea        doh
20:39 owen            jwagner: Here's an interesting data point: the "priority" number in the database for all those "1" priority holds looks like this: 141, 209, 210, 227, 235, 237
20:40 jwagner         So do you have 230+ holds on that title?  Are these the "right" priority numbers?
20:41 owen            No, they're randomly large numbers (should be 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37)
20:41 jwagner         I dunno.  Talk to jdavidb, he's dug into the guts of that problem.  I just know the symptoms, & when we see them, we have him run his script.
20:42 owen            I will, thanks
20:43 jwagner         I haven't looked, is there a bugzilla report on this type of problem?  If not, there probably should be....
20:48 owen            A strange example: http://koha.pastebin.com/mf0501
20:49 owen            The entry with "421" priority has a reservedate "2009-12-18" but a timestamp "2010-02-03"
20:49 owen            Manually re-ordered?
20:49 wizzyrea        whoa
20:49 jwagner         *blinks*
20:50 owen            that might explain why there isn't an item with priority 1
20:51 jwagner         Wonder if you could reproduce it -- take an existing OK title & manually reorder holds, then check the table values.
20:52 owen            This one is just absurd: http://koha.pastebin.com/d3822211a
20:54 wizzyrea        wtf seriously
20:54 jwagner         What she said.
21:03 braedon_        this is not in any way koha specific, but has anyone come across an issue where mysql is started before networking on bootup, causing it to fail?
21:04 braedon_        debian, on a virtualbox vm(which i suspect may be part the problem - never had the issue before)
21:06 jwagner         owen, I emailed jdavidb to read the logs, so he'll know what you're asking about tomorrow.
21:06 jwagner         I'm gonna sign off now.  Got that long trip home, after all :-)  (Two seconds, that is)
21:10 wizzyrea        any reason why a library using no authorities would be unable to add something to 100$a?
21:10 owen            wizzyrea: You double-checked the MARC framework?
21:10 wizzyrea        hmm, what about it?
21:11 owen            that it's not trying to link 100$a to an authorized value or something like that
21:11 wizzyrea        ty ty , will check
21:12 wizzyrea        nope, not that
21:13 wizzyrea        it's like, you can click in it, but you can't type anything
21:14 pianohacker     wizzyrea: BiblioAddsAuthorities?
21:15 pianohacker     It's a lovely syspref that is on by default for some reason
21:15 wizzyrea        off :/
21:15 pianohacker     Hrm
21:15 wizzyrea        toggle it maybe and see if it helps?
21:15 wizzyrea        you know turning it off and on again lol
21:16 wizzyrea        nope, not that
21:18 wizzyrea        what triggers the little ellipsis? Authorities?
21:19 wizzyrea        erm, would the Authority types preferences have something to do with it?
21:23 pianohacker     Well, there's authorities and then there's authorized values
21:23 pianohacker     Does the 100 $a field have a plugin assigned to it?
21:23 wizzyrea        forgive my ignorance, where do I look for that
21:23 pianohacker     In the subfields structure editor
21:23 wizzyrea        (this is not the area I muck about in much)
21:24 pianohacker     (your sanity thanks you)
21:24 wizzyrea        http://pomona.nekls.org:8080/cgi-bin/koha/admin/authtypes.pl
21:24 wizzyrea        is that the right spot?
21:24 wizzyrea        sorry, should have truncated that link
21:25 pianohacker     Administration -> MARC Bibliographic Framework
21:26 pianohacker     Then MARC Structure next to Default framework
21:26 pianohacker     Then find the 100 tag, and click subfields next to it
21:26 pianohacker     Then Edit Subfields
21:27 pianohacker     Then $a, then display more constraints
21:28 pianohacker     wizzyrea: Here's what mine looks like: http://www.ubuntu-pics.de/bild/40937/selection_001_4SnlSI.png
21:28 wizzyrea        oh brilliant, the thesaurus was on
21:28 wizzyrea        silly
21:28 pianohacker     Well, I have a thesaurus too
21:28 pianohacker     And I can type in the $a subfield
21:29 wizzyrea        we turned it off, and now it seems to be working
21:29 pianohacker     Huh.
21:29 pianohacker     What version are you marooned in?
21:29 wizzyrea        this one is ooold
21:29 wizzyrea        3.01.00.041
21:30 pianohacker     (also, just discovered that the password for bywater's demo is bywater/bywater, rather than demo/demo)
21:30 wizzyrea        it's a teeny library, it works for them and no reason particularly to update
21:30 wizzyrea        ty ty will fix
21:30 wizzyrea        done
21:32 wizzyrea        ph: i do like what you did to the CSS, very nice
21:32 wizzyrea        you're right about the click effect, that's much prettier
21:35 gmcharlt        hdl_laptop: about?
21:40 brendan         pianohacker - we've got two demo's up
21:40 brendan         one is bywater/bywater and the other is demo/demo
21:41 pianohacker     brendan: Ok. The one linked from the website is bywater/bywater
21:41 wizzyrea        doh lol
21:41 wizzyrea        oh good
21:41 wizzyrea        phew
21:41 pianohacker     I think
21:41 wizzyrea        you're killin me smalls
21:41 brendan         ah I see send the blind man (well actually the one who hasn't been reading the #koha channel)
21:41 brendan         s/send/said
21:42 * pianohacker   gives brendan some new a and i keys, the current ones seem to be problematic
21:42 pianohacker     said painohacker
21:42 brendan         thanks greatly
21:42 brendan         heh
21:43 braedon_        can anyone explain what changing the marc framework of a book actually does(ie, from default to books)? does it drop any data? or just change how the marc record is viewed?
21:43 brendan         speaking like yoda today I am
21:44 pianohacker     braedon_: If a tag/subfield is present in one framework and not another, I think transferring it will drop that tag
21:45 braedon_        hmm, so no knowing anything about what fields are actually useful, doing so could be potentially bad
21:46 pianohacker     I think the tag coverage of most of them is the same, but...
21:47 braedon_        probably all right to leave them as default for this installation i think
21:48 pianohacker     If you're concerned, you can delete the example frameworks except for default, then duplicate some new ones from the default, and then change those
21:49 braedon_        for future reference, would changing the frameworkcode field in the database have the same effect as editing the marc record and changing the dropdown? ie, when is the conversion from one framework to the other done?
21:50 pianohacker     braedon_: Editing it in the database would change the way the record is displayed but not the content, but it would get dropped when you saved the record
21:51 braedon_        the problem with building one from the default, is that i wouldn't know what ones to change, and I don't think the librarian that will be using the system would either
21:52 pianohacker     Hrm
21:53 pianohacker     That might be a mailing list question, then, I'm not positive that all of the example frameworks cover the same tags
21:54 braedon_        Thinking about it, i will have to come up with something. if you leave it on default, whenever you save a marc record(well, for all the ones i have tried it on at least) there are a bunch of required fields that it wants you to add, as they aren't in the original record retrieved from z39.50 servers. If you switch it to books, it stops complaining
21:55 braedon_        i suppose i can look at the logs and find what it has dropped for a given record
21:55 pianohacker     braedon_: Which specific subfields? You can turn that off, there's some weird and unnecessary defaults
21:56 pianohacker     unfortunately, I must drop out and get some work done, adios
21:58 chris_n         braedon_: I don't believe the changing the framework drops any data iirc
21:59 chris_n         if the record had the tag and/or subfield it will still be there, just not displayed
21:59 braedon_        ok
21:59 braedon_        i'm having a look into one i changed to books, to see what it did
22:00 * chris_n       has added/removed tags from frameworks often and noticed no data loss as a result
22:01 brendan         gmcharlt++ #busy-man and I'm loving seeing all the gitosis messages
22:01 chris_n         there are some things that you should not change unadvisedly, however, like mapping of marc fields to koha fields
22:15 braedon_        ok, in the test i did, moving a random book from default to books, it deleted a 019 tag, and a 695
22:15 braedon_        it also added a 942
22:16 braedon_        time to work out what on earth they are :)
22:17 wizzyrea        slef about?
22:20 wizzyrea        nm :)
22:21 braedon_        chris_n: it looks like whenever you save a marc record, it reformats it(obviously), and any tags that Koha doesn't know about, are not transferred over
22:21 braedon_        chris_n: the 019 and 695 tags don't appear in the default mark framework at all
22:24 chris_n         braedon_: are you hiding or actually removing  the tags?
22:26 braedon_        not
22:27 braedon_        the original marc records are imported
22:27 braedon_        what i am then doing is moving them to the books framework, and saving
22:28 chris_n         I missunderstood earlier... by change I meant hiding subfields rather than deleteing tags from the framework
22:28 braedon_        and also then to other frameworks, and back to books
22:29 braedon_        so should all tags in default be in the others? just some hidden?
22:30 chris_n         I'll have to defer on that answer to gmcharlt or someone else more familiar with what goes on when certian tags are actually removed from the framework
22:31 braedon_        ok
22:31 chris_n         I do know hiding/unhiding does not affect the tag/field in the record
22:31 braedon_        cool
22:32 gmcharlt        right, but once the record passes through the Koha MARC editor, tags not represented in the framework can get stripped
22:32 gmcharlt        (which doesn't actually seem all that good)
22:32 * chris_n       agrees
22:32 braedon_        "not represented" - hidden or removed?
22:32 gmcharlt        removed
22:32 braedon_        ok
22:33 chris_n         then, I think the marc editor is on the slate to be revamped at some point iirc
22:33 braedon_        that seems to be what i found in the tests
22:33 chris_n         I would think you'd like to keep all tags/fields of the original marc record intact
22:33 chris_n         and use the framework as a sort of filter for editing/displaying
22:33 brendan         wow really likes the URL name - librarypolice.com
22:35 braedon_        who has it?
22:35 gmcharlt        I do
22:35 braedon_        haha, o, right
22:35 brendan         gmcharlt you need a matching jacket or varsity jacket kind of thing
22:35 gmcharlt        no, I need a badge :)
22:36 brendan         of course :)
22:39 pianohacker     brendan: Do you have an online preview of the new VOKAL icons?
22:45 braedon_        gmcharlt: does that apply for subfields? or just whole tags?
22:45 gmcharlt        I think it applies to subfields as well
22:46 braedon_        hmm, ok
22:46 braedon_        fun times :)
22:47 brendan         pianohacker --> http://demo-staff.bywatersolutions.com/cgi-bin/koha/admin/itemtypes.pl?op=add_form
22:47 brendan         username - demo
22:47 brendan         same for password
22:48 brendan         right now they are listed as sfdicons -- but I changed that to vokal
22:50 wizzyrea        sniff test. Aesome
22:50 wizzyrea        awesome, even.
22:51 brendan         wizzyrea - I'm going to update the intranet.bywatersolutions.com demo to the current HEAD by the end of today - so you can update that information on koha-community.org
22:52 wizzyrea        woot!
22:52 wizzyrea        email me when you're done and I'll fix it
22:52 wizzyrea        wizzyrea@gmail.com
22:56 brendan         wizzyrea -> updated now
22:56 wizzyrea        oh sweet lol that was fast
22:57 brendan         3.01.00.111
22:57 wizzyrea        ty kindly
22:58 brendan         sure thing and let me know if you want me to change anything
22:58 wizzyrea        nope you make it look lovely ;)
22:58 wizzyrea        updated
22:59 brendan         I may have missed this - what's the process to get access to edit or add to the koha-community
22:59 wizzyrea        create an account, see the first post on the site
22:59 wizzyrea        there's a link
22:59 wizzyrea        and if you don't get the email let me know
23:00 wizzyrea        1. it's not always instantaneous and 2. it's been getting caught in spam filters a lot
23:00 brendan         doh
23:01 brendan         hey cool - if worked I'm registered
23:01 brendan         s/if/it
23:02 wizzyrea        squee!
23:11 braedon_        is there some magic to defining issuing rules? nothing i do seems to add anything
23:15 brendan         braedon_ this could deal with bug 3870
23:15 munin           04Bug http://bugs.koha.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=3870 blocker, PATCH-Sent, ---, nahuel.angelinetti@biblibre.com, NEW, Can't add circulation and fines rules
23:18 braedon_        those three fields are not in my database
23:18 braedon_        i am on 3.00.05 at the moment - should they be there?
23:19 brendan         hmm.. not sure I was speaking to head
23:19 brendan         I don't have a 3.00.05 database at the moment
23:20 braedon_        i will try adding the fields
23:20 braedon_        can always delete them
23:22 braedon_        fixed
23:22 braedon_        magical
23:22 braedon_        thanks
23:25 brendan         ah the power of bugs.koha.org++
23:27 braedon_        well, if you know what to search for
23:27 gmcharlt        vokal++
23:27 gmcharlt        brendan: do they want a credit in the release notes?
23:27 brendan         yes
23:27 brendan         give the credit to Vokal
23:27 gmcharlt        Vokal or VOKAL?
23:28 brendan         http://gmlc.wordpress.com/koha-project/
23:28 brendan         hmm.. not sure
23:28 gmcharlt        heh - they don't seem quite sure either
23:28 brendan         http://openilsvt.pbworks.com/
23:29 gmcharlt        vokal seems the most common
23:29 brendan         I agree
23:29 brendan         yes give them all the credit
23:29 brendan         I'm just the middleman
23:29 gmcharlt        yeah, I'm asking about the sponsor section specifically
23:49 pianohacker     vokal++ # The new icons are very tasteful and consistent
23:55 brendan         didn't get this in yet
23:55 brendan         hi pianohacker
23:55 brendan         greetings
23:56 pianohacker     greetings to you too
23:56 pianohacker     bye again, just wanted to see the new icons :)
23:58 brendan         @wunder 93117
23:59 munin           brendan: The current temperature in Northwest Goleta, Goleta, California is 18.0�C (3:52 PM PST on February 03, 2010). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 62%. Dew Point: 11.0�C. Pressure: 29.70 in 1005.6 hPa (Falling).