Time Nick Message 11:55 paul hello kados 11:42 kados g'morning #koha 10:06 chris but now i migt have to go to sleep :) 09:58 chris i might have to do some screen shots 09:57 chris oh wow cool 09:54 chris and now i can run the tests ive recorded with the ide 09:53 chris and got the server up and going 09:53 chris i installed this http://www.openqa.org/selenium-rc/download.action 09:52 chris wow cool 09:48 chris for example http://bugs.koha.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/attachment.cgi?id=109 09:48 chris but even with recording it in html, its useful 09:47 chris so i have my test (which is perl) and im just getting a selenium server up and running so i can run against it 09:39 chris very cool, the selenium ide will write your perl test for you, then you can just run them 09:38 chris $sel->type_ok("q", "fish"); 09:38 chris sel->wait_for_page_to_load_ok("30000"); 09:38 chris $sel->click_ok("//img[\@alt='KohaZOOM Enterprise ILS']"); 09:38 chris $sel->open_ok("/cgi-bin/koha/opac-main.pl"); 09:37 chris i just did one now 09:34 chris with the IDE you can export as perl 09:30 chris hmm 09:27 chris but i actually i think doing it with perl scripts might be nicer 09:26 chris sorry twisted server 09:24 chris we were planning to use selenium server 09:22 chris not really 09:22 hdl was just to ask you if you investiguated perl modules for selenium ? 09:21 chris be awake for a little bit longer 09:21 chris its only 9.18pm 09:21 hdl that late ??? 09:21 chris am now hdl 07:15 hdl chris around ? 05:26 russel laters 05:26 russel yep i am done too 05:21 chris ppl will be arriving for craft night soon, so i best go help 05:21 chris ok im done for the day i think 05:15 chris yep 05:14 russel <td>/cgi-bin/koha/opac-authorities-home.pl</td> 05:14 chris no hostname .. so should work anywhere 05:14 russel ah true it does too 05:14 chris ie it says 05:14 chris so shoudl work on any koha 05:13 chris right that one is all relative 05:13 russel i think there must be some way that someone can write the tests on one site, but use them on another 05:13 russel so people can run them against their own installs 05:13 russel about relative vs absolute links 05:12 russel i might do some more reading 05:11 chris we should put them in git 05:11 russel yeah - but it would be nice to have a place to start collecting these 05:11 chris so it can run those tests 05:11 chris we have to get our automated tester going 05:10 russel but not sure what to do with them now i have them 05:10 russel i have recorded a bunch of tests 05:10 russel yeah 05:10 chris you dont miss steps that way 05:10 russel i was trying to find a bug that i could use it for 05:09 chris yep 05:09 russel http://bugs.koha.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/attachment.cgi?id=109 05:09 russel but i think even reading it is useful 05:09 chris nice proof of concept 05:09 russel pity it was a simple bug 05:08 russel http://bugs.koha.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=1360 04:08 mason_ yep, great work at ALA too 04:07 kados ttyl 04:07 kados anyway, I should get some rest 04:07 kados then maybe move on 04:07 mason_ yeah, that sounds urgenter that the bugs ive been looking at today, for sure 04:07 kados I'd finish that first 04:07 kados if you're int he middle of a bug fix 04:07 kados so maybe sorta urgent 04:07 kados I think it's the only thing holding back a 2.2.10 release based on rel_2_2 04:06 kados I guess in some sense it _is_ a bug :-) 04:06 mason_ is it urgent-er? 04:05 mason_ i hadnt switched over to that yet, was still picking thru bugs 04:04 kados finding the stuff paul wanted committed to default templates? 04:04 kados mason_: b4 I go, how's the hunting going? 04:04 mason_ yep, cya later josh 04:04 chris ill edit it with whatever i find 04:04 chris yep busy day tomorrow 04:03 kados I'm gonna get to bed 04:03 kados chris: http://wiki.koha.org/doku.php?id=en:development:git_usage 03:57 chris im gonna have to play, ill email what i find 03:56 kados chris: ok, I'm done up to the part about how to push branches :-) 03:46 chris cool 03:35 russel yep 03:34 kados yea 03:34 kados s/organization/taxonomy/ 03:34 kados copy/paste what docs we have into that organization 03:34 kados I imagine the first job is tjust to get the organization going 03:34 russel sure the homepage layout etc will be different - but there is a bunch of content that needs working on 03:33 kados russel: ok, I won't get to it today, but I'll have it ready for you by next koha project day 03:33 kados russel: exactly 03:33 kados chris: sounds good 03:33 russel then i should be able to start on the content now 03:33 chris gonna have to have a read figure out the best way to do it 03:33 kados yea, we can do the content separately 03:33 russel and if this does what it says it does 03:33 russel a contest will take a while to run 03:33 kados yea 03:33 russel and i can start doing the content 03:32 russel is seperate from the content 03:32 russel but the look and feel 03:32 russel well the is cool 03:32 kados it'd be good for both projects 03:32 kados we could get plone designers to compete 03:31 kados the new koha.org 03:31 kados koha.orguthe new koha.org 03:31 kados say $1,000 or something 03:31 russel of what? 03:31 kados for the design 03:31 kados was we could do a contest 03:31 russel i mean i assume that the look and feel is all controlled by templates and can be done later 03:31 kados what I was thinking 03:31 kados yea 03:30 russel but i will need someone to set it up for me 03:30 russel ok so well that is something i can punt around on on these koha days 03:29 kados and we can redirect kohadocs when it goes live 03:29 kados and put docs in new.koha.org/documentation 03:29 kados russel: I think better to maybe do a new.koha.org :-) 03:29 russel the plone idea sounds good - but i was thinking perhaps we set up a seperate new.kohadocs.org - set up all the content in there and then make the change 03:28 chris gonna have to figure out how we push the branch, ill go have a read 03:28 kados Everything up-to-date 03:28 kados I edited a file, did git commit, and git push 03:28 kados chris: same deal 03:27 kados russel: 30 mins or so 03:27 chris and then try our push again 03:27 russel kados you going to be around for much longer? 03:27 chris right, lets make a change, commit it 03:27 kados Everything up-to-date 03:26 chris what happens when you do git push ? 03:26 kados OK 03:26 chris lets try and push that branch 03:25 chris naw 03:25 kados now I branch? 03:25 chris yep 03:25 chris much easier to do the backport, forwardport stuff 03:25 kados ok, so I check it out 03:25 kados rock! 03:25 kados yea 03:25 chris (see how easy its gonna be to merge from rel_3 (when we create the branch when we go stable) to the dev branch) 03:24 kados right 03:24 kados ahh 03:24 chris you need to be inside your clone 03:24 chris you in the right dir? 03:24 kados fatal: Not a git repository 03:24 kados git checkout -f kados_test 03:23 chris checkout ur branch again 03:23 kados :-) 03:23 kados snap 03:23 kados lets try 03:23 chris lets try 03:23 chris yep im not sure of the syntax to do that 03:23 kados they'd just push the branch to the RM? 03:23 chris thats right 03:23 kados right? 03:23 kados they wouldn't do a checkout -f master 03:22 kados so that's gonna be slightly different then 03:21 kados cool 03:21 chris yeah im inclined to try it that way first 03:21 kados I suspect we want to do the merge 03:21 kados yea 03:21 chris or do we want to do that merge 03:21 chris do we want them to merge to master and push when the feature is done 03:20 chris the question is 03:20 chris yes 03:20 kados you'd want to create a new branch every time you were working on a new feature 03:20 chris and the rm would have to do the merge .. it would mean they woudl also have to do a git pull on the master 03:20 kados way I see it 03:19 chris just into a different branch 03:19 chris they would still be pushing to the rm's clone 03:18 kados I guess the wouldn't have clone ability if they just had push to their branch? 03:18 kados giving people push to their branch? or push to the master branch? 03:18 kados so which do we want to try first? 03:18 kados right 03:18 chris you can do git diff between branches too 03:17 chris does that make sense? 03:17 chris rather than pushing the master branch 03:16 chris and we merge the changes in 03:16 chris this may or may not be how we want to do it, we might want ppl to push their branch 03:16 chris it will send out a mail 03:16 chris if you do a git push now 03:15 kados got it 03:15 chris yep 03:15 kados still local to this repo? 03:15 chris this is all still locally 03:15 chris nope 03:15 kados so shouldn't it have sent a mail? 03:15 chris (in the new version) 03:15 kados yea, done 03:15 chris unless you do -m="message" 03:15 kados huh 03:15 chris ie it will just spark and editor up so you can enter your message 03:14 chris its more sane on the new version :) 03:12 kados sweet 03:12 chris that might be it for this version 03:12 chris ahh git merge "Merging in changes" master kados_test 03:11 kados Usage: /usr/bin/git-merge [-n] [--no-commit] [--squash] [-s <strategy>]... <merge-message> <head> <remote>+ 03:11 chris git merge master kados_test 03:10 chris try 03:10 chris taht would have worked on the newer gits :) 03:09 chris ahh old git again 03:09 kados Usage: /usr/bin/git-merge [-n] [--no-commit] [--squash] [-s <strategy>]... <merge-message> <head> <remote>+ 03:09 kados fatal: Needed a single revision 03:09 kados git merge kados_test 03:09 chris and now if we do git log 03:08 chris with whatever changes have been made in this branch (since we branched .. in this case none :)) 03:08 chris and it will suck in and merge our changes 03:08 kados k 03:08 chris (try it out0 03:08 chris git merge kados_test 03:08 chris we could go 03:07 chris now we are in master 03:07 chris they are all still in that branch 03:07 chris nope 03:07 kados won't that wipe out the changes we made? 03:07 chris checkout -f master 03:07 kados pull? or push? 03:07 chris then we could 03:06 chris and we wanted to get pull it back into the master branch 03:06 chris now say we have finished doing our work, and we are pretty happy with it 03:06 kados sweet 03:05 chris will show the log, including your commit 03:05 chris so git log 03:05 chris cool 03:05 kados ok, commit worked now 03:05 kados yea 03:05 chris (arwen is running the stock debian stable one .. figure its handy for us to be familair with that version as well as the lastest version .. which i run on the laptop) 03:04 chris to set all that up 03:04 chris with the new versions, you can run git config 03:04 chris arwen is running an oldish version of git 03:03 chris export GIT_COMMITER_NAME="whatever" 03:03 chris export GIT_AUTHOR_NAME="whatever" 03:03 kados fatal: empty ident <jmf@arwen.metavore.com> not allowed 03:03 chris it might grumble at you on arwen when you try to commit you can get round that by exporting the variables its grizzling about 03:01 chris righto, yell out when ur ready 03:01 kados k, sec, I'm writing this down as I go 03:01 chris and git commit file 03:00 chris now edit a file 03:00 chris we branched from master, so everythign will be exactly the same at this point 03:00 chris now you are in the the kados_test branch 03:00 chris git checkout -f kados_test 02:59 chris then 02:59 chris git branch kados_test 02:59 chris first lets do 02:59 chris 2 secs 02:59 kados I'll edit it 02:59 kados I see liblime/moo 02:59 kados yea, that's master 02:59 chris ok lets do some pretend work 02:58 chris type git branch 02:58 mason_ nah, they are actual directories 02:58 chris nope those are just dirs :) 02:56 kados so there are a bunch of dirs in there, those are branches? 02:56 kados ok, great 02:53 chris cool 02:53 kados yep, seems to be working 02:52 chris the command you ran before should work 02:52 dewey I'm having an EMOTIONAL OUTBURST!! But, uh, WHY is there a WAFFLE in my PAJAMA POCKET?? 02:52 mason_ yow 02:52 chris ok back on arwen 02:52 chris that would do it 02:52 kados hehe 02:52 kados i was on denethor :-) 02:52 kados shoot 02:51 mason_ perms on the dest. dir? 02:51 kados fetch-pack from 'ssh://kados@denethor.metavore.com:/home/chris/kohaclients.git' failed. 02:51 kados fatal: unexpected EOF 02:51 kados ssh: denethor.metavore.com:: Name or service not known 02:50 chris git clone ssh://kados@denethor.metavore.com:/home/chris/kohaclients.git kohaclone 02:50 chris try 02:46 chris 2 secsc 02:46 chris im not seeing anythng in the logs on denethor for it 02:45 chris naw the user is kados 02:45 kados maybe it's jmf@ 02:45 kados yea 02:45 chris ? 02:45 chris you ran that from arwen just now 02:45 kados same error 02:45 kados git clone kados@denethor.metavore.com:/home/chris/kohaclients.git kohaclone 02:44 kados hmmm 02:43 chris t 02:43 chris i only see the one succesful attemp 02:43 kados yep 02:43 chris ie, thats were you ssh'd from and that worked eh? 02:43 chris same key on arwen? 02:43 chris odd 02:42 kados from arwen 02:42 chris you are trying that from aule eh? (or another machine) 02:41 chris hmm 02:40 kados fetch-pack from 'kados@denethor.metavore.com:/home/chris/kohaclients.git' failed. 02:40 kados fatal: unexpected EOF 02:40 kados ssh_exchange_identification: Connection closed by remote host 02:40 kados git clone gave me a error: 02:40 kados well, the shell works 02:39 kados yep 02:39 chris git clone kados@denethor.metavore.com:/home/chris/kohaclients.git whateveryourwanttocallyourclone 02:38 chris if so then 02:38 chris that work for ya? 02:37 chris k ssh kados@denethor.metavore.com 02:35 chris yep, ill do it for that now 02:35 chris right and if i was the RM id use that to set up access for ya 02:34 kados (for the denathor one) 02:34 kados mailx -s "my ssh key for git" crc@liblime.com < id_dsa.pub 02:34 kados ok, just sent you mine I think 02:32 chris then you can clone 02:32 chris so they can set you up with access (using the git shell probably, not a full shell) 02:32 chris step one, you will need to give the rm your public ssh key 02:31 kados yea, that's a good motto 02:31 kados step one is to clone the RM 02:31 chris http://photos.bigballofwax.co.nz/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=6121 02:31 chris and keeping this in mind 02:31 kados ok, so commands 02:30 kados yea, that makesw sense 02:30 chris (the devel list that is) 02:29 chris i think the key will be being communicative on the mailing list, so ppl can see whats happening and why 02:29 chris so something might pass qa just fine, but the RM might not want it in the next release so may decide not to merge it in 02:28 kados right 02:28 chris RM is at a higher level 02:28 chris ie the QA person is watching for coding practices 02:28 chris they will have to watch out for new features etc 02:27 chris ie if he/she have called a feature freeze 02:27 chris the RM manager has to wathc the push's from another angle 02:25 chris yep even 02:25 chris everyone who currently has cvs write access yet 02:25 kados I think anyway 02:25 chris id mail the pusher :) and/or the devel list 02:25 kados in that case, everyone can have push on the RM's repo 02:24 chris then if i spot something i dont like the look of, or am unsure about 02:24 kados right 02:24 chris so i can easily look at diffs 02:24 chris and have gitweb set up 02:24 chris file such that it emails me (and whoever else, maybe a mailing list) 02:23 chris is edit the .git/hooks/update 02:23 chris what id do 02:23 chris yeah every push 02:23 kados :-) 02:23 kados or push 02:23 kados then we'd have to just be sure to check every commit 02:23 chris what my plan would be 02:22 chris approved is the default state 02:22 kados right 02:22 chris id unnaprove some 02:22 chris hmm conversely 02:21 kados proposed method 02:21 kados yea, that's waht I mean 02:21 kados would you want to 'approve' all pushes? 02:21 chris and take feedback on it 02:21 chris yep, we could do a proposed method 02:20 kados and QA 02:20 kados with git 02:20 kados chris: wondering if we can pick a method for RMing 3.0 02:20 russel no worries watching a screen cast i'll be a while :-) 02:20 chris yup 02:20 kados chris: still around? 02:19 kados russel: sorry 02:15 dewey kados was last seen on #koha 35 minutes and 28 seconds ago, saying: yea [Mon Jun 25 13:40:04 2007] 02:15 chris seen kados? 02:15 chris i think he might be writing stuff up 02:14 russel kados you still there? 02:01 chris heh 02:01 russel nevermind 02:01 russel doh 02:01 russel join #koha 01:49 mason perhaps make em the same as /nzkoha/etc ? 01:49 mason could you change the perms on /koha/etc/ on arwen? 01:48 chris yep 01:48 mason hey chris, u about? 01:44 russel ahh or that might be on shelob? 01:44 russel well katipo email 01:44 russel i guess so 01:43 philip Is your email still there? 01:43 philip excellent. 01:43 russel you can nuke it 01:43 russel i have copies of that 01:43 philip I'm looking to clear a bit of space on wilbur and noticed you have over a Gig of stuff. 01:42 russel hiya philip 01:42 chris he was a minute ago 01:42 philip russ around? 01:41 philip hi 01:41 chris heya philip 01:40 russel http://www.xmlmind.com/xmleditor/ 01:40 kados yea 01:40 kados oops 01:39 russel FreeMind is some kind of Java mindmapping tool 01:39 russel ah XMLMind i think you mean 01:38 russel right 01:38 kados where it could be translated side by side 01:38 kados I think we should just throw it all in a plone site 01:37 kados then converted it to html 01:37 kados the xml 01:37 kados stephen wrote that using freemind I think 01:37 russel there are some empty sections that would be pretty easy to flesh out 01:37 russel kados: what is the easiest way to work in the 2.2 userguide? 01:33 kados hi tnb 01:33 tnb ok, just seing if people could see me ;) 01:33 dewey what's up, tnb 01:33 tnb hi 01:29 chris sweet 01:29 russel yeah onto it 01:29 chris the links in the banner bit seem wrong 01:29 russel yep 01:28 chris yo russ 01:27 chris :) 01:27 kados yea, looks good russ! 01:27 russel but at least you can use the links down the side to jump down the page 01:27 russel not too much an improvment today 01:27 russel http://www.kohadocs.org/ 01:27 kados then you can double-check I got it right :-) 01:26 kados I'm gonna write up a summary of our git conversation 01:26 kados gonna make our releases solid 01:26 kados that's great chris! 01:26 chris (easy module) 01:26 kados nice 01:26 chris finished the Date.pm test script today too 01:26 kados sweet 01:25 chris ive been tidying/shifting things into the namespace en:development 01:25 chris i shifted the unit testing one, and edited a bit 01:25 kados yea 01:25 chris http://wiki.koha.org/doku.php?id=en:development:diff_patch <-- that one? 01:25 kados cool 01:25 kados and unit testing too? 01:24 chris paul did 01:24 kados cool, did you do the diff_patch doc? 01:24 chris (back btw) 01:23 kados that shoudl be on the list I think for 3.0 01:23 chris someone will have to go look 01:23 kados heh 01:23 chris who knows anymore :) 01:23 kados guys, have we committed corporate serials to head yet? 01:22 kados look good 01:22 kados sweet russ 01:21 russel ok well that is the headers hacked a little - not super pretty but at least it is consistent 01:20 kados it's a cool little project, just needs some luving 01:19 kados some day I'll have enough to hire someone to work on kartouch full time 01:19 russel sweet as 01:19 kados yep 01:19 kados though the owner said we could take over as he's not got time to manage it 01:19 russel so i can hack the templates directly? 01:19 kados it's not our CVS 01:19 kados but yea, you can hack on it 01:19 kados somewhere :-) 01:19 russel ahh 01:19 kados yep 01:18 russel is kartouche all in cvs somewhere? 01:17 kados excellent! 01:17 mason ill come up with a plan for testing that 01:16 mason yep, sure thing 01:16 kados mason: I think paul would be willing to release 2.2.10 off of rel_2_2 if we did that 01:16 kados mason: you up for looking into that at some point? 01:15 kados mason: one thing we need to do is make sure all the changes we added to rel_2_2 the npl templates, also get made to the default templates 01:15 russel kados: super 01:15 mason yep, just ticking thru the bugs at the mo, commited a fix for BUG-807 01:14 kados hey :-) 01:14 mason ping 01:14 kados mason: so whatcha workin on? 01:14 kados russel: try that 01:13 kados sec 01:13 russel in /home/rangi/ 01:13 russel ./contribs.koha.org/html/template 01:13 russel chris when you get back - can you change the privs on this dir 01:13 kados heh 01:12 chris craft night here tonight so i have to hold the baby for 10 mins while laurel vacuums 01:12 chris brb 01:11 russel yeah will do two secs 01:11 kados russel: lemme know if that works 01:11 kados for includes dir anyway 01:11 chris cool 01:11 kados yea, just did that 01:11 chris needs a chmod -R g+w staff translate.koha.org 01:10 russel .//kartouche/includes 01:09 russel ahh i am in translate 01:09 chris remind me to fix that at some point 01:09 kados well contribs is in rangi's home dir 01:08 chris group staff? 01:08 russel says it is owned by staff though - interesting 01:08 kados russel: hmmm, sec 01:08 russel kados: nah still the same 01:08 chris yep 01:07 kados and we can change that workflow as needed 01:07 kados i figure, we can propose a workflow for the project, given our current size, etc. 01:07 chris and no longer pushes thru me 01:07 chris and she clones direct from the test sites 01:07 kados hehe 01:07 chris and then after 2 months i realise she is brilliant 01:07 kados so lets break it down further to the actual commands 01:07 kados yea, this is making sense 01:07 chris yeah she might a member of my team 01:06 kados right 01:06 chris and push them further up 01:06 kados (say) 01:06 chris so when alice pushes i can eyeball the changes 01:06 kados in this scenerio, alice 'works' for you 01:06 kados right 01:06 chris denethor -> test sites clone -> chris' clone -> alice's clone 01:06 kados russel: try now 01:06 chris before it makes it to the test sites 01:05 chris so we have alice, and i want to check her code 01:05 chris ok back to git 01:05 chris (i put russ in the staff group) 01:05 russel cheers 01:05 chris that would do it 01:05 chris kados: if you make it group writable by group staff 01:05 chris now she might just be learning 01:05 kados russel: yea, I'll check it out 01:04 chris lets call her alice 01:04 russel kados: can you please give me privs so i can edit the headers on contribs and translate sites - just want to add text to the headers 01:04 kados I think if we could explain that process to paul/hdl/toins they would appreciate it 01:04 chris then there might be a new programmer come along 01:04 kados very much so 01:04 kados yes 01:04 chris does taht make sense? 01:04 chris and when im happy with that, can push it back to denethor 01:03 chris so when i push it shows up on the test site 01:03 chris denethor -> test sites clone -> mason clone 01:03 chris denethor -> test sites clone -> chris clone 01:03 chris ideally, we would have another layer in here 01:02 chris then i either get mason to do a pull or i do a pull in his repo and the changes show up on our test site 01:02 chris i work in mine, commit .. debug test a bit .. then push 01:02 kados right 01:02 chris the dev sites run out of mason's clone (symlinked up) 01:01 chris so i work in my clone 01:01 chris but mason and I definitely have push rights back to denethor 01:01 kados arwen 01:01 kados ok, so I'm on arewn 01:01 chris :) 01:01 chris or maybe ryan has a clone of mason 01:00 chris and mason (and now ryan i think) have a clone too 01:00 chris i have a clone on arwen 01:00 kados right 01:00 kados heh 01:00 chris now it contains all the code from the koha clients who came over from katipo 00:59 chris the master of which lives on denethor 00:59 chris at liblime, we have kohaclients.git 00:59 chris eg 00:59 chris :) 00:58 chris "The ever changing Git for Dummy RM's" 00:57 chris as well all get more used to git 00:57 chris it'll be another one that will evolve 00:56 chris yep 00:56 kados right, or give some people push access 00:56 chris whatever works for them 00:56 chris or they might be more anal and want all changes as patches 00:56 chris ie they might just want to give a bunch of ppl push access to their clone 00:56 kados /Got/Git/ 00:56 chris so its really up to them to figure out what is going to work best for them 00:55 kados 'Got for Dummy RMs' :-) 00:55 chris because what they do, doesnt make a mess for the other RM 00:55 kados and I'll document this discussion and turn it into a git for dummy RMs :-) 00:55 chris the RM manager has a bit of freedom over how they will run their release 00:55 kados so lets run through a few scenerios 00:54 chris yep 00:53 kados right? 00:53 kados and tagging would also support minor bug fixes to make 2.2.10 to 2.2.10b 00:53 chris could just tag 00:53 chris if the rm wants to do it that way yep 00:53 kados s/will/should/ 00:53 kados will each minor version be a branch? 00:52 kados ahh 00:52 chris yeah they will just be branches 00:52 kados (the master) 00:52 kados and it can store 2.2 and 3.0 at the same time? 00:52 chris or they might do it on a weekly basis .. or they might do it randomly :) 00:52 chris the rm might push to the main repo above them ... maybe when they do a new release 00:51 kados right 00:51 chris work and commit locally push ... or email patches .. to the rm when they want to 00:50 chris developers clone from the rm 00:50 kados heh 00:50 chris or once per release manager :) 00:50 kados k 00:50 chris no once ever 00:50 kados once for every new version? 00:49 chris ok the rms clone from the master (once) 00:49 kados I need to re-wire my brain for git I think :-) 00:49 chris it shouldnt need any management 00:48 kados there's some fundamental piece I'm missing I think :-) 00:48 chris when rm's push to it yep 00:48 dewey kados: that doesn't look right 00:48 kados change rather? 00:48 kados does it ever changes/ 00:47 chris the master repo is more an archive/reference point 00:47 kados so who manages our master repo? 00:41 chris just think of the rm clones as linus's clones 00:40 chris yep 00:39 kados chris: http://www.wlug.org.nz/KernelDevelopmentWithGit 00:31 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> because=becomes 00:28 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> and bringing out of line installs into line because doable :) 00:27 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> its more managable 00:27 kados yea 00:27 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> means if someone wants their own set of templates (a client) 00:26 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> the beauty with git is merging between branches is very easy 00:25 kados the wiki would be good for that 00:25 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> yep 00:25 kados some kind of working document 00:25 kados definitely 00:25 kados yea 00:25 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> but i think we should have flexible/evolving rules 00:25 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> thats if i'm qa anyway :) we have to sort that out at the dev meeting 00:25 kados heh 00:24 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> the easiest way to get ur new code rejected will be if its not documented, and if there are no tests for it :) 00:23 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> yep 00:23 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> ah right 00:23 kados yea, I just mean, we should have docs that explain the process officially 00:23 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> its gonna have to on a case by case basis ... theres no getting round someone eyeballing the code 00:23 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> i thought that was pretty explicit 00:23 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> how so? 00:22 kados it'd be nice to have an explicit process for that 00:22 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> depending on the complexity 00:21 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> then maybe fix them, or just revert the change 00:21 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> and alert the rm to code that fails qa 00:21 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> and qa them 00:21 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> and will monitor changes 00:21 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> so the qa manager will have push/pull to them 00:20 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> qa needs to be done on the rm versions 00:20 kados so how does QA fit in? 00:19 kados ahh, cool 00:19 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> pull for everyone else 00:19 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> the rm version could be push/pull for trusted devs 00:19 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> yep 00:19 kados the company's Koha Classic will be push/pull for the company's devs, pull for everyone else 00:19 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> could be push too 00:19 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> could be 00:19 kados so the RM's version is pull only 00:18 kados right 00:18 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> (not like cvs) 00:18 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> that anything remote happens 00:18 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> its not until you push (or pull) 00:18 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> all commits are done locally 00:18 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> thats right 00:18 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> which is rel_2_2 is cvs and would be rel_2_2 branch in git 00:17 kados it's not always going to be identical to the 2.2.x RM clone 00:17 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> yep 00:17 kados 2.2 00:17 kados which is the LibLime customer version of koha 00:17 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> internally its up the company to decide how they want to do it 00:17 kados we have Koha Classic 00:17 kados so here's what I'm thinking 00:17 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> and pass patches around 00:17 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> or you could all just clone of rm 00:17 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> just add another developer off the developer essentially 00:16 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> yep 00:16 kados clone off the RM's clone? 00:15 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> then individuals would clone from that 00:15 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> well you would clone one 00:15 kados heh 00:15 kados so we have a company-wide 'developer'? 00:15 [K] * rangi@FreeNode talks from freenode <--- chris 00:14 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> they would just have some branches in their clone 00:14 kados hmmm 00:14 [K] <rangi@FreeNode> company is just a developer 00:14 kados chris: can you expand it a bit to show how it would work to allow a company to have their own repo too? 00:13 rach cheers russ 00:12 kados chris: sweet 00:12 chris kados: http://wiki.koha.org/doku.php?id=en:development:git_usage changed after some feedback from slef 00:11 russel anyway spot of lunch me thinks 00:10 russel so this is a means to an end 00:09 russel them 00:09 russel my aim with this exercise was that by wessing around with this page - i'll find all the docs and can start structuring 00:08 russel http://www.kohadocs.org/indexworking.html 00:07 rach ah although on the main koha sites there are already things up there 00:07 rach of the various sites 00:07 rach and we could have a line like on stuff - http://www.stuff.co.nz/ 00:06 rach yep - re the word 00:06 rach I'm thinking the news sites 00:06 russel seems nice and simple to me 00:06 russel they just do it with a word 00:06 russel https://help.ubuntu.com/ 00:06 kados rach: you volunteering to design that? :-) 00:06 rach Other organisations do it by having the line of sites at the top above the banner 00:05 rach so you might have slight differences in the headers - but that they would clearly all be the same general thing 00:04 kados so maybe reflect that in the header somehow? 00:04 kados good idea 00:02 kados (not ready yet, but some day) 00:02 kados ! http://worldmap.liblime.com/ 00:02 kados unify the look and feel I think is the goal 00:02 kados yep, I agree 00:01 russel translate.koha.org 00:01 russel contribs.koha.org 00:01 russel there are already other subsites 23:59 russel but i will add the text 23:59 russel i dont think changing the header colour is a good idea 23:57 rach so it's clear you've gone to another site in the koha family 23:56 rach OR if that's to much right now, change the header image colour, or add the word docs after the logo - like Koha | Docs 23:56 kados it'd be much easier to manage there, and we could do translations 23:56 kados russel: what do you think about putting everything in plone? 23:56 russel hence "indexworking.html" 23:56 rach but you could fake it with the design 23:55 russel eventually - but there are masses of redirects etc that need writing 23:55 russel ideally i want to move it all back into the community section 23:54 rach but russ sticking your usability hat on, now it's pretty but non obvious 23:54 rach at the moment it's ugly but obvious 23:54 russel one thing at a time :-) 23:53 rach http://www.koha.org/community/ 23:53 rach or a section 23:53 rach and have this like it's a subsite? 23:53 rach so keep the overall nav etc from the main site 23:52 rach if that's the case then you might be better to "fake" it being part of that site 23:52 rach I was wondering wether having the word docs as part of the header might be good? 23:52 kados I think the goal is to make it part of the main koha site 23:51 rach do you think it might get confusing that it looks the same as the main koha site? 23:47 kados russel: that looks great 23:33 slef anyway, see you in 8h 23:32 slef this'll teach me to joke about freenode, won't it? 23:31 chris :) 23:31 rach better than the bash though 23:31 chris lol 23:30 rach man, you hang about doing nothing for a year or so and you get the boot :-) 23:29 chris i think we need to come up with a plan of how to get a new kaitiaki .. ie how thats gonna work 23:28 slef ooh, kados already scheduled axing rach http://wiki.koha.org/doku.php?id=meetingnotes07july02 23:23 chris true 23:23 slef after all, the releases will come from the RM trees 23:23 chris k 23:23 slef and reference point 23:23 slef with Master just as a sort of archive service 23:22 slef and I'd have world talking to everyone 23:22 chris ahh good idea 23:22 slef I'd have 2.2 and 3.0 talking to each other, maybe through backporters and forwardporters 23:22 chris (im trying to do a picture to make explaining easier) 23:21 chris is that something like you would envisage it working? 23:21 chris http://wiki.koha.org/doku.php?id=en:development:git_usage 23:21 slef yeah, but I'm sleepy 23:21 slef I have some install notes 23:21 chris can i get a quick sanity check slef 23:20 chris yeah there is a bit of monkeying around to get 3.0 up and running 23:19 slef which is a bit of a blocker, I suspect 23:19 slef rach: as paul wrote "install from the CVS won't work at all" 23:19 rach how is that release coming along :-) 23:17 chris not sure 23:17 chris yeah that might be good 23:17 slef who's running kohala? 23:15 slef rach: boss us all around a bit ;-) 23:15 chris :) 23:14 chris (about the first bit) 23:14 chris yeah i agree with rach 23:14 rach I don't mind giving it up, but I personally don't know that liblime should be both current release manager and kaitiaki - but I am doing a rubbish job so happy to take suggestions 23:12 chris kaitiaki 23:12 chris :) 23:12 slef ask the man with the plan 23:10 chris i assume thats the plan eh? 23:10 chris at least if we switch over .. we wont have to do that anymore :) 23:10 chris yeah 23:09 slef git cvsimport is not light with a cvs the size of koha's, it seems 23:09 slef will fix RSN 23:09 slef hitting some sort of memory ulimit 23:09 chris bummer 23:09 slef oh, the serene koha-git tree broke around Tuesday while I was away 23:08 chris once we switch to git much easier to tidy/mv stuff around 23:08 chris isnt there just 23:07 slef ye gods there's some cruft in the misc directory 23:07 slef or we ask them what mysql thinks the webserver hostname is 23:06 slef yeah, I guess we put localhost iff mysql host is localhost and % otherwise 23:06 chris yeah 23:06 slef but I think if you use % in mysql 5, it doesn't get localhost 23:06 chris at that point have we asked them to enter the host the mysql db will live on .. i think we just assume localhost eh? 23:05 chris good point 23:05 slef chris: erm, that fix will break installs where mysql host != localhost 22:58 chris no problem 22:58 slef chris: thanks for squashing that mysql 5-v-3 bug. I'll take a quick look for other suspects 22:55 chris back 22:52 slef 1360seconds in 22:49 chris coffee time brb 22:47 chris 16% downloaded :) 22:47 slef approx 24 minutes in, I think 22:45 slef really must find my login details and add that to the web pages 22:45 slef that'll be because it's http://irc.koha.org/ 22:45 slef erm, http://www.koha.org/irc 404s 22:44 chris yeah i remember you saying something 22:44 chris heh 22:43 slef I was asleep+IRCing at the back of the room, so pretty shocked 22:43 chris oh even better 22:43 slef it's video btw 22:43 slef mostly about debian, just a quick mention of koha and a call-out to me 22:43 chris nice background listening 22:43 chris sweet 22:42 slef about an hour of talk+discussion 22:41 chris 124 meg .. that might take a little while :) 22:39 slef yep, that's bureado 22:38 slef I think that's the talk 22:38 slef http://meetings-archive.debian.net/pub/debian-meetings/2007/debconf7/low/132_Selecting_developing_and_deploying_Debian-based_IT_solutions_in_the_Venezuelan_migration_process.ogg 22:38 slef I suspect my irc relay has a problem. I'll check it RSN 22:38 slef OFTC and IRCnet are probably my most-used except for here 22:37 chris :) 22:37 slef nah, can't get a stable connection to freesplit 22:37 chris slef have you tried #koha on freenode ? 22:36 slef Moment, bitte 22:36 chris oh yeah, that would rule 22:35 slef his talk's already up online if you want to watch... shall I find the URL? 22:35 russel v cool 22:35 chris yeah thats cool :) 22:34 slef was good to meet a venezuelan kohaista(?), though 22:33 chris heh 22:33 slef hear you!" 22:33 slef "Hey guys, just because you speak Spanish, it doesn't mean we can't 22:33 slef Spanish-speakers walking into the conference accommodation at like 5am 22:33 chris yeah that day unfortunately he'd about finally gone to sleep 22:33 slef except last week 22:32 russel i would have thought the baby would have chris up before 7 anyway ;-) 22:32 chris 7am isnt too bad for me normally, just had a bad nights sleep 22:32 russel is better for us early anyway 22:32 chris i think yeah it scuppers paul 22:31 slef yeah, wouldn't later be better? Or does that scupper paul? 22:31 chris :) 22:31 chris and ill try not to sleep through the meeting this time 22:31 slef I'll drop a mail RSN 22:30 chris drop a mail to the devel list 22:30 slef should be discussing a big contract in London and probably won't be back in time 22:30 chris reckon it could be 22:30 slef Mondays are often awkward and that one is particularly so 22:30 slef is it possible to move the dev meeting to a day later, do you think? 22:29 slef just opened wrong mailbox, bit of a pain 22:29 chris im doing a bit more work on unit tests today 22:29 chris fair enough 22:29 slef so monday morning isn't too manic 22:28 slef now trying to dent project emails before sleep 22:28 slef seemed to 22:28 chris go well? 22:28 chris ahh 22:28 slef been out with the in-laws 22:27 slef sleepy sunday evening here 22:27 chris hows things over there? 22:27 chris not too bad so far, pretty quiet for a monday 22:27 slef how's it going? 22:24 chris hi slef 22:24 slef hi 22:16 mason hiya chris 22:11 chris hi mason 21:44 chris http://www.kohadocs.org/newbieguide.html <-- might or might not be useful for you too 21:44 chris have you seen the kohadocs.org site? 21:44 chris no prob 21:41 martinmorris thank you chris 21:41 martinmorris i think i need to go through the basic set up befor egoing much further 21:41 chris might be helpful too 21:41 martinmorris buried away a little there :) 21:41 chris http://www.kohadocs.org/usersguide/ch01s03.html#d0e1238 21:41 martinmorris that will save time 21:41 chris there ya go 21:41 martinmorris just what i'm after, thank you 21:41 martinmorris and i see the 'Managed in tab' option 21:40 chris thats the one 21:40 martinmorris we edit the subfields? 21:40 chris ok, so what we do 21:40 martinmorris it's on tab 1 21:40 chris ahh ok, maybe ive already shifted it on this one :) 21:40 martinmorris i don't think it is 21:40 chris ersonal name Tab:0, | Koha field: biblio.author, Not repeatable, Not mandatory, | See Also: '110a', '700a', '710a', 21:40 chris and you get a page listing all the subfields for it (now i think it might be on 0 already?) 21:40 martinmorris done that 21:39 chris ok click view subfields for 100 21:39 martinmorris done 21:39 martinmorris i've searched for tag 100 and it's showing on my page 21:39 chris and hit tag search 21:39 chris in the tag seach box, type 100 21:39 martinmorris yep 21:38 chris to tab 0 21:38 chris so lets say we want to shift 100a (personal name) 21:38 chris cool 21:38 martinmorris yes I do 21:38 chris starting with 000 21:38 chris so you have a big bunch of tags on that page too eh? 21:37 martinmorris i click on the 'MARC Structure' link and got this, yes 21:37 chris cool so you clicked marc structure sweet 21:37 martinmorris on teh previous page i do get that, yes 21:37 martinmorris oh i beg you rpardon, that's the next page 21:37 martinmorris and a tag search button with box 21:36 martinmorris drop down box to select a framework with 'default' highlighted 21:36 martinmorris i get a page headed "MARC tag structure admin for default MARC framework" 21:36 martinmorris no, i'm using the npl template though would that change it? 21:35 chris you get to a page that has default framework .. then a MARC Structure button? 21:34 chris hmm 2 secs 21:34 martinmorris not immediately seeing how i can do that here 21:33 chris ah yep that sounds right 21:33 martinmorris is that the biblio frameworks (marc structure) heading? 21:32 martinmorris ok let me take a look 21:32 chris under marc frameworks 21:32 chris yep 21:31 martinmorris is that under koha administration? 21:31 chris and the ones you dont often use leave on the other ones 21:31 chris so you can go through the framework, and put all the tags you want on tab 0 21:31 martinmorris ah, that would be useful 21:31 chris certain info displays on 21:30 chris is change which tabs (down the side 0-9) 21:30 martinmorris the old catalogue is just a text file mostly without isbn's etc etc - terrible 21:30 chris the thing you can do 21:30 chris :) 21:30 martinmorris ! 21:30 martinmorris think i need a shorter marc input page 21:30 martinmorris just trying ot get loads of stuff into my new catalogue 21:30 martinmorris 2230 :) 21:28 chris hi martin .. must be getting late for you? 21:06 chris hmm seems to have eased off again 21:02 russel yikes sarah just left for a walk 21:01 chris yikes its bucketing down here 17:52 [K] *** part FreeNode!#koha: jaron n=jason@adsl-75-42-230-182.dsl.ipltin.sbcglobal.net 17:51 martin will try the british library in the meantime 17:50 martin do i need to up the debugging level perhaps? 17:50 martin there realy is nothing ryan 17:49 martin i wouldn't bother but i have a buckletload of stuff to catalogue and if this works it would save me a lot of time 17:49 ryan martin: i think you should get something in either koha-error or apache error logs 17:48 [K] <jaron@FreeNode> hrm. 17:48 martin but i will search again 17:48 martin yes i have 17:48 [K] <jaron@FreeNode> have you searched the archives of the list? 17:48 martin fair enough 17:48 [K] <jaron@FreeNode> don't take my word for it but that doesn't look like the problem 17:46 martin 10.0.0.205 - - [24/Jun/2007:18:40:47 +0100] "POST /cgi-bin/koha/z3950/search.pl HTTP/1.1" 500 437 17:46 martin 10.0.0.205 - - [24/Jun/2007:18:40:35 +0100] "GET /intranet-tmpl/npl/en/includes/colors.css HTTP/1.1" 304 - 17:46 martin 10.0.0.205 - - [24/Jun/2007:18:40:35 +0100] "GET /intranet-tmpl/npl/en/includes/intranet.css HTTP/1.1" 304 - 17:46 martin 00 806 17:46 martin 10.0.0.205 - - [24/Jun/2007:18:40:32 +0100] "GET /cgi-bin/koha/z3950/search.pl?oldbiblionumber=&isbn=0844237639 HTTP/1.1" 2 17:46 martin only get this in the koha-access log 17:46 martin actually it doesn't matter, nothing in the error log 17:46 [K] <jaron@FreeNode> http://paste.lisp.org/new 17:45 martin that means nothing to me 17:45 [K] <jaron@FreeNode> lisppaste3 ? 17:44 martin is there somewhere polite i can paste them so i don't bother others here? 17:44 martin ah got something, let me do another search so i get some clean logs and i'll cut and paste them 17:43 martin two secs 17:42 martin thanks jaron, i was looking at teh apache log 17:42 [K] <jaron@FreeNode> /usr/local/koha/log/koha-error_log if you do a default install on linux 17:42 martin i've not found any let me have another look though 17:41 ryan can you post some error logs? 17:41 martin freshly installed this afternoon 17:41 martin yes 17:41 ryan 2.2.9? 17:40 martin and i was using USMARC then 17:40 martin but i got exactly the same problem with that template too 17:40 martin no i haven't, perhaps I should 17:40 ryan martin: did you revert to the released template ? 17:39 martin i get the list of z39.50 servers i have configured, ask to search and it comes b ack with a blank page 17:39 [K] <jaron@FreeNode> I use something I wrote myself 17:39 martin i don't even get that 17:39 [K] <jaron@FreeNode> and I just tried it for the first time in a long time and it gave me a server error. 17:38 martin ah right, can i ask what you do? 17:38 [K] <jaron@FreeNode> martin: I don't use the koha z39.50 client 17:38 martin and yours works fine...? 17:38 [K] <jaron@FreeNode> that all looks correct 17:37 martin port: 7090 Database: Voyager, syntax USMARC 17:37 martin hostname: z3950.loc.gov 17:36 martin wonder what i'm doing wrong then 17:36 [K] <jaron@FreeNode> LC will give the same results whether you ask for usmarc or marc21 preferred record syntax either one works in the client I use 17:36 martin nope, still getting my blank box 17:34 martin fair enough, let me see what happens 17:34 ryan as far as z39.50 services, differences are negligible 17:33 martin i thought they were a little bit different, OK i'll try usmarc again 17:33 ryan USMARC should work fine for LOC. 17:33 martin ah, really? 17:33 ryan USMARC and MARC21 are interchangeable. 17:33 martin i'll shut up now :) 17:32 martin i've even tried adding two extra entries <option value="MARC21">MARC21</option> and "MARC 21" and have tried changing the syntax to OPAC as i see it offers that too 17:31 martin when i do the search, the popup comes up offering me z3950.loc.gov as configured, when i asked to search it the server thinks for a second then gives me a blank box 17:31 martin so i'm wondering what to do basicaly :) 17:31 martin that, however, doesn't include a MARC21 option, and from what i can tell Net::Z3950::ZOOM doesn't mention it either 17:30 martin but poking around on the koha website i've managed to get an updated z3950servers.tmpl file which i've substituted for the default one 17:30 martin now, the default installation of koha seems to offer only USMARC and UNIMARC as options for the syntax 17:30 martin for library of congress 17:30 martin i've configured a z39.50 server on my intranet 17:29 martin hello ryan 17:29 ryan what sort of troubles ? 17:29 ryan hi martin 17:29 martin basically, if anyone sees this, i'm having trouble getting LOC records down 17:29 martin no, everybody must be asleep 17:25 martin if there's anybody awake in NZ right now i'd welcome a few mins of your time :) 17:24 martin hello, got another question about z39.50 searches in koha 16:27 ryan hello #koha 16:02 BoSchafers :-) 16:02 [K] * jaron@FreeNode would head off too if he weren't at work :( 16:01 [K] <jaron@FreeNode> sure. take care. 16:01 BoSchafers no worries...i'll head off for now...many thanks for the info...again 16:01 [K] <jaron@FreeNode> there can be. Actually I'm over on freenode right now so my messages are being relayed by the bot [K]. 16:01 BoSchafers thanks for the info 16:00 BoSchafers well my name is Bo.....hi there K :) 16:00 BoSchafers ok... 16:00 BoSchafers i see and on weekdays there are more people here? 15:59 [K] <jaron@FreeNode> many weekdays can be quiet as well :) 15:59 [K] <jaron@FreeNode> I think Sundays can be rather quiet if there's not a project day 15:59 BoSchafers i have not used irc in ten years...so its all a bit rusty 15:59 BoSchafers ah....cool....well its actually quite late here in Oz and I thought there's be a lot of *action* here 15:58 [K] <jaron@FreeNode> BoSchafers: ping? 15:58 [K] <jaron@FreeNode> if there's someone you want just put their nick in a message and they might wake up :) 15:57 [K] <jaron@FreeNode> or they're around just in case someone pings them 15:57 [K] <jaron@FreeNode> maybe reading the scrollback is easier than reading the logs 15:57 [K] <jaron@FreeNode> yeah, lots of folks are always logged in. 15:57 BoSchafers ok so are they just parked here? Names only? 15:54 [K] <jaron@FreeNode> If there's a project day today they might not be starting until noon EST. 15:53 BoSchafers Hi folks, been in here a while, no visible activity, are you all in private conversations or busy doing Koha stuff :) 15:18 BoSchafers Haven't used IRC since 1996....lets see 12:11 [K] *** join #koha@FreeNode: jaron n=jason@adsl-75-42-230-182.dsl.ipltin.sbcglobal.net