Time Nick Message 15:19 kados thd-away: you around? 15:20 kados thd-away: yay 15:20 kados thd: I'm gonna forward you a couple emails that will make you smile 15:20 thd kados: I am here 15:21 kados thd: you haven't seen my response to the Tag 880 thread yet right? 15:21 kados thd: the one where I provide a complete solution? 15:22 thd kados: I have not even seen breakfast yet 15:22 kados (I think was was held up by the mailing list because it had too many recipients, and I sent it after chris had left so he couldn't approve it) 15:22 kados hehe 15:22 kados I just sent it to you 15:22 kados you'll be pleased I think ... let me know 15:25 kados however, I have found a bug in the MARC editor 15:26 kados and my fix for it created yet another bug 15:53 thd kados: I am pleased 15:54 thd kados: I guess I should subscribe to the koha-win32 list. That seems to be where all the interesting discussion is. 15:55 kados thd: well ... it's on the koha list too ... just hasn't arrived yet 15:55 kados thd: (hasn't arrived on the win32 list either ...! 15:55 kados thd: (our mailing lists are dog slow) 15:56 thd kados: Pinyin is the only romanisation form currently approved by LC. 15:56 kados thd: who cares 15:56 kados thd: it's definitely not the only one used 15:56 kados thd: :-) 15:57 kados thd: and our approach blows LOC out of the water :-) 15:57 thd kados: interoperability and record exchange care 15:58 thd kados: Those of us with no knowledge of Chinese hope to find records with some common shared Roman access points so we can at least look at the pictures in the books. 15:59 thd kados: the pictures are always in English 15:59 thd :) 16:00 kados thd: my record had pinyin it it :-) 16:01 thd kados: Steven seems to have missed out on the Wade-Giles to Pinyin coversions done by OCLC, RLG, and whomever else. 16:01 kados thd: I also recommended that she continue with the 880 technique 16:01 kados thd: as Koha could easily support interpreting $6 at some point in the future 16:03 thd kados: Of course, it was nice to know from David Bigwood about de-transliteration programs but I want my Roman access points so I can find the pictures :) 16:04 kados yep, and those are in there 16:07 thd kados: you could have multiple transliterations even if disparaged by LC using the repeatable alternate form of fields with $6 as you suggested or almost suggested. 16:12 thd kados: Have you tried my suggestion about groups of virtual libraries for different circulation rules in your current migration? 16:13 kados no 16:13 kados thd: that's not quite what I suggested 16:13 kados thd: did you look at the second record I listed in that email? 16:15 thd kados: I only looked at the record from last night and noticed everything was fixed except that the 245 subfield order had been stuck at an incorrect order but there is no easy means of fixing that just yet. 16:16 kados thd: read the email carefully and look at both examples I provided 16:16 kados thd: you'll see with the second example the power of my idea 16:16 thd kados: meaning $6 was not the first subfield in 245 for the record from last night. 16:36 kados thd: right, subfield order is a problem 16:45 thd kados: I had understood your usage of 9XX without looking at the record, although, seeing it in practise it is a potential way to exhaust 9XX in reserving usage for transliteration where most standard fields could have $6. Yet, anything to see comments like this one must be good. "This is hot! Support for Koha is totally better than commercial products." 16:46 thd kados: Granted, that quote is from one of the already converted. Even Steven is a member of the already converted or he would not even be giving any attention to Koha. 17:04 thd kados: let me know if you and some candidate library are ever brave enough to attempt to implement my suggestion about preserving circulation rule independence from media type. The workaround seems only a little more awkward to me than the problem of needing to manage circulation rules in the first place. (I prefer non-circulating libraries with no theft problem.) My suggested workaround merely puts the circulation rules in direct view when 17:06 thd creating items rather than disguising them as a media type that the never were. 17:19 thd kados: I do not understand why the order of subfields changes for some fields and not others except that paul added some new dirty code in Biblo.pm to treat some fields like title differently for overcoming bugs he was sometimes seeing and he had failed to trace and squash at their origin. 17:19 kados thd: there's lots of dirty code in Biblio.pm 17:19 kados thd: I'm actually doing some cleaning right now 17:19 kados thd: and fixing that problem is definitely on my list before 2.2.6 17:20 kados thd: i want a bug-free MARC editor that doesn't save blank fields and allows for subfield repeatability 17:20 thd kados: However, that really makes it seem that this problem is related to the original problem that paul had failed to trace. 17:35 thd kados: sometime during the period after the 2.2.4 release to the 2.2.5 release some code was changed in Biblio.pm that may be the common source of multiple problems. 17:58 thd kados: nevermind, I may have made a general assertion that is liable to be true in any case; but one partial fix I had committed to HEAD during 2.2.4 but not committed to rel_2_2 until after 2.2.5 never worked any better under 2.2.4 because it was always only a partial fix. 20:44 kados chris: looks like I may have broken addbiblio.pl in HEAD too :/ 20:44 kados chris: for some reason, I can find a biblio in cataloging but when I go to edit it, it comes up blank 20:48 kados also, this is going to sound crazy, but I think zebra is actually slower than mysql at importing :-) 20:49 chris doesnt sound crazy at all 20:49 chris im well prepared to believe that 20:49 kados right 20:50 kados well I like my commits today, but either hdl or I broke modifying items 20:50 chris right, cos it was working the other day 20:50 kados (I see he moved somethings around, so I'm not so sure it was me after all) :-) 20:51 kados I added the $Zconn to addbiblio when it calls MODaddbiblioitem 20:51 kados or whatever it's called :-) 20:51 chris so the script is making the connection? rather than i the module? 20:52 kados NEWmodbiblio actually 20:52 kados is that wrong? 20:52 chris kinda 20:52 chris well to my thinking anyway 20:53 kados k ... where should the $Zconn get set then? 20:53 chris the scripts should need to know 20:53 chris or care where/how the data is stored 20:53 chris should=shouldnt 20:53 kados not inside z3950_extended_services 20:53 kados cause presumably you want 1 conn to many commits 20:54 kados and z3950_extended_services only handles one thing at a time 20:54 kados (that makes sense) 20:54 chris i dont like/want to see any $dbh or $Zconn in the scripts 20:54 kados ok ... so how do they get set then? 20:54 chris in modules 20:55 kados at the top of the module? 20:55 kados will that cover any use of it in the module? 20:55 chris could do, or just in whatever function needs them 20:55 chris if you do it right, it wont make a new connection unless it needs to 20:55 kados hmmm 20:56 chris littering connections around in scripts = horrible horrible mess under mod_perl 20:56 kados what do you mean by 'right'? 20:56 kados I think the only Zconn in a script is in addbiblio.pl 20:56 chris yep, but i dont see why it needs to be 20:57 kados ok 20:57 kados I'll try without it 20:57 kados well, first I'll try bulkmarcimport without it 20:57 kados (notice that addbiblio has a dbh :-)) 20:57 chris yes i dont like that either 20:58 chris scripts should handle input and output 20:58 chris all the logic should be in modules 20:58 kados hmmm ... this foils my z3950_extended_services function 20:58 kados so where does Zconn get set in Biblio.pm? 20:58 kados at the top? 20:58 chris just open it in the function you need it in 20:59 chris if its using C4::Context its not going to open a new one 20:59 chris just give you an already open one 20:59 kados ok, I"ll try that 21:00 chris if we have logic in the scripts .. it gets much trickier if we want to build a gtk version .. or an ajax version etc 21:00 chris if all the logic is in modules, then it makes changing interfaces a lot easier 21:01 chris i dont like all these subs in addbiblio.pl either 21:02 chris in Biblio.pm 21:03 chris you could have 21:03 chris our $Zconn=C4::Context->Zconn; 21:03 chris and then use that throughout the module 21:03 chris not having to pass it round 21:03 chris that might be the nicest way to do it 21:04 kados yea, just adding it to the z3950_extended_services gives me: 21:04 kados ZOOM error 109 "Database unavailable" (addinfo: "kohatest") from diag-set 'Bib-1' 21:05 kados except within z3950_extended_services 21:06 kados hmmm 21:06 kados so if I use the 'our', I'm probably gonna want all those $Zconn's back in there, eh? 21:06 chris probably yep :) 21:06 kados damn :-) 21:06 chris i actually think its better not to 21:07 chris i think its much better to request a connection when we need it 21:07 kados ok 21:07 chris rather than passing one around 21:07 chris passing one around means we have to check it each time before we use it anyway 21:07 kados ok, so I'll commit this, though it's not working 21:07 kados so you can have a look 21:07 chris cool 21:08 chris im gonna head out for a bit, but sunday evening tv sucks so ill have a look then 21:08 kados hehe 21:08 kados k ... thx 21:13 chris oh before i go, well done on the framework stuff yesterday 21:13 chris ill do a blog entry on it tonight 21:25 kados thanks :-) 22:26 kados thd: whenever you're around ... you should know that as of version .8 of MARC::File::XML, conversion from MARC-8 to UTF-8 is automatic 22:27 kados thd: we have Mike Rylander from PINES to thank for that 22:27 kados chris: when you start watching sun evening tv, let me know, I need a table def for that missing table in Fines.pm if possible 22:52 kados that would cause a stir :-) 22:56 thd kados: well thank you Mike Rylander 22:57 thd kados: I assume Mike has not addressed the same issue for UNIMARC encodings which are not MARC-8 22:59 thd kados: what was meant in your humorous comment relating to Ebay? I missed the context. 23:00 thd kados: OK very funny, I understand now. :)