Time  Nick    Message
10:51 thd     however, I have not been able to connect yet to confirm that speculation for myself.
10:50 thd     osmoze, hdl: BNF must be using 8859-15 to transmit despite the encoding in the records claiming ISO 5426.
10:47 thd     hdl: As you had said yesterday hdl, BNF supports 8859-15.
10:46 thd     osmoze, hdl: however, I have a guess about why you have no ISO 5426 problems with your records.
10:44 thd     hdl: I will have to look at my connection problem further.
10:43 thd     hdl: I was up very late last night looking at my code to find some simple authentication syntax error while receiving 'init rejected' messages from BNF :(
10:39 thd     hello hdl
09:49 osmoze  bonne soirée
09:42 osmoze  et apparement ca marche, maintenant je regrde l aide sur cpan pour l utilisation
09:42 osmoze  perl -MCPAN -e 'install "PHP"'
09:41 osmoze  j ai fait un
09:41 osmoze  module php pour perl
09:41 osmoze  hdl>
09:41 hdl     Mais je vais essayer de trouver pourquoi.
09:41 hdl     Certainement le Template n'est pas réinterprété.
09:40 hdl     osmoze : il semblerait que le script php ne soit pas interprété.
09:31 osmoze  hdl>  tout essayer dans le template, rien n y fait...Peut etre faut il un module perl particulier
09:29 hdl     Un chose est sûre, c'est qu'il faut que cela soit intégré au template.
09:25 hdl     Peut-être un script language="php" serait-il plus approprié.
09:24 hdl     osmoze : Normalement, il faut au moi <?php ?>
09:15 osmoze  xxx</script>
09:15 osmoze  <script language="php">
09:15 osmoze  a moins que je rajoute un :
09:13 osmoze  je me demande si un print"<? xxx ?>" fonctionnerai ou pas
09:13 osmoze  si, mais dans le tmpl, les deux cas : avec ouverture de balise <? ?> et sans, c est pareil
09:12 hdl     Je me pose des questions.
09:12 osmoze  (phpmyadmin par exemple )
09:12 osmoze  j utilise d autre site dessus
09:12 hdl     Ne faudrait-il pas indiquer que c'est un script php pour que Apache le traite comme tel ?
09:12 osmoze  oui ^^
09:11 hdl     As-tu activer le php sur ta machine ?
09:10 osmoze  de plus, sur la page d accueil de l opac, je veux rajouter un script aussi pour la securité (script php de log d ip etc etc)
09:10 osmoze  pour le redimensionnement
09:09 osmoze  hdl>  je mets le script dans le tmpl ou le pl ? en fait, j ai rajouter les photos des borrowers, mais je me penche sur deux choses : une page pour l upload des photos avec correspondance (exemple, upload photo avec n°de carte) et ensuite, pour l affichage, je voulais passer par un script qui utilise image magick, j ai trouver les commande pour utiliser le image::imagick de perl, mais comme je connais pas perle
09:00 hdl     osmoze :Mais pour pouvoir t'aider efficacement, il faudrait que tu me décrives ton problème
09:00 hdl     hi thd. I am here.
08:59 hdl     osmoze :En fait, normalement, si tu mets simplement le script php dans la page, ça devrait marcher
08:56 hdl     osmoze : je n'avais pas vu ce que tu demandais.
06:33 osmoze  un indice ?
06:33 osmoze  j ai essayer d ouvrir une balise php dans le tmpl mais c est pas ca ^^
06:32 osmoze  hdl : en fait, je voudrais rajouter un tout petit script php dans une des pages
05:10 hdl     Mieux vaut réserver cela à un portail d'entrée.
05:10 hdl     Alors attention aux futures mises à jour.
05:10 hdl     osmoze : Pourquoi pas. Mais ce ne sont pas des templates standards !!!!
03:11 osmoze  sais tu si on peux rajouter du php a l interieur d une page ?
03:10 hdl     Salut Osmoze
03:08 osmoze  bonjour hdl
02:35 osmoze  ok, i ve modified the borrowers_stats.pl & tmpl
02:23 osmoze  do you know if it's possible to count th number of borrowers by site ?
01:38 osmoze  good morning koha
23:44 ambrose thd: unfortunately no. i should be less lazy and do my testing....
23:31 thd     ambrose: do you know anything more about your problem such as whether the character data was being manually entered or copy catalogued?
23:27 ambrose thd: i don't know why the corruption would be related to Windows specific characters, but that is my observation
23:07 thd     unless I do multibyte trading, although, I suspect that I would still lack the glyph.
23:05 thd     ambrose: I can have Greek but I have to trade in dollars, pounds, or euros :)
23:01 thd     ambrose: I have no glyph for the drachma, \xa5 in ISO 8859-7, on my fully encoded Debian system.  It resembles the characters with no glyphs on your image.
22:21 thd     ambrose: Why would your corruption issue be related to Windows specific characters such as stupid quotes?
22:04 thd     ambrose: For some reason the French do not have to work around that for ISO 5426 even though their problem should be the same with multibyte accented characters.
22:02 thd     ambrose: owen told me today that NPL removes any double byte MARC-8 accented character it finds from copy catalogued sources and substitutes the single byte UTF-7 equivalent.
22:00 thd     ambrose: They are difficult to work with because they are not supported by the major character set conversion functions.
21:58 thd     ambrose: ISO 5426 and MARC-8 are special character sets for libraries.
21:57 ambrose oh
21:57 ambrose thd: i don't know anything about iso 5426, but both iso 2022 and 8859 character sets won't touch 0x80-0x9f
21:57 thd     ambrose: They seem not to have multibyte characters where the records themselves say that they should.
21:57 ambrose thd: if i am correct that corruption only affects windows-1252-specific bytes (i.e., 0x80-0x9f), then it is probably natural for iso character sets (other than 10646) to have no problems
21:55 thd     ambrose: I had an interesting discussion with hdl and osmoze earlier today where it seems they have no problems with ISO 5426 character sets in their UNIMARC records even though I would have expected to see a problem for all accented characters being multibyte.
21:53 Genji   kados: still there?
21:50 ambrose thd: yes, but i haven't looked at my problem
21:49 thd     ambrose: are you still awake?
21:42 kados   I'll try to write a message to koha-devel tomorrow explaining my ideas
21:41 kados   I've really got to get to bed ;-)
21:35 Genji   ?
21:34 Genji   kados: but as for the whole unified scheme... i don't understand it.
21:34 Genji   kados: well.. i can certainly do the borrower categories permission bit.
21:18 kados   Genji: that's a bit of what I mean ... not everything though ;-)
21:18 kados   Genji: http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/message.php?msg_id=12324431
21:14 kados   but I haven't had a chance ... been so busy
21:14 kados   yea ... I need to write up an explaination and post it to koha-devel
21:14 Genji   not sure i get it.
21:14 kados   I can't find that post btw
21:13 kados   and inheritence rules
21:13 kados   library systems, consortiums, branches, users, items, etc.
21:12 kados   Genji: right ... so imagine a single set of permissions for every object
21:11 Genji   unified permissions?
21:08 kados   Gen	I'll see if I can dig it up
21:08 kados   Genji: it might be nice to unify all permissions in Koha
21:08 Genji   not yet. where is it?
21:08 kados   Genji: did you see my post about an arbitrary tree for branch relationships?
21:07 kados   Genji: while you're at it ...
21:07 kados   Genji: exactly
21:06 Genji   kados: right. so.. if the user has flags set, those flags set precidence against the catagory flags?
21:06 kados   Genji: not quite as simple ;-)
21:06 kados   Genji: so you'd want an inheritence scheme
21:06 kados   Genji: the problem is that you'd want to make sure you didn't override the _actual_ permissions set for individual users
21:06 Genji   kados: Thats basically what i said. Forgot the term though.
21:05 kados   Genji: from each category ... a way to set the default permissions for borrowers in that category
21:05 kados   Genji: borrower categories: cgi-bin/koha/admin/categorie.pl
21:04 Genji   kados: so, you want a "modify flags" button on the borrower group add/modify page, right?
21:03 Genji   kados: the flags are just 1's and 0's in a string of int(11) so should be easy to implement your request.
20:59 kados   Genji: exactly
20:50 Genji   kados: like, the permissions listed in modify flags, in borrowers section?
20:48 kados   Genji: well ... it would be neat to be able to specify a default set of permissions based on the borrower category
20:48 Genji   kados: you mean a flag template?
20:47 Genji   kados: hmm... interesting idea.....
20:08 kados   is there any way to make a 'patron category' automatically have a 'permissions' level?
20:07 kados   chris: you about? got a quick borrower permissions question
17:42 chris   havent had a chance yet sorry genji
17:41 Genji   hey chris, had a look at my picture bit?
17:19 chris   heya jo
17:18 Jo      left message for you on hlt
17:17 Jo      are you about?
17:17 Jo      Hey Chris.
16:44 Genji   morning all.
16:18 osmoze  ou usmarc aussi
16:16 osmoze  hdl, peut on consulter un server z3950 en marc21 si on est en unimarc ?
15:21 osmoze  thd-away, i found another for your test : http://www.bibli.ens-cachan.fr/catweb/profil_z3950.htm
15:14 thd     hdl; LC has had separate databases for in process record with only cataloguing in publication information and also PREMARC for records retrospectively converted to MARC from catalogue cards..
15:14 osmoze  +g
15:14 osmoze  hdl, opale is the same cataloue ?
15:12 thd     hdl; LC has had multiple databases that only gradually decrease in number.
15:12 osmoze  (and google)
15:11 hdl     Is there ?
15:11 osmoze  there is no database only for audio ? (cd and other) ?
15:11 hdl     Do you have a problem ?
15:11 osmoze  opale ?
15:11 hdl     Why ?
15:11 hdl     No.
15:10 thd     hdl: Does BnF have other databases?
15:05 hdl     Record syntax :   UNIMARC
15:05 hdl     Version :   2
15:05 hdl     Element set :     F
15:05 hdl     Password :  Z3950_BNF
15:05 hdl     User :            Z3950
15:05 hdl     Database name :   TOUT
15:05 hdl     Database :  Catalogue Bn-Opale plus
15:05 hdl     Port :            2211
15:05 hdl     Server :    z3950.bnf.fr
15:03 thd     hdl: yes that may help/
15:02 hdl     Do you want BNF Z3950 IDs ?
15:02 thd     hdl: I will have to experiment with directly gathering some French UNIMARC records with accents from BnF myself and see what I find encoded to explore the ISO 5426 issue further.
14:58 osmoze  thd, hum...oki oki, business is business
14:57 hdl     osmoze : fmd.internet est fr.misc.droit.internet : c'est un forum français.
14:56 thd     osmoze: You need an agreement with a publishers association like the one that Amazon would have made where either you can use the images liberally at your library or you can provide a compensating link to buy the material as Amazon requires.
14:55 osmoze  hdl, logique effectivement :)
14:55 hdl     Thx owen.
14:55 hdl     <img src="/images/<!-- TMPL_VAR name="borrowernumber" -->.jpg" />
14:54 thd     osmoze: That would be the law everywhere that I know.
14:54 osmoze  hdl, apparement c est bien plus interessant la photo des livres que des lecteurs
14:52 osmoze  thd, yes, brcause the manager of my library say that it's not possible in france to have book's picture
14:52 hdl     Ensuite, dans les template, tu ajoute la ligne :
14:52 hdl     Et tu enregistres les images avec identifiant.jpg
14:51 hdl     En fait, il suffit de faire un répertoire image dans les includes par exemple, ou au même niveau.
14:51 osmoze  c est ?
14:51 hdl     Mais d'un point de vue juridique : Pourquoi ne pas poser la question sur fmd.internet
14:50 osmoze  des lecteurs ?
14:49 hdl     techniquement : Tu peux utiliser la solution utilisée par la NPL pour avoir les photos des lecteurs. Elle me semble fort intéressante.
14:49 osmoze  a cause des droits
14:49 osmoze  ma biliothecaire me dit que c est pas faisable
14:48 osmoze  je pense pas, mais mieux vaut partir du debut quand on a une idée :)
14:47 hdl     J'avoue que je ne sais pas.
14:47 hdl     En ce qui concerne la possibilité de faire cela par toi-même....
14:47 osmoze  yes thd
14:47 hdl     osmoze : Bonne question. En fait, amazon te laisse faire cela si tu fait un lien vers eux.
14:46 thd     osmoze: Are you asking about the copyright of cover images?
14:46 hdl     thd : hopefully.
14:42 osmoze  hdl, sais tu si en france on peux mettre les photos des livres lors des recherches (au niveau des droits )
14:42 thd     hdl: The French ones at least have the correct keyboard for constructing accents and know how to use it even if some accented characters may be more awkward to type than ASCII, ISO 646
14:40 hdl     :)
14:40 hdl     And french too.
14:39 thd     hdl: Well at least the English users probably prefer non-accent sensitive search by default.
14:38 hdl     yes.
14:36 thd     hdl: Do your other installations all have non-accent sensitive search?
14:34 hdl     accent-sensitive search.
14:34 thd     hdl: Which searching behaviour was obtained without assistance?
14:33 hdl     How he installed the stuff.
14:33 hdl     What he did before.
14:33 hdl     we don't know what machine he has.
14:33 hdl     It is someone who did install without assistance.
14:32 thd     hdl: An OS setup issue?
14:31 thd     hdl: How would you account for the accent searching anomaly?
14:29 thd     hdl: Also, Is there a Koha or MySQL version that distinguishes those libraries that have an accent sensitive search from those that do not?
14:28 hdl     But maybe practise is different.
14:28 hdl     thd : you should be right in theory.
14:26 thd     for UNIMARC.
14:25 thd     hdl: I do not quite follow what you mean by MARC::Record itself using a certain type of character.  Character encoding is supposed to be defined in the record itself such as 100 $a/26-29
14:22 thd     hdl: But if you start with one record format such as MARC 21 breeding.pl will not convert to the other UNIMARC format will it?
14:20 hdl     And this has some kind of charset code underneath.
14:20 hdl     With breeding.pl, when you import MARC records, you can choose US-MARC or UNIMARC.
14:19 thd     hdl: What type of MARC conversion?
14:19 hdl     It seems that MARC::Record uses certain type of character.*
14:18 hdl     hidden code is MARC conversion.
14:18 hdl     Some would find search accent-sensitive, others donot.
14:17 thd     hdl: what problems do you have searching for accents?
14:17 thd     hdl: And there is no code hidden somewhere I did not find in Koha to convert character sets?
14:16 hdl     But, some asked a question about accents and it seems that when searching with accents, some have problems that others don't.
14:15 hdl     for SURE.
14:15 hdl     They use Koha Cataloguing.
14:15 hdl     No.
14:14 thd     hdl: Does that mean you cannot answer now about what system are your libraries using for copy cataloguing?  The Koha editor or otherwise?
14:12 thd     hdl: So your baby is allowed to sleep.
14:11 hdl     But My computer is in the baby's room
14:11 hdl     thd : he he :)
14:11 thd     hdl: If you have a baby, then you are not even allowed to sleep :)
14:10 hdl     I have a baby... And that's why :)
14:09 hdl     no.
13:59 thd     hdl: Is it too late for you again today? :)
13:57 thd     hdl: what system are your libraries using for copy cataloguing.  Are they copy cataloguing outside the Koha or within the Koha record editor?
13:54 thd     hdl: given part of what you said, I would expect that your libraries would have similar problems to NPL with characters containing diacritical marks unless some system was automatically correcting for this and converting to UTF-7.
13:48 thd     hdl: look at Character set standardisation: migration strategies to unicode for national bibliographic databases : final technical report of the CHASE Project http://www.kb.nl/gabriel/projects/pages/cobra/chase.pdf
13:39 thd     hdl: \xC2 is for the acute accent and \x65 is for the 'e'
13:37 thd     hdl: Therefore \xC2\x65 would be 'é'
13:33 thd     hdl: the first non-spacing character would be for the ISO 5426 diacritical mark and the second character would be for the accented ISO 646 letter.
13:31 thd     hdl: If my information is correct ISO 5426 gives multibyte characters for characters with accents.
13:29 thd     hdl: osmoze had 100 $a/27-29 showing use of ISO 5426 for his records.
13:27 thd     hdl: ISO 5426 is really what I am asking about
13:27 thd     hdl: 8859 is not defined for UNIMARC that I can see.
13:23 hdl     None of our cuestomers had problems with import.
13:22 hdl     BNF's z3950 server uses UNIMARC. so it should be ISO8859-15 charset or ISO646 or ISO-5426
13:17 hdl     striving to answer your question.
13:16 thd     hello hdl
12:37 thd     hdl: with answers to all the world's problems?
12:37 osmoze  bye
12:37 osmoze  dinner for me
12:37 osmoze  (meme en francais...)
12:37 osmoze  interdis
12:37 osmoze  hdl, je t inderdit de regarder toutes mes fautes d'anglais ^^
12:36 thd     yes hdl
12:36 hdl     thd : excuse me.
12:36 thd     osmoze: scan would be possible.  Then you would be doing something like the latest borrower images addition.
12:36 osmoze  so, whe are a little library, and that's be simply to scan book and cd, because, for exemple, a lot of books are not in amazon
12:33 thd     osmoze: You need your own developers token from Amazon and you would need to adjust the scripts for amazon,fr.
12:32 osmoze  ok, i ll see tomorrow :) thanks a lot
12:32 thd     osmoze: I think the feature is documented in detail.pl if your installation is up to date.
12:31 osmoze  but, if i want to scan, it's possible ?
12:31 osmoze  hum, ok
12:31 thd     osmoze: kados wrote the scripts for using Amazon web services to obtain book cover images and text.
12:30 osmoze  pics
12:30 osmoze  yes, but some book have pic
12:29 thd     osmoze: http://search.athenscounty.lib.oh.us/ is the OPAC
12:28 osmoze  a great website :)
12:27 osmoze  there is a lot of idea for my library
12:27 osmoze  how adding pics of book in koha ?
12:26 osmoze  how, i discover the nelsonville website
12:26 thd     hdl: Do the cataloguers where you are do anything similar to copy catalogued records from BnF for example?
12:25 thd     hdl: NPL replaces the multibyte representations of 'é' as two bytes with the UTF-7 'é' as one byte.
12:23 thd     hdl: The cataloguers at NPL overwrite the multibyte MARC-8 character set entities for characters with diacritical marks when they have been using properly encoded Library of Congress records for cataloguing.
12:17 thd     hdl: It would still be possible to store multibyte character sets as latin1_swedish.  They would simply not be indexed correctly.
12:15 thd     hello hdl
12:12 hdl     inside the database, it is latin1_swedish for mysql
12:08 hdl     hi thd
12:03 thd     osmoze: My question is whether 'é' for example is stored as one byte or two in your records.
12:01 thd     osmoze: diacritical marks are the marks for characters that the Americans left out of the standard for computing when they defined ASCII to include 'e' but not 'é'.